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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2019 16:45:48 GMT
"As we learn to meet ourselves with empathy and compassion, our experience of life can change. It may become a little softer, a little more manageable. With awareness and attention, meeting self can feel like coming home, and we can begin to elicit and receive from the world what we have needed all along." This is beautiful. Yes, that is exactly what I see happening in myself personally and also in my relationship! miracle! |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2019 16:52:36 GMT
ocarina , this article has Peter Levine's explanation of avoidant attachment , and how the freeze response shows up in the daily life and relationships of the avoidant. Do you recognize yourself? It's so interesting to know now what is behind it- how the original attachment trauma manifests in the nervous system trauma response. What do you think? I could check all the boxes in that description. Also- there are descriptions of the other styles there too. Avoidant is stage 3 of the trauma response, according to this interpretation . This is really good - and yes I totally recognise myself - the detachment from body, the intense self reliance - that person who never goes to the doctor, who's always just fine - and because it seems so on the outside, the person who others don't think to support because it appears I have it all sorted. Your description of relationships as a kind of functional union also resonates with me - and it wasn't until my 40s that I could see anything else in a relationship. That must have been so painful for my partners and now that I have experienced vulnerability and intimacy I recognise how important this is in my life.
This was interesting: "In relationships, this freeze state often plays out in hesitation, fear, lack of engagement, minimal expression, low motivation, limited enthusiasm, and greater attunement to anger and controlling actions in others"
I am not sure if I am interpreting this correctly, but I am super super sensitive to anger in others and often feel very put upon in relationships by conflict - I feel blamed, demeaned and shamed and therefore further wall myself off. The thing I am beginning to recognise is that the anger may appear a personal attack but is usually a fleeting reflection of the other persons mental state and I am not being attacked - it's just a skewed perception. Do you recognise that @sherry ?
Absolutely ocarina , this is all reactivity. toorational I think if you read this link it can help you! |
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Post by toorational on Jul 25, 2019 17:32:25 GMT
I read the article, thanks, it's interesting. However the more I read about this (and your posts here), the more I feel that my GF is only slightly DA and not that far on the spectrum. It didn't take her long to "grow" into the relationship, she was the one to say ILY after only two weeks of dating. I was kinda surprised at the speed at which she got attached but she told me that she never does things half way. It's either all-in or nothing. She can be very intense. It was definitely all-in for the first 1½ years. It was pure bliss. No AP-DA struggle whatsoever.
Nevertheless, it's still useful to get the perspective of a DA. I think that I'm starting to slowly improve and change my approach. When she's distant, I try to assume now that it's because of external factors and that she needs support, and the last thing she wants is to deal with needy behavior from her BF on top of whatever she has going on. So I try to offer support and comfort instead without expecting anything. I won't go into details because I don't want to derail that thread but it's been going pretty well lately.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 25, 2019 18:41:31 GMT
I read the article, thanks, it's interesting. However the more I read about this (and your posts here), the more I feel that my GF is only slightly DA and not that far on the spectrum. It didn't take her long to "grow" into the relationship, she was the one to say ILY after only two weeks of dating. I was kinda surprised at the speed at which she got attached but she told me that she never does things half way. It's either all-in or nothing. She can be very intense. It was definitely all-in for the first 1½ years. It was pure bliss. No AP-DA struggle whatsoever. Nevertheless, it's still useful to get the perspective of a DA. I think that I'm starting to slowly improve and change my approach. When she's distant, I try to assume now that it's because of external factors and that she needs support, and the last thing she wants is to deal with needy behavior from her BF on top of whatever she has going on. So I try to offer support and comfort instead without expecting anything. I won't go into details because I don't want to derail that thread but it's been going pretty well lately.[/quote I'm sorry, I was in a rush. I meant that article for you and your attachment adaptation. Also, if she attaches fast but has avoidant behavior I wonder if she has some FA , disorganized. I don't know but as long as you are aware of your own style and can find a way to work with it to advance your own progress toward security, things can improve for you. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 26, 2019 2:18:03 GMT
Interesting find: talking about all this with my partner resulted in super amazing emotional sex. Yay! And wow!  |
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Post by anne12 on Jul 28, 2019 8:28:17 GMT
@sherry I thought That I would give You a proper explanation about why the healing threads look like they do.
I have now posted This in All the healing threads.
Good luck With your journey.
"(The information in this long thread is from various therapists working with the attatchment therapy and SE therapy in their work with clients.
There is also information from various experts around the world, SE experts, bodynamic workers, gestalt therapists, clinical psychologists, neorologists ect.
The material has not been edited. Therefore, there may be information from webinars led by various educators in the subject where at the same time questions have been asked from different participants, that I have included.
The given examples are included to show how it can look in different situations.
The teachers are not necessarily English speaking and articles cannot always be referred to.
Furthermore, not everything is correctly translated into English and there may be problems with making keyboard and translation programs work properly.
The information is meant as inspiration. Work is based on a model with a broad definition of the disorganized attachment style, which also includes different types of other types of trauma, since trauma can give some of the same reactions as if the person had a typical disorganized attachment style.
The provided information is not meant for someone With an attatchment disorder, personality disorder, Asperger, ADHD, mental disorder ect. Some of the information Can Be usefull thouh.)"
anne12
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 11:07:12 GMT
@sherry I thought That I would give You a proper explanation about why the healing threads look like they do. I have now posted This in All the healing threads. Good luck With your journey. "(The information in this long thread is from various therapists working with the attatchment therapy and SE therapy in their work with clients. There is also information from various experts around the world, SE experts, bodynamic workers, gestalt therapists, clinical psychologists, neorologists ect. The material has not been edited. Therefore, there may be information from webinars led by various educators in the subject where at the same time questions have been asked from different participants, that I have included. The given examples are included to show how it can look in different situations. The teachers are not necessarily English speaking and articles cannot always be referred to. Furthermore, not everything is correctly translated into English and there may be problems with making keyboard and translation programs work properly. The information is meant as inspiration. Work is based on a model with a broad definition of the disorganized attachment style, which also includes different types of other types of trauma, since trauma can give some of the same reactions as if the person had a typical disorganized attachment style. The provided information is not meant for someone With an attatchment disorder, personality disorder, Asperger, ADHD, mental disorder ect. Some of the information Can Be usefull thouh.)" anne12 Cool, so you can see why I found your threads to be difficult for me to follow due to an organizational and language issue. But your response when I mentioned that was "How low can you go? I have seen this drama before. Don't ask me questions in the future. Thanks." This after refusing to engage with me in a clear way by answering my repeated request for clarification on what you disagreed with in my posting. It was bizarre to me. So I decided to pass over your input in the future and am not really interested in your threads or input. Thank you for sharing,, but the articles I found as a "google girl" pointed me in a direction that is more clear and concise and meets my needs. Best to you as well, I don't see a need to engage personally here but it's a public forum and you have a lot to share, carry on. |
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Post by anne12 on Jul 28, 2019 12:08:25 GMT
Yes We Can All slip. I wasent ready to answer You back Then.
Note to myself in the future : Do not answer or post until I am in a Well regulated state of mind and ready to Get back.
(Sorry about the writing. My phone does not Work proberly at the moment, But I am choosing to comment anyway)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 12:23:50 GMT
Well I think mud have been thrown both ways. And I apooligise again for my part. Note to myself in the future : Do not answer or post until I am in a Well regulated state of mind. Much appreciated, however, I had no intention to sling mud. I have not deleted a single post of mine from this thread, so please, help me understand where you thought I was slinging mud at you, by quoting my mudball and helping me see it. What I see is that I kept asking you for simple clarification and defending my posts and position without any helpful input from you. It was a game of cat and mouse that I needn't have bothered with. Anyway, clearly you have had a reaction to me that caused you to feel insulted when no insult was intended. I do not understand the interaction, And it's been unnecessarily complicated. I am trying to understand my own attachment style and have people around me who know me for a long time, as well as therapists and knowledgeable colleagues, so my participation here is helpful but not the be-all-end-all of my process. This thread was only ever intended to explain a freeze response as opposed to a sympathetic fight or flight response. |
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Post by anne12 on Jul 28, 2019 12:44:39 GMT
I Will Get back.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 12:46:45 GMT
Yes We Can All slip. I wasent ready to answer You back Then. Note to myself in the future : Do not answer or post until I am in a Well regulated state of mind and ready to Get back. (Sorry about the writing. My phone does not Work proberly at the moment, But I am choosing to comment anyway) Truce. Thank you. I am in personal pain at the moment and need to get with some people to feel better. I'm fascinated by the information I have learned about the ventral vagal regulation from caring people, and I see how it has operated for me in the relationships I have made. But it also just makes me sad to realize that for so long I haven't known how to find it, and in self protection I have cut myself off from what I needed the most. I wish I could male up for lost time. I feel sad, I feel compassion for myself. I love that little girl in me to bits and I just feel sad she's been alone for so long. Im really overwhelmed. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 13:07:50 GMT
Essentially, I find that science has proven to me what I have come to experience by working long and hard to understand myself and stretch myself beyond my known limits.
I have said Yes to life over and over again and done things that did not feel natural for me to do, and those things have resulted in a feeling of connection I didn't believe was possible or available for me.
I still struggle and as a I go deeper it becomes harder, but more rewarding.
It may seem strange to someone who as wired to look for help from others, but for me, to be validated by this understanding helps me to have the courage to embrace what I am afraid of- dependence on other people.
To some it may be an article, about nervous systems- but for me this is all a permission slip from The Powers that Be to love and be loved and relax into the life I was meant to live.
I needed to understand it. My internal ability and inability around all this has been confusing but now I UNDERSTAND and it sets me free.
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Post by toorational on Jul 28, 2019 13:12:05 GMT
sherry, I cannot claim to be able to provide useful advice for you. But I just wanted to throw a little compassion your way. I hope that you find a way to heal the pain that you say you are currently experiencing. It's probably a good sign that you say that you need to get with some people to get better.
Best of luck
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 13:29:18 GMT
sherry, I cannot claim to be able to provide useful advice for you. But I just wanted to throw a little compassion your way. I hope that you find a way to heal the pain that you say you are currently experiencing. It's probably a good sign that you say that you need to get with some people to get better. Best of luck Thank you for this.  It is a very good sign. I have been getting more comfortable trusting , and I have a few very warm and affectionate relationships but this deep pattern still drives me to isolation sometimes. I feel more able and affirmed to go all in and let go some more. This is helping my partner also, after I explained all this we had the most tender time we have ever had. it's like he needed permission to trust and need also. I am on my way to see him right now . |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 28, 2019 15:33:37 GMT
There is a lot of antagonism toward avoidant on this forum, it's not as bad as it used to be apparently and that is great.
I am going to put myself out there with people in real life as a
opposed to continuing here with all the people who don't understand . It will be better for me that way .
Thanks all! It's been useful. On to other things.
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