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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 5, 2019 19:11:04 GMT
So I've been told by a few people that my attachment patterns tend to resemble FA rather than AP, as I had previously assumed. And I guess this is true - in the past everyone I've had a "thing" or "situationship" with was always more into me (i've never been in a full relationship although I've been asked before). Not only that, but when people I'd been into for long periods of time began to reciprocate, I often got turned off pretty quickly, and we're talking major crushes.
Like what I've read from others on here, I have also gone back to people before, sometimes multiple times. Sometimes in shitty ways. I've been a shitty guy in the past, which I'm in no way proud of. And which I wasn't at the time. I've found that I would get anxious simultaneously that someone would leave me and that someone would have feelings for me. I would stuck in a position where I was ambivalent but couldn't end things, and would spiral outwards anxiously, which would be compounded by guilt and the fear of them leaving. The first significant time this happened it was made even worse by the fact that we had a genuine connection, and I genuinely cared about them, so it was difficult to watch them get hurt. Like I've heard from other people though on here, I kept in my ambivalence and suppressed it until I lied about certain compatibility issues I saw, and had a horrible 8-9 day long episode of some of the worst anxiety in my life. I just couldn't leave because of the attachment situation I was in, and was honestly not fully capable of knowing what to do. Really confusing, isn't it.
Of course, once I did break things off, often because the pressure was to extreme or sometimes because they decided to in the end, the fear of the loss of attachment, the clarity of a lack of a pressure to know how I feel or know what I want with the other person (big big big decider actually), and the space of time often convoluted my memory of the feelings I had and the anxiety/pressure I was feeling. I had actually gone back and forth before within hours, days, weeks etc.
I have no idea how this relates to other FAs on here, but i definitely hurt other people in the past. I deeply regret what happened, it weighs heavily on me :/. Being on the other end of that situation must have been terrible. And now I finally was able to experience it as well, albeit with someone who was able to handle these types of emotions much better than me (so probably not as bad, tbh :/ ). I had an FA I was casually seeing, who ended things the other day. It opened my eyes a lot, and to what I can do better (although to be honest, I've realized by the pursuer is actually less anxiety-inducing for me than the other way around).
I can sit around and hope all I want that they will come back (and knowing myself and them, and having read what I've read, there is always a slight chance). But I realized that the real question is what do I do with myself. Everyone always talks about "working on yourself" and so on. But I am working on myself. I always find myself working hard while I'm into someone, and crashing/stagnating/losing interest in self-change afterwards. What do I do now? Where do I go from here? I have no idea how to change that previous situation, once that anxiety sets in it's like everything else goes out the window! It's almost easier to resign myself to dating more FA people than myself...
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Post by alexandra on Jul 6, 2019 2:21:06 GMT
isildur4797 Congratulations, awareness of your own style is the first step! That sounds like a weird way to put it, but it's actually true. There's a lot that can be done from there, and worth it, if you're willing to do it. It's not easy and takes time, effort, and facing fears / pain, as an attachment style didn't develop overnight, so healing is an investment. But the earlier in adult life you're ready to process it and work towards earning secure, the better, because you'll stop getting stuck in the painful loops and sabotage that insecure attachment causes endlessly. There's a lot of resources on the board to learn more about your style, what secure looks like in contrast, and some exercises. anne12 posts a lot for different styles on the general board. This is a wealth of information for FA: jebkinnisonforum.com/thread/1073/healing-disorganized-trauma-dramaqueen-kingThis thread may be helpful too. jebkinnisonforum.com/thread/1742/fa-resourcesLook up the threads by blacksnow and blacksnow2. They are long and thoughtful in discovering FA and starting to peel back the trauma layers with descriptions of how she's been working through it. There's other self-identified FAs who discuss their process of healing as well. I just don't know them all top of mind, but worth digging through the FA threads. Finding a therapist who specializes in attachment work (and has worked with the FA style) helps, too. The board can definitely get you started on next steps, but the right therapist can help guide you more effectively and possibly more quickly than trying to figure it all out on your own. I personally didn't use a therapist to heal my AP, and I've discussed that on other threads, but I think if I knew at the time what type of therapist to look for my progress would have been closer to 2 years than the 5-6 it took me to figure out what was going on and how it was actionable. And I wish I knew what I know now 4 years earlier. (As you're asking about, knowing that the AP style existed totally resonated with me but then it took me until I dated two FAs in a row to figure out what to do next). And if you get a hold of Neil Strauss's book The Truth, he basically didn't realize he was FA always dating AP women and he had deep issues he needed to deal with until he dated a woman more FA than him who got him anxious enough to get serious about confronting his family issues. He doesn't use much attachment style lingo in the book, but it's an interesting read (that tangents into a lot of stories of casual and polyamorous sex while he's on his journey). While I'm not FA, a place to start may be to reflect on two driving fears (which you kind of mention in your post). The attachment trauma tends to be driven from Fear of Abandonment (that causes the anxious responses, flooding your nervous system, and tends to be related to a negative view / distrust of self) and from Fear of Engulfment (that causes the avoidant deactivation, your nervous system shutting down when it gets overwhelmed by perceiving someone "wanting too much" or having feelings for you as a threat to you, and tends to be related to distrust of others... usually leftover projections from something that happened to you in the past). I know that's a lot of information all at once for just getting aware and settled, in fact sorry if it's too much because I don't want you to feel overwhelmed! But I hope it's helpful over time. Just trying to get it all into one place so it's easier to find and go back to.
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Post by alexandra on Jul 6, 2019 2:27:35 GMT
I've found that I would get anxious simultaneously that someone would leave me and that someone would have feelings for me. I would stuck in a position where I was ambivalent but couldn't end things, and would spiral outwards anxiously, which would be compounded by guilt and the fear of them leaving. I'm also pretty sure that epicgum has posted about feeling this same way in past threads. |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 6, 2019 15:34:51 GMT
isildur4797 Congratulations, awareness of your own style is the first step! That sounds like a weird way to put it, but it's actually true. There's a lot that can be done from there, and worth it, if you're willing to do it. It's not easy and takes time, effort, and facing fears / pain, as an attachment style didn't develop overnight, so healing is an investment. But the earlier in adult life you're ready to process it and work towards earning secure, the better, because you'll stop getting stuck in the painful loops and sabotage that insecure attachment causes endlessly. There's a lot of resources on the board to learn more about your style, what secure looks like in contrast, and some exercises. anne12 posts a lot for different styles on the general board. This is a wealth of information for FA: jebkinnisonforum.com/thread/1073/healing-disorganized-trauma-dramaqueen-kingThis thread may be helpful too. jebkinnisonforum.com/thread/1742/fa-resourcesLook up the threads by blacksnow and blacksnow2. They are long and thoughtful in discovering FA and starting to peel back the trauma layers with descriptions of how she's been working through it. There's other self-identified FAs who discuss their process of healing as well. I just don't know them all top of mind, but worth digging through the FA threads. Finding a therapist who specializes in attachment work (and has worked with the FA style) helps, too. The board can definitely get you started on next steps, but the right therapist can help guide you more effectively and possibly more quickly than trying to figure it all out on your own. I personally didn't use a therapist to heal my AP, and I've discussed that on other threads, but I think if I knew at the time what type of therapist to look for my progress would have been closer to 2 years than the 5-6 it took me to figure out what was going on and how it was actionable. And I wish I knew what I know now 4 years earlier. (As you're asking about, knowing that the AP style existed totally resonated with me but then it took me until I dated two FAs in a row to figure out what to do next). And if you get a hold of Neil Strauss's book The Truth, he basically didn't realize he was FA always dating AP women and he had deep issues he needed to deal with until he dated a woman more FA than him who got him anxious enough to get serious about confronting his family issues. He doesn't use much attachment style lingo in the book, but it's an interesting read (that tangents into a lot of stories of casual and polyamorous sex while he's on his journey). While I'm not FA, a place to start may be to reflect on two driving fears (which you kind of mention in your post). The attachment trauma tends to be driven from Fear of Abandonment (that causes the anxious responses, flooding your nervous system, and tends to be related to a negative view / distrust of self) and from Fear of Engulfment (that causes the avoidant deactivation, your nervous system shutting down when it gets overwhelmed by perceiving someone "wanting too much" or having feelings for you as a threat to you, and tends to be related to distrust of others... usually leftover projections from something that happened to you in the past). I know that's a lot of information all at once for just getting aware and settled, in fact sorry if it's too much because I don't want you to feel overwhelmed! But I hope it's helpful over time. Just trying to get it all into one place so it's easier to find and go back to. Don't Apologize! This was great - thank you so, so, so, so much for getting back to me! I was terrified people weren't going to like what I had to say, especially certain parts. I'm actually working on finding a therapist right now, and have been looking for about a week. I am on meds for anxiety, which has been helping a bit, cutting down on coffee and drinking, which has also helped a lot (I used to have 3-5 coffees a day and now I switch to decaf after one). I'm going to check out that book too, and am currently checking out those threads!!! I'm sure you've seen my other posts, and honestly, even though I was functioning as the AP with this last person, and was more easily into them than I have been in the past, I'm actually less upset about it being over than I have been previously. Maybe because I empathize, so it's easier? I dunno... |
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Post by epicgum on Jul 6, 2019 21:04:20 GMT
I've found that I would get anxious simultaneously that someone would leave me and that someone would have feelings for me. I would stuck in a position where I was ambivalent but couldn't end things, and would spiral outwards anxiously, which would be compounded by guilt and the fear of them leaving. I'm also pretty sure that epicgum has posted about feeling this same way in past threads. Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. |
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Post by happyidiot on Jul 7, 2019 1:51:13 GMT
I'm also pretty sure that epicgum has posted about feeling this same way in past threads. Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. Same here! You certainly aren't alone, isildur4797 |
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Post by epicgum on Jul 7, 2019 1:58:21 GMT
I will say....don't beat yourself up too much about this or how you may have acted. Part of the problem in my experience is a negative self image and valuing other peoples thoughts, feelings, interests above my own.
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Post by happyidiot on Jul 7, 2019 4:07:21 GMT
I will say....don't beat yourself up too much about this or how you may have acted. Part of the problem in my experience is a negative self image and valuing other peoples thoughts, feelings, interests above my own. I second this point. I beat myself up so much over how I treated a particular ex and he has only wonderful things to say about me, so maybe I wasn't as awful as I think. And even if he was super hurt, beating myself up is not actually useful. |
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Post by tnr9 on Jul 7, 2019 11:13:59 GMT
I'm also pretty sure that epicgum has posted about feeling this same way in past threads. Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. Crumbs....I own that I resemble that partner who tried to progress things too quickly. 😕. Rather big regret now. |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 7, 2019 20:36:53 GMT
I'm also pretty sure that epicgum has posted about feeling this same way in past threads. Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. Up until the FA who just broke things off with me, that's always been the case for me. Even with her, there were at least 3 times when I started to enter that stage and/or could feel it coming on! Including last week... :/ |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 7, 2019 20:37:19 GMT
Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. Same here! You certainly aren't alone, isildur4797 Thanks HappyIdiot!! That means a lot to me  |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 7, 2019 20:38:17 GMT
I will say....don't beat yourself up too much about this or how you may have acted. Part of the problem in my experience is a negative self image and valuing other peoples thoughts, feelings, interests above my own. WOw I have definitely done that. And "my" FA recently told me how she's done the same thing before. I actually let it get to me and determine a large part of my self-image for almost a year, just from an 8-10 week long fling. |
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Post by mrob on Jul 8, 2019 9:53:00 GMT
Oh yeah, I can totally identify with ::extreme:: fearful panicky ambivalence. But part of it is the partner also, when things progressed in a slow, secure fashion I was much more ok. Up until the FA who just broke things off with me, that's always been the case for me. Even with her, there were at least 3 times when I started to enter that stage and/or could feel it coming on! Including last week... :/ I pocketed all that quite a few times, shoved it down and told myself it was stupid. I eventually got married. I was in therapy before we moved in together to see what on earth was going on. I had such trouble with engulfment. At each step I wanted to run, but sanity prevailed, until it didn’t. Of course, I’m not married now, and it was the (non) relationship after that brought me here. I could see the pattern. |
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Post by lilyg on Jul 8, 2019 15:44:25 GMT
I am very curious about these feelings, as this is what happens with my partner. He's FA and we are currently working on our relationship. I do notice that when I'm feeling very secure he's able to be secure himself and express his feelings and thoughts. I really liked this video epicgum posted: www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHSxQTCW9GgI will share it with my boyfriend And you know what? I discovered on therapy that I'm also afraid to express my needs and wants without feeling guilty! And that I push people away sometimes because I don't want men to take advantage of me. It's weird I have never realised that. I've been practicing that now with my partner and told him how I'm doing it and why, and we've decided what are we going to do as a couple to tackle these things, working on a dynamic we both feel comfortable with… I hope we can make it. |
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Post by epicgum on Jul 8, 2019 17:32:31 GMT
I am very curious about these feelings, as this is what happens with my partner. He's FA and we are currently working on our relationship. I do notice that when I'm feeling very secure he's able to be secure himself and express his feelings and thoughts. I really liked this video epicgum posted: www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHSxQTCW9GgI will share it with my boyfriend And you know what? I discovered on therapy that I'm also afraid to express my needs and wants without feeling guilty! And that I push people away sometimes because I don't want men to take advantage of me. It's weird I have never realised that. I've been practicing that now with my partner and told him how I'm doing it and why, and we've decided what are we going to do as a couple to tackle these things, working on a dynamic we both feel comfortable with… I hope we can make it. I love that video! |
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