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Post by nyc718 on Jan 8, 2020 19:39:27 GMT
Are you in therapy? My therapist isn't specialized in attachment, so everything I learned about attachment has been on my own. I did some hypnotherapy which helped me so much, and I also am about to embark on a 7 week group course with a therapist who specializes in attachment where there will be homework to do before the next meeting every week, and we get paired up with another woman to be in connection with and accountable to. I am looking forward to this and hope it brings me to another level of healing. Hugs to you! No I'm not in any therapy atm.. I cant afford it so totally relying on this forum to get me thru. Your very lucky to have found a group dedicated to attachment issues that sounds amazing. Hopefully you will share some of your learnings on hear if you have the time. I am feeling guilty today that I didnt appreciate how much my ex was trying to show up for me. In what ways was he showing up for you that you feel guilty not appreciating? Youtube has so many videos that are helpful. Look up Alan Robarge, Craig Kenneth, Thais Gibson, and also just put avoidant attachment in the search and a lot will pop up, as well as if you get more specific, like fearful avoidant, anxious attachment, etc. If I get anything beneficial from this group, I will share! I will also add that I have spent a small fortune on all the self care I have been doing in the past two months in terms of therapy, hypnotherapy, classes, etc. It's money that if my family knew I was spending, they would be really angry at me. But I see it as this is what I need to do right now for myself. I know it's not something that everyone has the resources for, and I also didn't always have the resources to do those things, but since I can now, I will. But like you, this forum has been SO very helpful. <3
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Post by Helsbells on Jan 8, 2020 19:39:42 GMT
We were together in total for a year and a half, and it was not our first breakup. I look back and see the breakups were my reactions to his distancing which fell pretty much in line with FA deactivation, so the first one at around 3-4 months, the second around 6-7 months, some squabbles here and there, and then a big blowup at around the one-year mark where we broke up for 2 months. Then we got back together for almost two months before he deactivated again, and we never got back on track and I broke it off. I only learned about attachment during the big two month breakup. By the end of the relationship, I knew he just didn't have what we needed to have a healthy relationship, so I ended it. It still hurts but I know there was no other choice. We went as far as we could go. That is very similar to my situation. The last two break ups got longer with him saying he was done, as I deserve more than he can give me. He always seemed so certain and went on the dating sites but always wanted to come back to me. Maybe he just didnt find better, and I was an easy option. I do think his own problems played a big part in him leaving aswell, he appears to hate himself so much of the time. Did you always stay in touch during your break ups and was it always him that came back to you. Hope you dont mind me asking hun x
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Post by alexandra on Jan 8, 2020 19:45:34 GMT
I touch on this in one post in the thread, but it's not a matter of now I'm attracted to only other secures. We still need to be compatible, have stuff in common, and physical attraction. Being secure on its own isn't enough to create the attraction. I just don't feel inexplicable ambivalence about it anymore. I still am sometimes attracted to avoidants, but then their behavior (and usually it comes with lack of maturity) is a turnoff, so nothing really develops. This is what makes me kind of sad and worried honestly: I felt outside of the attachment issues, I was compatible with my ex FA in that the stuff we had in common was exactly what I want in a man, as well as I was physically attracted to him, though he was hard on himself about his own physical appearance. Even my ex husband that I had been with for 10 years wasn't compatible with me in the way that ex FA and I liked so much of the same things, AND we were both open to discovering the new things each of us brought to the relationship. My ex husband was pretty stuck in his own interests. So losing my ex FA in that way has been really hard for me, as it's hard for me to imagine I'll meet someone else who can compare in that way This is kind of... I don't know the term, let's call it a false equivalency? I know what you mean, I found that day to day I was like 90% compatible with my LTR FA ex, when I never expected to find that much compatibility. We like all the same entertainment, large music overlap, compatible traveling, similar levels of outdoors and sports stuff, his friends and siblings all like me a lot because I get on with them just fine, we have a lot of fun together and hanging out without the feelings part is easy. But that 10% related to attachment is the more important part! If your partner can't show up consistently, can't communicate, can't problem-solve, can't pull extra weight if you're not at 100% (like, you're sick or facing a family emergency etc.), can't take care of themselves well (or you or your children together), isn't committed to being present... the rest just doesn't matter. You can't have a solid and viable healthy relationship, even if the more superficial part of the compatibility is all in line. It's just not the important part of a long-term relationship, though it works quite well for short-term and possibly for friendship.
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Post by Helsbells on Jan 8, 2020 19:45:41 GMT
No I'm not in any therapy atm.. I cant afford it so totally relying on this forum to get me thru. Your very lucky to have found a group dedicated to attachment issues that sounds amazing. Hopefully you will share some of your learnings on hear if you have the time. I am feeling guilty today that I didnt appreciate how much my ex was trying to show up for me. In what ways was he showing up for you that you feel guilty not appreciating? Youtube has so many videos that are helpful. Look up Alan Robarge, Craig Kenneth, Thais Gibson, and also just put avoidant attachment in the search and a lot will pop up, as well as if you get more specific, like fearful avoidant, anxious attachment, etc. If I get anything beneficial from this group, I will share! I will also add that I have spent a small fortune on all the self care I have been doing in the past two months in terms of therapy, hypnotherapy, classes, etc. It's money that if my family knew I was spending, they would be really angry at me. But I see it as this is what I need to do right now for myself. I know it's not something that everyone has the resources for, and I also didn't always have the resources to do those things, but since I can now, I will. But like you, this forum has been SO very helpful. <3 I guess wanting to meet my family, he cooked his first ever xmas dinner for me. Paying more attention to my daily concerns and even wanting me to join him on the computer. He bought an attachment that meant we could both wear earphones and join in his gaming. I know how this sounds a bit SAD, but for him I think it was a big deal lolz
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 8, 2020 19:57:55 GMT
I'm curious to know what happens after you've done the work on yourself and your subconscious, does your subconscious then allow you to be attracted to a secure? I had an interesting conversation with someone recently that made me think about this. She is definitely AP, as all the stories she tells me about her dating life makes it clear to me. Then she told me about another man who to me sounds secure, and she is not one bit attracted to him. She said to me, I don't know what's wrong with me, he's nice, he's available, and I say that's what I want, but here he is and I'm not interested. All the other men that she has told me about are all classic avoidants, and she knows they aren't good for her, but she keeps entertaining the back and forth with them. That got me to thinking about the subconscious being drawn to the familiar unhealed trauma. If you do some work on your subconscious as I have lately, will it then be aligned with the conscious to allow you to be attracted to someone secure who is consistent? Part of this thinking of mine is from the articles I have read about "nice guys" being boring, and I think that has mostly to do with the subconscious' twisted understanding of love meaning you have to work for it, etc. Since I am nowhere near ready to date again, I have no idea what is ahead of me when I do feel ready. I know to be cautious of the red flags that I've already dealt with, especially with my last few FAs, but beyond that, what will my subconscious dictate now that I've dealt with some of those childhood wounds? Will I be able to consciously see all that I need to see, or will I be blindsided again and only realize in hindsight the signs that weren't so clear to me at the time they happened? Anyone have any insight into this? And I apologize if this post should have been in another section. I feel I am here most often so that is why I am posting here. I am open to knowing if this would be better in another section. On the flip side from a secure, there is never a guarantee, I myself have dated an A-P (5 years ago) a family friend, this is where I learnt about codependency and attachment theory initially, then only the other year the F-A hence why i'm here. I actually have only picked up and read about attachment theory the past 12 months again and more recently CPTSD in past 5 months or so. So you can be attracted to anyone really, the insecure attached relationships lasted 3 months each, very unstable. I think only a relationship with an avoidant will drag out due to protest behaviours. The F-A for me was more intoxicating, because she literally was really nice and fawned after me, the A-P didn't have any money to fawn, was trying to be nice, but blew up big time very early over nothing (and continued with passive aggressive manoeuvres and using sex as a weapon on top of other behaviour) , what probably even dragged that one on was the fact I was around her a lot early on hence satiating the fears of abandonment, totally out of character for me, due to being family friends. The F-A was starting to become really negative and heading into a depressed state, very hypervigilant when I set boundaries (no friends only lovers while in limbo in push-pull cycle) whilst flipping from A-P to D-A around the 3 month mark, we met through mutual friends who are very securely attached individuals, which also was a factor in the overall interaction. But certainly ALL my relationships have largely been different and ended due to different reasons. I remember my A-P gf said to me early on "all my relationships are the same, I get taken for granted and drained of everything and they leave", red flag right there, relationships are never the same, ever period, if they are, then definitely the attachment style is driving who you meet and who you are attracted too. The classic anxious-avoidant dance clearly, which totally makes sense to me. All my relationships have been largely secure, maybe one in mid 20s erring on the side of slight A-P, but not much in retrospect (all on a spectrum). Just purely personal preferences, emotional availability, and other variable reasons. It's just as a secure you can sit down and talk about any issue large or small in a more centred way, and non-reactionary, and this is due to emotional regulation
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 8, 2020 20:10:44 GMT
No I'm not in any therapy atm.. I cant afford it so totally relying on this forum to get me thru. Your very lucky to have found a group dedicated to attachment issues that sounds amazing. Hopefully you will share some of your learnings on hear if you have the time. I am feeling guilty today that I didnt appreciate how much my ex was trying to show up for me. In what ways was he showing up for you that you feel guilty not appreciating? Youtube has so many videos that are helpful. Look up Alan Robarge, Craig Kenneth, Thais Gibson, and also just put avoidant attachment in the search and a lot will pop up, as well as if you get more specific, like fearful avoidant, anxious attachment, etc. If I get anything beneficial from this group, I will share! I will also add that I have spent a small fortune on all the self care I have been doing in the past two months in terms of therapy, hypnotherapy, classes, etc. It's money that if my family knew I was spending, they would be really angry at me. But I see it as this is what I need to do right now for myself. I know it's not something that everyone has the resources for, and I also didn't always have the resources to do those things, but since I can now, I will. But like you, this forum has been SO very helpful. <3 I tell you who also seems to be raw, and has definitely healed herself from a very precarious place, is Liberty Cairde. Literally talked to her on Zoom. Check her out on Facebook and Youtube, she has some good advice and she was the one who told me about Pete Walkers book CPTSD: From surviving to thriving. She has nearly earnt a secure attachment in only a couple years. Really heartwarming stuff. And her video on Youtube, having a moment, literally brought a tear to my eye, a must see, so you know how a F-A deals day to day.
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 8, 2020 20:27:44 GMT
This is kind of... I don't know the term, let's call it a false equivalency? I know what you mean, I found that day to day I was like 90% compatible with my LTR FA ex, when I never expected to find that much compatibility. We like all the same entertainment, large music overlap, compatible traveling, similar levels of outdoors and sports stuff, his friends and siblings all like me a lot because I get on with them just fine, we have a lot of fun together and hanging out without the feelings part is easy. But that 10% related to attachment is the more important part! If your partner can't show up consistently, can't communicate, can't problem-solve, can't pull extra weight if you're not at 100% (like, you're sick or facing a family emergency etc.), can't take care of themselves well (or you or your children together), isn't committed to being present... the rest just doesn't matter. You can't have a solid and viable healthy relationship, even if the more superficial part of the compatibility is all in line. It's just not the important part of a long-term relationship, though it works quite well for short-term and possibly for friendship. Oh no, I totally get that, that's why I walked away and am not looking back, because the attachment part is absolutely the most important part. I can't have a relationship with anyone if the attachment issues aren't solidly in place. And that's why it was so difficult for me to leave before I did, besides just being in love with him, I was attached to the fact that we were so compatible in our interests in a way I had never been with any other man (except my high school boyfriend from when I was 15 years old :-) But it's also kind of why it feels like a double loss - the attachment part isn't there, but I'm also losing what I felt like I had finally found after all these other relationships in my life, the man who finally got me, my interests, etc, and me finally finding the man who had the same interests, and also expanded me even further in those areas with who he knew and the circles he was in, and me expanding him also with who and what I know. Believe me, I have replayed in my head many times how much I miss that connection, but how because he can't make me feel secure because of his continual distancing, then none of that other compatibility matters because it's not a strong enough bond to hold us together. I have felt the loss greatly, and yet I know there's no other option but to let it all go :-(
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 8, 2020 20:35:17 GMT
That is very similar to my situation. The last two break ups got longer with him saying he was done, as I deserve more than he can give me. He always seemed so certain and went on the dating sites but always wanted to come back to me. Maybe he just didnt find better, and I was an easy option. I do think his own problems played a big part in him leaving aswell, he appears to hate himself so much of the time. Did you always stay in touch during your break ups and was it always him that came back to you. Hope you dont mind me asking hun x No, we weren't in touch during the breakups. In the first few breakups, it was he who swung anxious and contacted me. I'm not sure looking back if I would have contacted him after that very first kind of breakup/fight we had, because I wasn't very invested at the time. And at that time when he did come back around, he said all the right things to me to make me think he was emotionally available - "I'm sorry. I haven't been in a relationship for a while so I forget sometimes how to act, I do want you in my life. I never want to hurt you." I mean, there was no way I could say no, right? Though I look back and of course seeing the whole picture, I feel like I could have saved myself some heartache if I had trusted my initial instincts. But I do have to say though overall, this relationship isn't one that I regret. As much as it hurts to not be with him, he wasn't a malicious person who intentionally tried to harm me. I truly hope in the future when we are both no longer attached, that we can somehow have some kind of a friendship, if not for our mutual interests, as we had many. And I had a lot of good times with him in that year and a half. I don't wish him ill at all, only good.
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 8, 2020 20:59:50 GMT
In what ways was he showing up for you that you feel guilty not appreciating? I guess wanting to meet my family, he cooked his first ever xmas dinner for me. Paying more attention to my daily concerns and even wanting me to join him on the computer. He bought an attachment that meant we could both wear earphones and join in his gaming. I know how this sounds a bit SAD, but for him I think it was a big deal lolz I mean, it may have indeed been a big deal for him, but remember, those are things that pretty much anyone is supposed to do in a secure relationship, you know? You appreciating or not has nothing to do with if he can show up for someone in a relationship on a deeper level. Anyone can do any kind of actions, but if they can't show up emotionally then the things they "do" really can't hold things together alone.
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Post by Helsbells on Jan 8, 2020 21:01:46 GMT
Did you always stay in touch during your break ups and was it always him that came back to you. Hope you dont mind me asking hun x No, we weren't in touch during the breakups. In the first few breakups, it was he who swung anxious and contacted me. I'm not sure looking back if I would have contacted him after that very first kind of breakup/fight we had, because I wasn't very invested at the time. And at that time when he did come back around, he said all the right things to me to make me think he was emotionally available - "I'm sorry. I haven't been in a relationship for a while so I forget sometimes how to act, I do want you in my life. I never want to hurt you." I mean, there was no way I could say no, right? Though I look back and of course seeing the whole picture, I feel like I could have saved myself some heartache if I had trusted my initial instincts. But I do have to say though overall, this relationship isn't one that I regret. As much as it hurts to not be with him, he wasn't a malicious person who intentionally tried to harm me. I truly hope in the future when we are both no longer attached, that we can somehow have some kind of a friendship, if not for our mutual interests, as we had many. And I had a lot of good times with him in that year and a half. I don't wish him ill at all, only good. I feel the same about my ex. He is very special and dear to me and I care about him very much. I dont have any enemies and I'm a loving caring person so maybe one day when fully healed we could be friends too. He is in touch with lots of women he has had short term flings with but the two that he had long term, longest being 3 yrs and he told me he loved them he cant handle having any contact with them as they broke his heart. So who knows but I have know I'll feelings towards him.
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Post by Helsbells on Jan 8, 2020 21:05:32 GMT
I guess wanting to meet my family, he cooked his first ever xmas dinner for me. Paying more attention to my daily concerns and even wanting me to join him on the computer. He bought an attachment that meant we could both wear earphones and join in his gaming. I know how this sounds a bit SAD, but for him I think it was a big deal lolz I mean, it may have indeed been a big deal for him, but remember, those are things that pretty much anyone is supposed to do in a secure relationship, you know? You appreciating or not has nothing to do with if he can show up for someone in a relationship on a deeper level. Anyone can do any kind of actions, but if they can't show up emotionally then the things they "do" really can't hold things together alone. Absolutely and that has played out to many times for my liking. As much as I loved him I will never reach out to him again for friendship or whatever. I know I will have my weak moments but I will never get in touch with him again. Hes blocked me anyway but we all know ways around that, I will post here first if the desire gets that bad and you can all kick my arse into place 🤣🤣
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Post by amber on Jan 9, 2020 3:03:35 GMT
In what ways was he showing up for you that you feel guilty not appreciating? Youtube has so many videos that are helpful. Look up Alan Robarge, Craig Kenneth, Thais Gibson, and also just put avoidant attachment in the search and a lot will pop up, as well as if you get more specific, like fearful avoidant, anxious attachment, etc. If I get anything beneficial from this group, I will share! I will also add that I have spent a small fortune on all the self care I have been doing in the past two months in terms of therapy, hypnotherapy, classes, etc. It's money that if my family knew I was spending, they would be really angry at me. But I see it as this is what I need to do right now for myself. I know it's not something that everyone has the resources for, and I also didn't always have the resources to do those things, but since I can now, I will. But like you, this forum has been SO very helpful. <3 I guess wanting to meet my family, he cooked his first ever xmas dinner for me. Paying more attention to my daily concerns and even wanting me to join him on the computer. He bought an attachment that meant we could both wear earphones and join in his gaming. I know how this sounds a bit SAD, but for him I think it was a big deal lolz I love this but do these men exist?! I’m beginning to seriously wonder. Also, if I met s exure man who had a relatively normal good childhood and normal life,I just couldn’t relate to him. I’ve had such an odd life, that I think I would need someone who could deeply understand what I’ve gine through on an experiential level
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Post by serenity on Jan 9, 2020 10:21:10 GMT
There are lot of guys out there who have wounds and troubles who have learned to communiciate, have empathy for other people's wounds, and are not avoidant. Look for empathy first, its amazing what you can make work in a relationship if both of you are empaths who care about one another and communicate well.
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Post by lovebunny on Jan 9, 2020 13:20:47 GMT
All that seems to be happening for me since I started really working on myself is that I give up and walk away from people faster in the presence of red flags. Maybe I move on just a little bitter faster after heartbreak. It certainly hasn't led to me finding someone secure that I'm attracted to and who is attracted to me.
This is the longest stretch (7 months) I've not been in a relationship since I left my marriage 5 years ago.
The problem with all this is you can sweep your own side of the street until it gleams. Still no guarantee the right person's gonna walk on it.
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Post by annieb on Jan 12, 2020 17:00:33 GMT
I’m five months out of a relationship with DA, whom I met online and one thing I’m incapable of doing is going online again to date. I’ve downloaded the app a couple times and erased it within 10-15 minutes. So, if I meet someone it will most likely be in real life. And I’m ok with that. I’m just going to live my life and if anyone crosses my path in real life and asks me out. I will go out. Otherwise I will stay single. I don’t know if this is avoidant behavior. I am fearful avoidant, but I’m testing secure at the moment.
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