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Post by kittygirl on Jan 10, 2020 2:30:48 GMT
Hello to the forum. So if you don't know my story, a very quick recap: 6 months, LDR with diagnosed FA man. He lost his job and started to pull away, things got worse to the point where I was solely responsible for our communication and he would take over a day to respond to texts, wouldn't call me, we went a week without speaking etc.
I decided I didn't want to do that and we had a very heartfelt conversation in which I told him what my needs were and he let me know he couldn't focus on them because he was simply too depressed and that he needed to be alone to figure out a plan. I told him not to worry, how much I cared for him but that I would need time apart with no contact to move on with my life so we could be friends. This was a month ago
I am now almost consumed with guilt and a desire to reach out because I feel like a "kinder" person wouldn't have done that. I feel like I kicked someone when they were down and it's bothering me so much. Like I can't imagine the nice people on this forum having done that. I absolutely feel like we shouldn't be in a relationship, but I wonder if it was terribly unkind for me to leave someone alone in their time of need without my support.
I don't know what is going on as I have literally never had guilt like this before after a breakup. I want to reach out to him but my friend (I have mentioned him as he was in a relationship with an FA woman which has caused him so much pain) told me "I don't see how you reaching out is ever going to make you feel better." So I haven't. But I can't tell if I am being too hard on myself or if I really should be the bigger person and reach out (as a friend of course). I also have always tested secure (and I recently asked a few of my exes if they would categorize me that way and they all said yes but the consensus was maybe a little "too independent at times"-so on the avoidant side which I do agree with) but I am feeling all sorts of anxious about this and I can't tell if it's normal anxiety post breakup or what. I am more or less miserable to be honest.
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 10, 2020 2:41:26 GMT
he let me know he couldn't focus on them because he was simply too depressed and that he needed to be alone to figure out a plan. I told him not to worry, how much I cared for him but that I would need time apart with no contact to move on with my life so we could be friends.
Don't forget that he was withdrawing from the relationship first, and he said he is too depressed and needed to be alone. You didn't "abandon" him, you complied with his request while honoring what you needed at the time. Plus you said he was diagnosed FA, meaning, he was feeling the subconscious need to distance. I think you miss him and your mind is trying to give you reasons to contact him, but you didn't do anything to feel guilty about. At the end of the day, he knows how to contact you if he wanted to. Hugs to you. |
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 10, 2020 2:45:33 GMT
I think you are exactly right. I am looking for an excuse probably. Thank you SO Much. This is what i needed to hear
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Post by mrob on Jan 11, 2020 11:02:13 GMT
On an aeroplane, the stewards tell passengers to put their own masks on before helping others, including children. Sometimes it’s like that in relationships as well.
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jules
Full Member
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Post by jules on Jan 11, 2020 11:26:41 GMT
On an aeroplane, the stewards tell passengers to put their own masks on before helping others, including children. Sometimes it’s like that in relationships as well. Absolutely yesss! If I am not ok I am in no position to be helping others. I have actually used this analogy with Sponsees. Lol |
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jules
Full Member
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Post by jules on Jan 11, 2020 11:34:54 GMT
No contact is difficult. It's predominantly sold as a way to get him or her back.If you research further it's really about getting back to yourself.
It is ok to feel like you miss him. Its uncomfy, I know. I'm going through this right now. So the solution can be either contact him or sit through your uncomfortable feelings and get past it. I have been noodling on this for 10 days now. I choose the latter. This is life on its terms and I accept it. I have this in my kitchen as of a week ago:
"God grant me the serenity to accept the people I cannot change, the courage to change the one I can, and the wisdom to know it's me"
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 11, 2020 18:04:55 GMT
Thank you jules for your advice here. Yeah I asked for no contact with him as a way to move on (and made that clear to him at the time-that it wasn't being done manipulatively or for any reason other than what I was stating-to move forward). Yeah it's uncomfortable for SURE but also has really made me think a lot about my own issues in ways I never had to before. Dating secure men allowed me a LOT of leeway in terms of my own bullshit-I used the analogy the other day that it's like I was painting up on a ladder and I had my secure partners holding the ladder below me. If I started to fall, they were always right there to adjust the ladder so I never really learned a more efficient painting method. I got away with being sloppy. THEN I had this FA man come into my life like a meteor and suddenly I was painting all by myself.No one was holding the ladder. Nothing has helped me to see that actually-I'm not all that great at painting as it turns out. I need to do a LOT more work on myself. I will look back on this all as a gift. WHat he taught me about myself. Just hard right now. AND....as an update I fought through the discomfort and still haven't talked to him. I figure he and I BOTH need people in our lives who mean what they say and say what they mean. So if I say I will contact him when Im ready to be friends, that has to be sincere. mrob For whatever reason, that analogy REALLY resonated with me. No joke-I almost felt like I was going to cry or something??? (uhhh have I mentioned this whole thing has made me completely emotionally irrational and all over the place? ha fun stuff). I need to shift my thinking about it-sometimes "perceived" selfishness isn't selfish at all. Thank you |
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Post by serenity on Jan 11, 2020 21:40:13 GMT
Thank you jules for your advice here. Yeah I asked for no contact with him as a way to move on (and made that clear to him at the time-that it wasn't being done manipulatively or for any reason other than what I was stating-to move forward). Yeah it's uncomfortable for SURE but also has really made me think a lot about my own issues in ways I never had to before. Dating secure men allowed me a LOT of leeway in terms of my own bullshit-I used the analogy the other day that it's like I was painting up on a ladder and I had my secure partners holding the ladder below me. If I started to fall, they were always right there to adjust the ladder so I never really learned a more efficient painting method. I got away with being sloppy. THEN I had this FA man come into my life like a meteor and suddenly I was painting all by myself.No one was holding the ladder. Nothing has helped me to see that actually-I'm not all that great at painting as it turns out. I need to do a LOT more work on myself. I will look back on this all as a gift. WHat he taught me about myself. Just hard right now. AND....as an update I fought through the discomfort and still haven't talked to him. I figure he and I BOTH need people in our lives who mean what they say and say what they mean. So if I say I will contact him when Im ready to be friends, that has to be sincere. mrob For whatever reason, that analogy REALLY resonated with me. No joke-I almost felt like I was going to cry or something??? (uhhh have I mentioned this whole thing has made me completely emotionally irrational and all over the place? ha fun stuff). I need to shift my thinking about it-sometimes "perceived" selfishness isn't selfish at all. Thank you I see a lot of partners of avoidants adapting to the relationship this way.. convincing themselves not to need anything much, that being alone and forfeiting intimacy, care, and inter-dependent connection is somehow `growth'. Its not though. Its maladaptive & cognitive dissonant IMO, a reaction to serious neglect, traumatic bonding, and addictive intermittent reinforcement. There are close to 7.7 billion people on the planet who do not love, care or support you. Is it really too much to want just one who does? I don't believe so. The care and love you sincerely have towards your ex can transform into friendship eventually if there is a mutually beneficial reason for it. You don't have to throw the bathwater out with the baby, but you do need to get to the point where you give up toxic hope for a healthy romantic relationship with someone incapable of giving it to you IMO. 3-6 months no contact, rather than just one, is a more realistic time frame IMO (I am friend's with both my FA exes, and extremely grateful now not to be in a romantic relationship with either) |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 11, 2020 22:12:12 GMT
Thank you jules for your advice here. Yeah I asked for no contact with him as a way to move on (and made that clear to him at the time-that it wasn't being done manipulatively or for any reason other than what I was stating-to move forward). Yeah it's uncomfortable for SURE but also has really made me think a lot about my own issues in ways I never had to before. Dating secure men allowed me a LOT of leeway in terms of my own bullshit-I used the analogy the other day that it's like I was painting up on a ladder and I had my secure partners holding the ladder below me. If I started to fall, they were always right there to adjust the ladder so I never really learned a more efficient painting method. I got away with being sloppy. THEN I had this FA man come into my life like a meteor and suddenly I was painting all by myself.No one was holding the ladder. Nothing has helped me to see that actually-I'm not all that great at painting as it turns out. I need to do a LOT more work on myself. I will look back on this all as a gift. WHat he taught me about myself. Just hard right now. AND....as an update I fought through the discomfort and still haven't talked to him. I figure he and I BOTH need people in our lives who mean what they say and say what they mean. So if I say I will contact him when Im ready to be friends, that has to be sincere. mrob For whatever reason, that analogy REALLY resonated with me. No joke-I almost felt like I was going to cry or something??? (uhhh have I mentioned this whole thing has made me completely emotionally irrational and all over the place? ha fun stuff). I need to shift my thinking about it-sometimes "perceived" selfishness isn't selfish at all. Thank you I see a lot of partners of avoidants adapting to the relationship this way.. convincing themselves not to need anything much, that being alone and forfeiting intimacy, care, and inter-dependent connection is somehow `growth'. Its not though. Its maladaptive & cognitive dissonant IMO, a reaction to serious neglect, traumatic bonding, and addictive intermittent reinforcement. There are close to 7.7 billion people on the planet who do not love, care or support you. Is it really too much to want just one who does? I don't believe so. The care and love you sincerely have towards your ex can transform into friendship eventually if there is a mutually beneficial reason for it. You don't have to throw the bathwater out with the baby, but you do need to get to the point where you give up toxic hope for a healthy romantic relationship with someone incapable of giving it to you IMO. 3-6 months no contact, rather than just one, is a more realistic time frame IMO (I am friend's with both my FA exes, and extremely grateful now not to be in a romantic relationship with either) I'll just add from my experience, you may need to literally read and understand trauma, and how an F-A truly works, to fully detach. It's what I did. I literally had to understand what the hell had just happened to me. Particularly trauma baseline. It woke me up to the fact, she will cycle not only myself, but others in the same way, with varying lengths of time based on the partners own attachment style and dynamics, and it gets worse once they know you. The initial whirlwind mindblowing connection is just that, exactly the same with everyone they connect too basically, then the classic push-pull and avoidance. My ex from what I can gather has done it to everyone she's been with. I seem to be the most healthy of all partners and lasted the least time 3 months (+6 month push-pull), the rest ranged from 4 years ex hubby (cheated on her), 9 months (controlling either A-P or Narc tendency) and a 15 monther (LDR and he cheated) all in the last 12 years. And these tendencies make total sense if you look at the 4Fs and how they correspond and instigate attachment bonding. You can actually be of assistance to them as well, in the form of support if they wish, you may literally be the catalyst in helping someone develop somewhat healthy bonding and intimacy levels. |
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 11, 2020 22:57:21 GMT
There are close to 7.7 billion people on the planet who do not love, care or support you. Is it really too much to want just one who does? I don't believe so. WOW! I had never thought of it this way but you are right. Some of this behavior may be completely subconscious because I know he talked about being in a "freeze state" (his words- and we had never used that term with each other ever so I was surprised when he said it), but I have no doubt that some of it is just pushing me away (and me specifically as i know he is talking to other women and is extremely active on his social media). Which is ok as I have accepted all that but you are right and at the end of the day that was why I felt justified in calling him out EVEN THOUGH i knew he was going through some real shit. I am very glad to know that friendship is possible with an FA ex! I think you are right with that time frame. I need to make sure that when I go back to friends it is that I am accepting him EXACTLY as he is and have zero agenda or hope for any sort of relationship (that part is really starting to get better as time goes on which kicks ass. It feels good). Thanks for these insights |
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 11, 2020 23:16:53 GMT
I see a lot of partners of avoidants adapting to the relationship this way.. convincing themselves not to need anything much, that being alone and forfeiting intimacy, care, and inter-dependent connection is somehow `growth'. Its not though. Its maladaptive & cognitive dissonant IMO, a reaction to serious neglect, traumatic bonding, and addictive intermittent reinforcement. There are close to 7.7 billion people on the planet who do not love, care or support you. Is it really too much to want just one who does? I don't believe so. The care and love you sincerely have towards your ex can transform into friendship eventually if there is a mutually beneficial reason for it. You don't have to throw the bathwater out with the baby, but you do need to get to the point where you give up toxic hope for a healthy romantic relationship with someone incapable of giving it to you IMO. 3-6 months no contact, rather than just one, is a more realistic time frame IMO (I am friend's with both my FA exes, and extremely grateful now not to be in a romantic relationship with either) I'll just add from my experience, you may need to literally read and understand trauma, and how an F-A truly works, to fully detach. It's what I did. I literally had to understand what the hell had just happened to me. Particularly trauma baseline. It woke me up to the fact, she will cycle not only myself, but others in the same way, with varying lengths of time based on the partners own attachment style and dynamics, and it gets worse once they know you. The initial whirlwind mindblowing connection is just that, exactly the same with everyone they connect too basically, then the classic push-pull and avoidance. My ex from what I can gather has done it to everyone she's been with. I seem to be the most healthy of all partners and lasted the least time 3 months (+6 month push-pull), the rest ranged from 4 years ex hubby (cheated on her), 9 months (controlling either A-P or Narc tendency) and a 15 monther (LDR and he cheated) all in the last 12 years. And these tendencies make total sense if you look at the 4Fs and how they correspond and instigate attachment bonding. You can actually be of assistance to them as well, in the form of support if they wish, you may literally be the catalyst in helping someone develop somewhat healthy bonding and intimacy levels. @dualcitizen funny you should say that! I LITERALLY bought "from surviving to thriving" a few days ago based on your recommendation! It looks so interesting. I figure I will keep it on hand as a resource, but I also know I can't devote too much of my mental energy into trying to "understand" him or I will just be allowing him to occupy my mental space too much (by the way I am not insinuating this is what happened with you or your situation at all, but it's how *I* get and so I have to have strict boundaries when it comes to allowing myself to focus on other people too much). My exe's trauma was extremely severe and he has CPTSD along with so many other trauma related issues including his FA attachment. He is one of the most amazing people I have ever known (and UGH he has like the perfect face....i can't help it I love his damn face! hahahah) but he has such a long way to go that I will likely have to appreciate him from afar and those will just be the terms.
Someone on these boards had the best analogy that their FA ex was like a beautiful, but caged tiger. Get too close and it will lunge. In my case, my ex is like a beautiful, wild horse. If I get to close he will spook and run. He's just too wild and too scared. That spirit is ironically one of the things I appreciated a lot about him (until I realized it controlled him and caused him so much pain) , but it's something that only he can tackle.
My friend who is a therapist had a GREAT idea...she told me "Why don't you consider volunteering with abused children as a way of feeling like you are connecting with people who need your help but people who actually want it". I used to be a GAL (guardian ad litem) for abused children and I am looking into starting that up again. Really doing my best to turn this into a positive. I think this book will help me with that as well! Thanks to you and all the TRULY exceptional people who frequent these boards.
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 11, 2020 23:29:29 GMT
I'll just add from my experience, you may need to literally read and understand trauma, and how an F-A truly works, to fully detach. It's what I did. I literally had to understand what the hell had just happened to me. Particularly trauma baseline. It woke me up to the fact, she will cycle not only myself, but others in the same way, with varying lengths of time based on the partners own attachment style and dynamics, and it gets worse once they know you. The initial whirlwind mindblowing connection is just that, exactly the same with everyone they connect too basically, then the classic push-pull and avoidance. My ex from what I can gather has done it to everyone she's been with. I seem to be the most healthy of all partners and lasted the least time 3 months (+6 month push-pull), the rest ranged from 4 years ex hubby (cheated on her), 9 months (controlling either A-P or Narc tendency) and a 15 monther (LDR and he cheated) all in the last 12 years. And these tendencies make total sense if you look at the 4Fs and how they correspond and instigate attachment bonding. You can actually be of assistance to them as well, in the form of support if they wish, you may literally be the catalyst in helping someone develop somewhat healthy bonding and intimacy levels. @dualcitizen funny you should say that! I LITERALLY bought "from surviving to thriving" a few days ago based on your recommendation! It looks so interesting. I figure I will keep it on hand as a resource, but I also know I can't devote too much of my mental energy into trying to "understand" him or I will just be allowing him to occupy my mental space too much (by the way I am not insinuating this is what happened with you or your situation at all, but it's how *I* get and so I have to have strict boundaries when it comes to allowing myself to focus on other people too much). My exe's trauma was extremely severe and he has CPTSD along with so many other trauma related issues including his FA attachment. He is one of the most amazing people I have ever known (and UGH he has like the perfect face....i can't help it I love his damn face! hahahah) but he has such a long way to go that I will likely have to appreciate him from afar and those will just be the terms.
Someone on these boards had the best analogy that their FA ex was like a beautiful, but caged tiger. Get too close and it will lunge. In my case, my ex is like a beautiful, wild horse. If I get to close he will spook and run. He's just too wild and too scared. That spirit is ironically one of the things I appreciated a lot about him (until I realized it controlled him and caused him so much pain) , but it's something that only he can tackle.
My friend who is a therapist had a GREAT idea...she told me "Why don't you consider volunteering with abused children as a way of feeling like you are connecting with people who need your help but people who actually want it". I used to be a GAL (guardian ad litem) for abused children and I am looking into starting that up again. Really doing my best to turn this into a positive. I think this book will help me with that as well! Thanks to you and all the TRULY exceptional people who frequent these boards.
Thanks very much Kitty appreciate it, and if I can help others realise in some even small way, what is going on, it'll make me happy, as I was myself hurt from the experience initially and turned it into a positive as I always try to do. A more healthy rumination. |
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