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Post by epicgum on Feb 11, 2019 21:05:55 GMT
I concluded a few months ago that this is true for all unaware insecure attachment types. It's a very patterned and reactive place to be, with far less free will than it appears until healing begins. Of course, it's all unconscious and freedom is only possible when you have conscious choice. That said, the lifestyle independence of DA , I believe, is only problematic if it is a source of unhappiness. But yes, all the pattern reactivity holds us captive until we work through it. I believe that there are empirical studies that show how the DA suffers objective health consequences as a result of his/her attachment style. I can't pull those studies up though beyond the strange situation, I just remember hearing about them in passing. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 11, 2019 21:21:26 GMT
Of course, it's all unconscious and freedom is only possible when you have conscious choice. That said, the lifestyle independence of DA , I believe, is only problematic if it is a source of unhappiness. But yes, all the pattern reactivity holds us captive until we work through it. I believe that there are empirical studies that show how the DA suffers objective health consequences as a result of his/her attachment style. I can't pull those studies up though beyond the strange situation, I just remember hearing about them in passing. Meh, can't be worse than drinking , smoking, sugar, obesity, whatever lifestyle choice a person chooses. I'm healthy and feel pretty good. Might have to do with where one is at on the spectrum too. |
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Post by faithopelove on Feb 11, 2019 21:39:48 GMT
Of course, it's all unconscious and freedom is only possible when you have conscious choice. That said, the lifestyle independence of DA , I believe, is only problematic if it is a source of unhappiness. But yes, all the pattern reactivity holds us captive until we work through it. I believe that there are empirical studies that show how the DA suffers objective health consequences as a result of his/her attachment style. I can't pull those studies up though beyond the strange situation, I just remember hearing about them in passing. - Yes, numerous studies show the health benefits of time and touch with a responsive partner. Even massage and sex are shown to help the immune system.  It makes sense that having a supportive partner would contribute to your overall health and wellness. Humans have a basic need for security and connection. We’re hard wired for it. My DA can think he’s better off alone, but it’s what he’s telling himself to avoid closeness that triggers him...he’s admittedly unhappy. |
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Post by alexandra on Feb 11, 2019 21:49:54 GMT
I believe that there are empirical studies that show how the DA suffers objective health consequences as a result of his/her attachment style. I can't pull those studies up though beyond the strange situation, I just remember hearing about them in passing. - Yes, numerous studies show the health benefits of time and touch with a responsive partner. Even massage and sex are shown to help the immune system. It makes sense that having a supportive partner would contribute to your overall health and wellness. Humans have a basic need for security and connection. We’re hard wired for it. My DA can think he’s better off alone, but it’s what he’s telling himself to avoid closeness that triggers him...he’s admittedly unhappy. I've seen those studies, too. It's not that the DA lack touch and support, it's a combination of even though they may not feel the stress consciously, their vital signs still indicate stress. They feel more areas of physical pain than secures do, which is true for other insecure types as well, though not more intense pain. And they're less likely to seek medical treatment for complaints or to adhere to medical advice once given. AP are more likely to have heart conditions or inflammation issues, in addition to more areas of physical pain, but are also more likely to seek treatment and/or preventative care. There's far more research than that across all types, I'm just summarizing some of the points. |
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Post by faithopelove on Feb 11, 2019 22:25:26 GMT
epicgum - Yes, numerous studies show the health benefits of time and touch with a responsive partner. Even massage and sex are shown to help the immune system. It makes sense that having a supportive partner would contribute to your overall health and wellness. Humans have a basic need for security and connection. We’re hard wired for it. My DA can think he’s better off alone, but it’s what he’s telling himself to avoid closeness that triggers him...he’s admittedly unhappy. I've seen those studies, too. It's not that the DA lack touch and support, it's a combination of even though they may not feel the stress consciously, their vital signs still indicate stress. They feel more areas of physical pain than secures do, which is true for other insecure types as well, though not more intense pain. And they're less likely to seek medical treatment for complaints or to adhere to medical advice once given. AP are more likely to have heart conditions or inflammation issues, in addition to more areas of physical pain, but are also more likely to seek treatment and/or preventative care. There's far more research than that across all types, I'm just summarizing some of the points. Yes, I’ve read similar studies. Some avoidants lack touch and support- if they push it away, as DA are more likely to do if they feel they are better off alone or relationships are too much work. No matter the attachment, people are wired to connect and a good connection serves various physical, emotional and psychological benefits- even financial. Sure we can be well alone if we choose or by no choice of our own, but research confirms countless benefits in being with a partner. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2019 6:39:00 GMT
I've seen those studies, too. It's not that the DA lack touch and support, it's a combination of even though they may not feel the stress consciously, their vital signs still indicate stress. They feel more areas of physical pain than secures do, which is true for other insecure types as well, though not more intense pain. And they're less likely to seek medical treatment for complaints or to adhere to medical advice once given. AP are more likely to have heart conditions or inflammation issues, in addition to more areas of physical pain, but are also more likely to seek treatment and/or preventative care. There's far more research than that across all types, I'm just summarizing some of the points. Yes, I’ve read similar studies. Some avoidants lack touch and support- if they push it away, as DA are more likely to do if they feel they are better off alone or relationships are too much work. No matter the attachment, people are wired to connect and a good connection serves various physical, emotional and psychological benefits- even financial. Sure we can be well alone if we choose or by no choice of our own, but research confirms countless benefits in being with a partner. This study suggests that avoidants have more complaints primarily related to pain - such as frequent headaches -but that anxious have a wider variety of complications such as cardiovascular issues, stroke, high blood pressure. They found that anxious attachment carries a higher risk of chronic pain, stroke, heart attack, and ulcers. Sure, a (healthy!) partnership can improve health, but there is more information than that available. www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2010/07/insecure-attachment |
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Post by faithopelove on Feb 12, 2019 8:10:53 GMT
Yes, I’ve read similar studies. Some avoidants lack touch and support- if they push it away, as DA are more likely to do if they feel they are better off alone or relationships are too much work. No matter the attachment, people are wired to connect and a good connection serves various physical, emotional and psychological benefits- even financial. Sure we can be well alone if we choose or by no choice of our own, but research confirms countless benefits in being with a partner. This study suggests that avoidants have more complaints primarily related to pain - such as frequent headaches -but that anxious have a wider variety of complications such as cardiovascular issues, stroke, high blood pressure. They found that anxious attachment carries a higher risk of chronic pain, stroke, heart attack, and ulcers. Sure, a (healthy!) partnership can improve health, but there is more information than that available. www.apa.org/news/press/releases/2010/07/insecure-attachmentMakes sense. My original post was referring to healthy and secure partnerships having a positive affect and the lack a negative. I wasn’t comparing AP to DA. |
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Post by 8675309 on Feb 13, 2019 12:45:42 GMT
when I’m in a “fight mode” and don’t usually feel fear of losing my partner or fear of intimacy or engulfment. I’m just irritated because of something and I have become really good at letting my partner know that I’m upset about something pretty fast because than I can go back to “happy mode” faster too. I find it hard to be angry at someone for too long and I experience that others can’t be angry at me for too long either. Im a secure. This is me more or less. I dont stay angry either, I just cant. I am my sun sign, the happy go lucky type and the glass is half full.
That said, when it came to my avoidant he gave me anxiety and made me anxious. I tested in the 2-3% range for anxious and I was full blown AP so to speak. I was having bad compulsions to chase, ruminations and wanted to protest. I felt so out of whack... It was draining as I was fighting myself, my secure side kept it in check but it was a fight until I understood attachment. After learning about it, I was soothed and those compulsions settled. Its how I stumbled on attachment, I was like what the heck is wrong with me?! LOL. It was like my skin was crawling and making me tired from the attachment fight.
With my ex at the end after trying and trying and trying to work on us to no available... I totally turned DA, I was totally checked out and shut down. Classic DA behaviors. I had to be pushed very hard to get there as my avoidant side is more family related. I think all of us can go DA when pushed to the brink and youre done with it. I did feel some engulfment with this relationship by year 3 because he had no hobbies, didnt see friends, started to become a drunk. he was Always around, secures need some balanced space, there was no space at all. I was like go out and do something!
With AP types I go more 'avoidant' quickly and its cut off before it starts.
Even secures will be triggerd by this- "I am triggered by inconsistency, or confusion, unpredictability, and conflict, or disrespect that feels like oppression or encroachment on my autonomy or personal values". I think its just human to be triggered by this. I wouldnt go avoidant, Id end it though.(if it cant be worked out)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 14:54:41 GMT
today i got triggered. but i felt anger, not fear or anxiety. DA-friend suggested travelling together, then everytime i tried to push it forward, he shrinks and comes up with excuses of why it might not work, without ever saying if he wants it to happen or not. If i asked him to make a decision, he disappears for a week before coming to tell me to cancel it. in the end, I cancelled everything. what the hell.
with my ex, it literally felt like I was crawling out of my chest and i couldn't focus on anything else except him/us. i ruminated non-stop and was very stressed out all the time, crying everyday. when he first deactivated and told me he wanted to spend less time with me, it was such a physical blow it felt like i imploded and was no more. i couldn't really feel myself and my soul. I just... wasn't there. but I was crying automatically with alot of grief. i still functioned though - went to work and everything, but it was like zombie. i was also probably dissociated. subsequently, i'll just get really jumpy and distrustful. when he came close to me, i would feel anger and fear. when he distanced, i would feel panicky. physically i was always on alert, very wary, and constantly scanning for signs.
when i'm avoidant, usually with AP partners and family, I get expressionless and shut down. I am not really alive and living, and experiencing the present as it is. I'm functioning and moving through life, but at a slightly deadened level where everything is less sharp to me - i don't feel it that much. when i'm in this state, i have very few expressions and i'm relatively rigid in my body. i'm reading everything in the room but it's dispassionate. or i'm really blocking everything out and i don't perceive anything at all. i can get like that as well with strangers or at work.
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Post by anne12 on Feb 13, 2019 15:50:11 GMT
today i got triggered. but i felt anger, not fear or anxiety. DA-friend suggested travelling together, then everytime i tried to push it forward, he shrinks and comes up with excuses of why it might not work, without ever saying if he wants it to happen or not. If i asked him to make a decision, he disappears for a week before coming to tell me to cancel it. in the end, I cancelled everything. How can you know that you were triggered ? If you were not triggered, what would you have done instead ? Did you ask in a very clear direct way ? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 13, 2019 16:29:07 GMT
today i got triggered. but i felt anger, not fear or anxiety. DA-friend suggested travelling together, then everytime i tried to push it forward, he shrinks and comes up with excuses of why it might not work, without ever saying if he wants it to happen or not. If i asked him to make a decision, he disappears for a week before coming to tell me to cancel it. in the end, I cancelled everything. How can you know that you were triggered ? If you were not triggered, what would you have done instead ? I’m not sure if I got triggered or it’s a normal anger reaction. It felt like my heart twisted and my body went hot and stiff. I had to sit and breathe while distracting myself with Facebook and I was also talking to my Best Friend about other things. It lasted at least an hour. Once it passed, I could tell my Best Friend about it and we discussed how I could express myself to him. Nowhere did I unleash that anger on him. The story is we were supposed to travel and stay together for a festival (that he invited me to go with him as I was undecided). since we are travelling together I suggested to stay together and I can book it - an idea he readily agreed to. So today I was looking at accom and I asked him if he’s still staying with me (over the past two weeeks there’s the situation of shrinking from making plans and not replying me), and he said he’s already booked his own place. But maybe he can cancel it. My response was - it is up to you. Again, didn’t read the msg for 10 hours. I got tired of waiting and I said I’m cancelling the reservation. To which he immediately replied and said maybe it’s easier if we did our own things and he appreciated the offer. I did not reply. This is all over texting. I would have still cancelled the reservation if I was not triggered because that was the practical thing to do. But i wasn’t sure if I was triggered or he was triggered or what the hell was happening, so I gave him the choice and some time to make the choice. He’s permanently online - I know he saw it. Beyond a certain amount of time, I just felt like that was enough on my end. Sorry I didn’t get the question - What was I suppose to ask? If we were staying together? Tell me if I’m missinf something! I’m really trying to practice secure behaviours. |
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Post by anne12 on Feb 13, 2019 21:07:36 GMT
Do you know what made you angry ? Getting angry can be because you are not getting your needs met, that someone have violated your boundaries, old Hurt ect. you said its Up to you ... Maybe you havent communicated your needs clear enough or maybe you have waited for too Long for an answer and compromised Maybe you needed an answer sooner so instead of beeing very clear about when you needed an answer you were just waiting afraid of beeing pushy ? Maybe you had other expatations ? jebkinnison.boards.net/thread/1468/anger-integrety-boundaries-ect |
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Post by happy on Feb 14, 2019 3:09:16 GMT
I’m pretty secure and when I’m in a “fight mode” and don’t usually feel fear of losing my partner or fear of intimacy or engulfment. I’m just irritated because of something and I have become really good at letting my partner know that I’m upset about something pretty fast because than I can go back to “happy mode” faster too. I find it hard to be angry at someone for too long and I experience that others can’t be angry at me for too long either. My DA “partner” have learned that if I’m upset or when we are upset with each other it’s a moment thing but it took a lot of time to come to this place. I think it’s harder to fight with an insecure partner because they take things more personal and are in some way much more sensitive to criticism. I relate to this exactly, wish I could find a romantic partner who feels the same way. |
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It makes sense that having a supportive partner would contribute to your overall health and wellness. Humans have a basic need for security and connection. We’re hard wired for it. My DA can think he’s better off alone, but it’s what he’s telling himself to avoid closeness that triggers him...he’s admittedly unhappy. 
