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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:02:39 GMT
Ok, so based off of all of this, I want to ask...HOW do I flirt? Or what is it about me that should be attractive to a man? I do not want a dude to be attracted to me just for how I look. I despise that. I've easily avoided typical players because I am turned off and don't give a chance to any guy whose first compliment has to do with my appearance. Hiding your intellect...wouldn't that be the equivalent of wearing sweats, putting your hair up, and not wearing makeup on a date? I mean, is there a middle ground of a nice pretty dress that isn't revealing? Is there a way you show some intellect without giving away the cow (that's the old school saying, right??)? I don't think that it is hiding your intellect. like I said, if you are truly intellectual, it will show in normal conversations without you engaging directly in it. The kind of topics you pick and how you respond to other topics even the boring ones WILL show it. how you use your words and logic will also shine through. it's like if you're beautiful, you don't need to wear makeup and sexy clothes to show that you are. you can be covered in mud and it'll still come through somehow. i observe first and foremost how smart they are - that comes through in the way they say things and in the decisions they make. the truly smart ones also test you for it, and that's when you "flirt". show that you are smart without giving them all the goods with intense intellectual conversations. the way I do it is when they "challenge" me, and I take their point (agree with content) and then say something like oh, does that assume x and y then (challenge assumption) and then wait for a response (see how much metacognition and abstraction they have). those who engage in pointless pontificating that sound smart are usually not very smart beyond a certain point of being knowledgeable of key "intellectual" points e.g., standard pop culture references and art stuff. I totally agree. K loves my intelligence and I never even knew that was part of the attraction. He says it shows in how I run my business, how I respond to life and trouble, how I parent my kids. We don't go into deep intellectual conversations, neither of us enjoy that. But over time it's been a deep attraction for both of us. It comes out when he is discussing how he thinks and makes decisions. Super sexy but it's behind the scenes. |
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Post by mrob on Dec 13, 2019 1:11:20 GMT
@inmourning, no, just an uncomfortable topic, and that generally means something is hitting too close to home. I’ve always known I’m not an Alpha, so I’ve had to make up for it in other ways. So, while I’ve never pursued maliciously, all this is incredibly confronting. Generally, we discuss the entrails, not the beginnings, so it’s different.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:13:52 GMT
I don't think that it is hiding your intellect. like I said, if you are truly intellectual, it will show in normal conversations without you engaging directly in it. The kind of topics you pick and how you respond to other topics even the boring ones WILL show it. how you use your words and logic will also shine through. it's like if you're beautiful, you don't need to wear makeup and sexy clothes to show that you are. you can be covered in mud and it'll still come through somehow. i observe first and foremost how smart they are - that comes through in the way they say things and in the decisions they make. the truly smart ones also test you for it, and that's when you "flirt". show that you are smart without giving them all the goods with intense intellectual conversations. the way I do it is when they "challenge" me, and I take their point (agree with content) and then say something like oh, does that assume x and y then (challenge assumption) and then wait for a response (see how much metacognition and abstraction they have). those who engage in pointless pontificating that sound smart are usually not very smart beyond a certain point of being knowledgeable of key "intellectual" points e.g., standard pop culture references and art stuff. I totally agree. K loves my intelligence and I never even knew that was part of the attraction. He says it shows in how I run my business, how I respond to life and trouble, how I parent my kids. We don't go into deep intellectual conversations, neither of us enjoy that. But over time it's been a deep attraction for both of us. It comes out when he is discussing how he thinks and makes decisions. Super sexy but it's behind the scenes. exactly. it really shows through little things. there is of course engaging in deep intellectual conversations early in our dating, but that has not been central in our convos - and if it did happen, it didn't feel like sparring (just a little bit to test intellectual capacity) but really more of an exchange of ideas and perspectives that may or may not challenge our own. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:16:27 GMT
@inmourning , no, just an uncomfortable topic, and that generally means something is hitting too close to home. I’ve always known I’m not an Alpha, so I’ve had to make up for it in other ways. So, while I’ve never pursued maliciously, all this is incredibly confronting. Generally, we discuss the entrails, not the beginnings, so it’s different. I understand! But to take heart that the thread is aimed at the softboi type, which isn't you  I'm willing to bet that your interest in intelligence is quite a bit different than the narcissistically inclined softboi. You have a feel about you, at least what I have picked up on over the months I have been here, which is mature, unpretentious and sincere. That's quite a bit different than what's being discussed in terms of the intellectual moat that softboi put around his pretty little castle, where he sits on his pretty little throne. That's not the impression I get about you at all! |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:20:19 GMT
I totally agree. K loves my intelligence and I never even knew that was part of the attraction. He says it shows in how I run my business, how I respond to life and trouble, how I parent my kids. We don't go into deep intellectual conversations, neither of us enjoy that. But over time it's been a deep attraction for both of us. It comes out when he is discussing how he thinks and makes decisions. Super sexy but it's behind the scenes. exactly. it really shows through little things. there is of course engaging in deep intellectual conversations early in our dating, but that has not been central in our convos - and if it did happen, it didn't feel like sparring (just a little bit to test intellectual capacity) but really more of an exchange of ideas and perspectives that may or may not challenge our own. Yes- I think a lot of insincere people have some thing to prove and so over engage in what they perceive as their strength: intellect, sex, a hobby they are good at, even "compassion". With sincerity and nothing to prove, a persons strengths are just part of their essence. It's not Who They Are. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:26:04 GMT
I totally agree. K loves my intelligence and I never even knew that was part of the attraction. He says it shows in how I run my business, how I respond to life and trouble, how I parent my kids. We don't go into deep intellectual conversations, neither of us enjoy that. But over time it's been a deep attraction for both of us. It comes out when he is discussing how he thinks and makes decisions. Super sexy but it's behind the scenes. Okay, so for instance, I have a guy friend who I would describe as curious. He is definitely smart, but curious is just the best way to describe him. We are just friends, though I think he kind of likes me, but I have made it clear for other compatibility reasons, that is not possible. But no one is putting on anything. I don't feel like our discussions are intense. They aren't all math equations or physics. We both discuss politics a lot, human behavior, health, travel, and then sometimes other random curiosities. No one is delving into super complicated theory for the most part. But we discuss curiosities. THAT is what I mean when it comes to intellect. I like to learn. I like when someone teaches me things. It is definitely part of the attraction for me. In this case, it's completely natural. And he and I have endless conversation. I know I need someone like that, who I can have that kind of conversation with. He and I don't flirt though. None of it is what I would call sparring or challenging, but it has depth and knowledge/intellect involved. Maybe engage in curious conversations about each other instead of topics, as a way to discover emotional compatibility? I don't mean get all crazy and intrusive of course, but instead of steering toward "out there" topics, bring it "in here". Just a little bit. Shared experiences and the emotional flavor they had. I know it sounds crazy coming from an avoidant but that is what the last few months have been about for me and it's pretty amazing what I've learned about myself and others. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:29:02 GMT
I totally agree. K loves my intelligence and I never even knew that was part of the attraction. He says it shows in how I run my business, how I respond to life and trouble, how I parent my kids. We don't go into deep intellectual conversations, neither of us enjoy that. But over time it's been a deep attraction for both of us. It comes out when he is discussing how he thinks and makes decisions. Super sexy but it's behind the scenes. Okay, so for instance, I have a guy friend who I would describe as curious. He is definitely smart, but curious is just the best way to describe him. We are just friends, though I think he kind of likes me, but I have made it clear for other compatibility reasons, that is not possible. But no one is putting on anything. I don't feel like our discussions are intense. They aren't all math equations or physics. We both discuss politics a lot, human behavior, health, travel, and then sometimes other random curiosities. No one is delving into super complicated theory for the most part. But we discuss curiosities. THAT is what I mean when it comes to intellect. I like to learn. I like when someone teaches me things. It is definitely part of the attraction for me. In this case, it's completely natural. And he and I have endless conversation. I know I need someone like that, who I can have that kind of conversation with. He and I don't flirt though. None of it is what I would call sparring or challenging, but it has depth and knowledge/intellect involved. yes for sure! I agree with you - that's not really sparring if it's just an exchange of ideas and knowledge. That's normal to me; i think it becomes a facade when one relies mainly or only on that sort of conversation to connect with another, and then use it to "spar" for more stimulation. the difficulty lies in knowing when that is happening. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:39:07 GMT
Okay, so for instance, I have a guy friend who I would describe as curious. He is definitely smart, but curious is just the best way to describe him. We are just friends, though I think he kind of likes me, but I have made it clear for other compatibility reasons, that is not possible. But no one is putting on anything. I don't feel like our discussions are intense. They aren't all math equations or physics. We both discuss politics a lot, human behavior, health, travel, and then sometimes other random curiosities. No one is delving into super complicated theory for the most part. But we discuss curiosities. THAT is what I mean when it comes to intellect. I like to learn. I like when someone teaches me things. It is definitely part of the attraction for me. In this case, it's completely natural. And he and I have endless conversation. I know I need someone like that, who I can have that kind of conversation with. He and I don't flirt though. None of it is what I would call sparring or challenging, but it has depth and knowledge/intellect involved. yes for sure! I agree with you - that's not really sparring if it's just an exchange of ideas and knowledge. That's normal to me; i think it becomes a facade when one relies mainly or only on that sort of conversation to connect with another, and then use it to "spar" for more stimulation. the difficulty lies in knowing when that is happening. I think self awareness is the key to knowing when it's happening. Because if you're doing it there is a good red flag- we all pick up and engage with each other on a subconscious level, as in: Like attracts like. Unavailable does attract unavailable for the most part. Games attract games. Illusion attracts illusions. There are people who disagree with that but none of them here are in secure relationships, they are recovering from yet another insecure one. At some point, we know. And, if someone is hard to figure out- another red flag haha. I think people are more simple than we make it out. Complications can often be traced back to our own way of thinking. If it looks like a duck plenty of people here would say it's a chicken. Know what I mean? Once you have awareness of yourself the whole world becomes less tricky. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 1:40:29 GMT
yes for sure! I agree with you - that's not really sparring if it's just an exchange of ideas and knowledge. That's normal to me; i think it becomes a facade when one relies mainly or only on that sort of conversation to connect with another, and then use it to "spar" for more stimulation. the difficulty lies in knowing when that is happening. I think this is another key phrase. Recognize the charge- and be aware of the hook. I've had to do that with myself- recognize the pull and question it. |
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Post by mrob on Dec 13, 2019 1:53:36 GMT
More uncomfortable by the minute...
I love sparring, a woman that speaks in more than three syllable words is enticing. Somebody that can communicate an idea, has a considered view of life makes my skin jump. That is something I try to sort out early. Perhaps I’ve had the cart before the horse.
This thread is surely proof that it’s not necessarily about what you do, it’s the intentions and motivations behind it.
I’d say we are the first generations in the western world to even have to give this a thought.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 2:01:21 GMT
mrob, intention and motivation does tend to come out in the wash. It's not always apparent immediately, but it makes itself known in other ways, too.
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Post by mrob on Dec 13, 2019 2:07:02 GMT
Which must be why, when weeding out the players, the softbois, and everyone else, to get into an FA situation and be ghosted after deactivation must be just awful. Never quite seen it that way before.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 2:25:43 GMT
Which must be why, when weeding out the players, the softbois, and everyone else, to get into an FA situation and be ghosted after deactivation must be just awful. Never quite seen it that way before. Yes, the approach/avoidance conflict does damage. To you also.  It thwarts your desire for connection and belonging. |
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Post by alexandra on Dec 13, 2019 3:28:56 GMT
Ok, so based off of all of this, I want to ask...HOW do I flirt? Or what is it about me that should be attractive to a man? Based off all this, you should flirt in whichever way you feel comfortable with and be you, and worry about whether or not you like whoever the guy is, not worry about how to adjust to attract one (besides, stating the obvious, adjusting --> keep working towards secure as like attracts like). Since all of these red flags do lie in intention, if you find a guy who values you for these things you already are and isn't insecure or a narc, then that may be a compatible one. The hyperviligence is just in training yourself to recognize when someone likes you only for what you provide them and how you make them feel without caring if they're providing the same for you. If you meet someone you get on with who isn't looking for entertainment, ego-validation, and isn't projecting all over you, then it won't matter that you're flirting as a nerdy intellectual. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 13, 2019 4:40:01 GMT
Ok, so based off of all of this, I want to ask...HOW do I flirt? Or what is it about me that should be attractive to a man? Based off all this, you should flirt in whichever way you feel comfortable with and be you, and worry about whether or not you like whoever the guy is, not worry about how to adjust to attract one (besides, stating the obvious, adjusting --> keep working towards secure as like attracts like). Since all of these red flags do lie in intention, if you find a guy who values you for these things you already are and isn't insecure or a narc, then that may be a compatible one. The hyperviligence is just in training yourself to recognize when someone likes you only for what you provide them and how you make them feel without caring if they're providing the same for you. If you meet someone you get on with who isn't looking for entertainment, ego-validation, and isn't projecting all over you, then it won't matter that you're flirting as a nerdy intellectual. Serious question: why flirt? I don't understand why that's even necessary. I do agree with just being you, with the strong caveat to be aware of yourself and if you're hiding, or not having boundaries in line with your real values. The basics of knowing your values, your strengths and weaknesses, and your potential blind spots goes a long way. Know when you're bullshitting yourself. As for flirting, if that's important than just be true to yourself and all of the above in that. I don't flirt, I am just direct if I am interested and would like to spend time with someone. But everyone is different. Is flirting an indirect mode of communicating that? I'm not saying indirect as though it's bad or inferior. I do understand flirting in the context of already in a relationship and wanting to play and be sexual. It is a lot of fun then, to flirt with someone you already are comfortable with. Anyway, I digress. But it does seem as flirting is confusing and misleading to a lot of people. Maybe it's just me but there seems to be a lot of weirdness around it. |
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It thwarts your desire for connection and belonging. 