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Post by tnr9 on Nov 16, 2018 4:08:03 GMT
I wonder if anyone else relates...I think one of the key "loses" I feel which is driving jealousy and envy...is this feeling that I have lost choices with B. This is not a rational, mature place so I am trying to find the appropriate words...but I am struggling with that so I will just write out the picture in my head:
Girl R...she knows him in Fuel, he has bonded with her, they hang out at Fuel and at lunch afterwards, along with going to occational events together in a group. All possibilities are open to her...she can date him, she can just remain a friend, she could possibly be the one.
Me....I "had my chance" and "blew it" (mind you, I am not talking adult here....trying to describe the squishy feelings). I can't hang out with B in the community, I can't hang out with him at lunch and I can't go to events with him....the thought of these make me "freeze" with fear because I am scared of my own feelings for him and how they don't match with his towards me (even trying to describe this makes me feel ill in my stomache). So it feels like defeat....and I end up feeling defective (again, not in the adult space...just trying to give voice to the feelings) and wishing I had the choices that R has.
Does anyone know how to release this? It has been really haunting me....I know it ties to feelings of scarcity and competition and not measuring up...but not 100% certain where the whole "loss of choices" comes from and this part is too young to explain it...she just cowers when I ask.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 16, 2018 4:31:29 GMT
Also...just want to thank everyone who steps into the pool of ick with me.....I think this is the first time I am really trying to understand the underlying root to things....and it is not always pretty.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2018 4:45:24 GMT
I have not felt this so this is just a stab I the dark. Perhaps you are wishing or wanting a fresh start with B, a "do over"? Ultimately, I think you are stuck in the process of letting go. The theme of my ex was a ton of regret. I think he was so stuck in his own regret and it kept him stuck. He said he was stuck on me, but what I saw was that he was stuck on regret, which I think is far stronger. You may be stuck on something other than B...hurt, regret, the happy ending, only you kmow...
The answer lies in releasing him completely and filling your own emotional space, but I don't know how you do that. I think the process is different for you than me.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 16, 2018 5:08:12 GMT
I have not felt this so this is just a stab I the dark. Perhaps you are wishing or wanting a fresh start with B, a "do over"? Ultimately, I think you are stuck in the process of letting go. The theme of my ex was a ton of regret. I think he was so stuck in his own regret and it kept him stuck. He said he was stuck on me, but what I saw was that he was stuck on regret, which I think is far stronger. You may be stuck on something other than B...hurt, regret, the happy ending, only you kmow... The answer lies in releasing him completely and filling your own emotional space, but I don't know how you do that. I think the process is different for you than me. Yeh..I don't know either Mary.....I do know that under all of this that I do truly care and love him...but the releasing bit is not going the way I wanted it to...even with the new access to logic. So I am trying to relate, be curious and ask questions differently then before because what I don't want is to repeat this pattern. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 16, 2018 12:05:10 GMT
I wonder if anyone else relates...I think one of the key "loses" I feel which is driving jealousy and envy...is this feeling that I have lost choices with B. This is not a rational, mature place so I am trying to find the appropriate words...but I am struggling with that so I will just write out the picture in my head: Girl R...she knows him in Fuel, he has bonded with her, they hang out at Fuel and at lunch afterwards, along with going to occational events together in a group. All possibilities are open to her...she can date him, she can just remain a friend, she could possibly be the one. Me....I "had my chance" and "blew it" (mind you, I am not talking adult here....trying to describe the squishy feelings). I can't hang out with B in the community, I can't hang out with him at lunch and I can't go to events with him....the thought of these make me "freeze" with fear because I am scared of my own feelings for him and how they don't match with his towards me (even trying to describe this makes me feel ill in my stomache). So it feels like defeat....and I end up feeling defective (again, not in the adult space...just trying to give voice to the feelings) and wishing I had the choices that R has. Does anyone know how to release this? It has been really haunting me....I know it ties to feelings of scarcity and competition and not measuring up...but not 100% certain where the whole "loss of choices" comes from and this part is too young to explain it...she just cowers when I ask. IMHO, only by realizing how many possibilities are OPEN to you. How many guys you can date, or how many can just remain your friends, for how many you could possibly be the one. You are stuck at this because perhaps you're rejecting the possibility that there's life after B, maybe you think it was your "peak" and nothing good will happen without or after him, which isn't true. You can only make it so. You're repressing a lot of things and they come out as jealousy and envy. Is there a possibility you could pack your things, cut yourself from everything and travel for a few weeks or even longer? Meet new, very different people, experience things you've never experienced? |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 16, 2018 12:12:18 GMT
I wonder if anyone else relates...I think one of the key "loses" I feel which is driving jealousy and envy...is this feeling that I have lost choices with B. This is not a rational, mature place so I am trying to find the appropriate words...but I am struggling with that so I will just write out the picture in my head: Girl R...she knows him in Fuel, he has bonded with her, they hang out at Fuel and at lunch afterwards, along with going to occational events together in a group. All possibilities are open to her...she can date him, she can just remain a friend, she could possibly be the one. Me....I "had my chance" and "blew it" (mind you, I am not talking adult here....trying to describe the squishy feelings). I can't hang out with B in the community, I can't hang out with him at lunch and I can't go to events with him....the thought of these make me "freeze" with fear because I am scared of my own feelings for him and how they don't match with his towards me (even trying to describe this makes me feel ill in my stomache). So it feels like defeat....and I end up feeling defective (again, not in the adult space...just trying to give voice to the feelings) and wishing I had the choices that R has. Does anyone know how to release this? It has been really haunting me....I know it ties to feelings of scarcity and competition and not measuring up...but not 100% certain where the whole "loss of choices" comes from and this part is too young to explain it...she just cowers when I ask. IMHO, only by realizing how many possibilities are OPEN to you. How many guys you can date, or how many can just remain your friends, for how many you could possibly be the one. You are stuck at this because perhaps you're rejecting the possibility that there's life after B, that it was your "peak" and nothing good will happen without or after him, which isn't true. You can only make it so. You're repressing a lot of things and they come out as jealousy and envy. Is there a possibility you could pack your things, cut yourself from everything and travel for a few weeks or even longer? Meet new, very different people, experience things you've never experienced? Hey Christie...good points...because you are right...there are a lot of open possibilities that it seems I am not being truly open to. I can't takes weeks off from my job at the moment.....but I do intend to go on a week long travel at the end of March. Destination is TBD. Again...I think this is a childhood pattern that goes deeper than B....it may even go into my family dymanics but it only makes a true appearance regarding B. I am trying to heal that deeper pattern so I don't recreate it with another man. |
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Post by leavethelighton on Nov 17, 2018 1:26:32 GMT
I think your use of the word "choices" is interesting here. How do you know she has all those choices? That would imply he was offering her all those possibilities, and chances are, he isn't.
While she may theoretically have those possibilities, there is really no way to know from the outside what she does or doesn't have or the quality of their relationship.
You're mourning the loss of a dream and loss is hard, but maybe remind yourself that there's no way to know what R. really has or what the trajectory of their relationship will be. Try to focus more on yourself and not on their relationship. I know easier said than done, but your feelings right now are coming from making all these assumptions that may or may not be true.
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 17, 2018 2:19:17 GMT
I think your use of the word "choices" is interesting here. How do you know she has all those choices? That would imply he was offering her all those possibilities, and chances are, he isn't. While she may theoretically have those possibilities, there is really no way to know from the outside what she does or doesn't have or the quality of their relationship. You're mourning the loss of a dream and loss is hard, but maybe remind yourself that there's no way to know what R. really has or what the trajectory of their relationship will be. Try to focus more on yourself and not on their relationship. I know easier said than done, but your feelings right now are coming from making all these assumptions that may or may not be true. Yeh...I thought the choices apspect is interesting...I did not want to lose sight of it because I think there is some tie back to my past...but I don't really grasp it. B has said to me that he likes R which gets interpreted by me as interest and along with interest comes jealousy and all those choices.....I just don't have a good angle on how to work on this right now. |
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Post by alexandra on Nov 18, 2018 4:51:19 GMT
tnr9, go deeper on choices. Do you feel he took the choice away from you? Maybe that mirrors parents telling you how you felt or pushing their expectations on you to the point that you couldn't have any. Do you feel she has choices you weren't good enough to earn? Did you have other kids or siblings around you felt got something from your adult attachment figures that you couldn't have? Something else maybe?
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 18, 2018 5:08:15 GMT
tnr9 , go deeper on choices. Do you feel he took the choice away from you? Maybe that mirrors parents telling you how you felt or pushing their expectations on you to the point that you couldn't have any. Do you feel she has choices you weren't good enough to earn? Did you have other kids or siblings around you felt got something from your adult attachment figures that you couldn't have? Something else maybe? Hey alexandra...good questions. I don't think it is the first one because it feel like my loss...that I am to blame for the loss of choices....so I think it is actually number 2....I have 2 younger brothers, both are very smart. I did feel like I lost out a lot for the positive attention odd my parents...both my mom and dad seemed to prefer my brothers....ok...it wasn't "seemed" it "was" that they preferred my brothers because my brothers were smart, they were together, they were not overly emotional, they did not cause my mom and dad stress, they did not embarrass my parents...I could go on but you get my drift. |
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Post by alexandra on Nov 18, 2018 5:27:38 GMT
tnr9 , go deeper on choices. Do you feel he took the choice away from you? Maybe that mirrors parents telling you how you felt or pushing their expectations on you to the point that you couldn't have any. Do you feel she has choices you weren't good enough to earn? Did you have other kids or siblings around you felt got something from your adult attachment figures that you couldn't have? Something else maybe? Hey alexandra...good questions. I don't think it is the first one because it feel like my loss...that I am to blame for the loss of choices....so I think it is actually number 2....I have 2 younger brothers, both are very smart. I did feel like I lost out a lot for the positive attention odd my parents...both my mom and dad seemed to prefer my brothers....ok...it wasn't "seemed" it "was" that they preferred my brothers because my brothers were smart, they were together, they were not overly emotional, they did not cause my mom and dad stress, they did not embarrass my parents...I could go on but you get my drift. You've talked about how there was narcissism in one of your parents before, so I'm going to flip your script. They preferred your brothers not because they were better or they loved them more. The preference was because they had some check boxes that reflected best on the parent. More to brag about and get accolades for the narcissist to feel good about. Never about who your brothers really were as people or their happiness or love for them at all. You were all looked at equally: as reflections on that parent, not as fully formed and separate individuals. Believe it or not, this is hard for the overvalued kids as well because any "love" they receive is still entirely conditional and dependent on them still "delivering" what the parent wants and not living for themselves. Makes it hard to feel comfortable ever doing what they want or feel, even if it's for different reasons (overidealized golden child vs scapegoat child). None of the kids ever get accepted just for who they are. So thinking about that, if any of it sounds relatable to your experience... none of you ever truly got the validation you were seeking. How can you think about that, and about providing your own validation, as you think about reparenting little tnr9? |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 18, 2018 18:52:43 GMT
Hey alexandra ...good questions. I don't think it is the first one because it feel like my loss...that I am to blame for the loss of choices....so I think it is actually number 2....I have 2 younger brothers, both are very smart. I did feel like I lost out a lot for the positive attention odd my parents...both my mom and dad seemed to prefer my brothers....ok...it wasn't "seemed" it "was" that they preferred my brothers because my brothers were smart, they were together, they were not overly emotional, they did not cause my mom and dad stress, they did not embarrass my parents...I could go on but you get my drift. You've talked about how there was narcissism in one of your parents before, so I'm going to flip your script. They preferred your brothers not because they were better or they loved them more. The preference was because they had some check boxes that reflected best on the parent. More to brag about and get accolades for the narcissist to feel good about. Never about who your brothers really were as people or their happiness or love for them at all. You were all looked at equally: as reflections on that parent, not as fully formed and separate individuals. Believe it or not, this is hard for the overvalued kids as well because any "love" they receive is still entirely conditional and dependent on them still "delivering" what the parent wants and not living for themselves. Makes it hard to feel comfortable ever doing what they want or feel, even if it's for different reasons (overidealized golden child vs scapegoat child). None of the kids ever get accepted just for who they are. So thinking about that, if any of it sounds relatable to your experience... none of you ever truly got the validation you were seeking. How can you think about that, and about providing your own validation, as you think about reparenting little tnr9? Honestly.....I need to think more about this because my automatic response was to go back into the storyline of missing and wanting B back and feeling like I lost out. That is a more familiar script and it helps me to avoid the exact question you have posted above. So muchof the good work is hard because I have become addicted to my ways of avoiding addressing things...i cling to my belief that the issue is me and has always been me because I cannot relate to a storyline where I am not the problem....that doesn't fit the experiences from my past, it doesn't fit the dialogue I was told and I have no tools around addressing things differently....so I shut down and go back to what is familiar and feels safe. |
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Post by alexandra on Nov 18, 2018 19:04:44 GMT
Honestly.....I need to think more about this because my automatic response was to go back into the storyline of missing and wanting B back and feeling like I lost out. That is a more familiar script and it helps me to avoid the exact question you have posted above. So muchof the good work is hard because I have become addicted to my ways of avoiding addressing things...i cling to my belief that the issue is me and has always been me because I cannot relate to a storyline where I am not the problem....that doesn't fit the experiences from my past, it doesn't fit the dialogue I was told and I have no tools around addressing things differently....so I shut down and go back to what is familiar and feels safe. It's a tough thing. In these situations, it is quite possible that you were told everyone around you was great and you weren't, based on totally arbitrary criteria with no one actually earning their designations. That can certainly screw with a person's sense of self worth and how they value others. It may also cause someone to automatically assign value to people who remind them of their family members, and seek approval from them, without understanding why. Consider it at your own speed. I know I'm asking difficult questions, though if they caused you to stop and loop back into the defensive B storyline pattern for safety, maybe we're onto something? Apologies for triggering you, though not too sorry if it helps you get somewhere better  |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 18, 2018 19:29:51 GMT
Honestly.....I need to think more about this because my automatic response was to go back into the storyline of missing and wanting B back and feeling like I lost out. That is a more familiar script and it helps me to avoid the exact question you have posted above. So muchof the good work is hard because I have become addicted to my ways of avoiding addressing things...i cling to my belief that the issue is me and has always been me because I cannot relate to a storyline where I am not the problem....that doesn't fit the experiences from my past, it doesn't fit the dialogue I was told and I have no tools around addressing things differently....so I shut down and go back to what is familiar and feels safe. It's a tough thing. In these situations, it is quite possible that you were told everyone around you was great and you weren't, based on totally arbitrary criteria with no one actually earning their designations. That can certainly screw with a person's sense of self worth and how they value others. It may also cause someone to automatically assign value to people who remind them of their family members, and seek approval from them, without understanding why. Consider it at your own speed. I know I'm asking difficult questions, though if they caused you to stop and loop back into the defensive B storyline pattern for safety, maybe we're onto something? Apologies for triggering you, though not too sorry if it helps you get somewhere better OH...I welcome the triggering...it is good....just the emotional reactions feel really crummy. I made it through a wave of craving B, I am just tired now....it is exhausting to actually work on the issues which is why I think so many people...don't. It also doesn't help that I have been sick since I got my flu shot. I am just resting today...allowing myself to feel in the safety of my apt. My therapist used to say....there is a reason you never left the black sheep status in your family...they needed you to be the problem child in order to avoid facing their own issues. It's weird how I cling to a role that doesn't serve me in any way other then makes me feel bad about myself. But I have long been conditioned against selfish, prideful views and reminded of where I fall short. And..,I do have to add....I was not an easy child..I was cholicky as a baby, I was very emotional and shy and did not have appropriate/normal social reactions to events...I was socially behind others...so it isn't as though the label was not in some way earned. It's why I tend to fall for other black sheeps....I keep thinking I understand their pain...i see through what their parents have told them....it's amazing I can do this so easily for B...but not give it to myself....because...then what is my role? How do I fit? BTW...my dad was a pychiatrist. |
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Post by faithopelove on Nov 18, 2018 19:45:31 GMT
It's a tough thing. In these situations, it is quite possible that you were told everyone around you was great and you weren't, based on totally arbitrary criteria with no one actually earning their designations. That can certainly screw with a person's sense of self worth and how they value others. It may also cause someone to automatically assign value to people who remind them of their family members, and seek approval from them, without understanding why. Consider it at your own speed. I know I'm asking difficult questions, though if they caused you to stop and loop back into the defensive B storyline pattern for safety, maybe we're onto something? Apologies for triggering you, though not too sorry if it helps you get somewhere better OH...I welcome the triggering...it is good....just the emotional reactions feel really crummy. I made it through a wave of craving B, I am just tired now....it is exhausting to actually work on the issues which is why I think so many people...don't. It also doesn't help that I have been sick since I got my flu shot. I am just resting today...allowing myself to feel in the safety of my apt. My therapist used to say....there is a reason you never left the black sheep status in your family...they needed you to be the problem child in order to avoid facing their own issues. It's weird how I cling to a role that doesn't serve me in any way other then makes me feel bad about myself. But I have long been conditioned against selfish, prideful views and reminded of where I fall short. And..,I do have to add....I was not an easy child..I was cholicky as a baby, I was very emotional and shy and did not have appropriate/normal social reactions to events...I was socially behind others...so it isn't as though the label was not in some way earned. It's why I tend to fall for other black sheeps....I keep thinking I understand their pain...i see through what their parents have told them....it's amazing I can do this so easily for B...but not give it to myself....because...then what is my role? How do I fit? BTW...my dad was a pychiatrist. Your dad was a psychiatrist? How disappointing to hear after reading what you’ve been through 😞 I understand feeling tired and having a need for rest. That’s the place I’m in now. Since letting go of my ex and not reaching out- I’m realizing how tiring it is both emotionally and psychologically to try to figure things out and stress over us and our outcome. Now my priority is self-love and rest. Being there for my kids with more focus. Hard to let go but the rest feels good was so needed. |
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