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Post by howpredictable on Oct 14, 2018 2:57:55 GMT
>>what does an avoidant flipped to anxious ruminate about?
This is a great question, Juniper. I've read the posts by APs, and I would say my thought processes are not the same. One minor exception: As with APs, there is a slight fantasy element to it, where I'm strategizing to get a more intimate connection, but I also know (being avoidant) there is only so far that I can go.
That said, my own thinking might be unrelated to the underlying Attachment problems. Because in my particular case, I have an overlay of narcissistic tendencies, so the low-self-worth aspect is missing. Plus I have high control needs.
So in my case, I'm constantly plotting to orchestrate a scenario where the Avoidant partner feels like they miss me, feels a sense of loss, feels jealousy, etc. or otherwise is corralled into a situation which allows them to overcome their own avoidance long enough to reach out to me. That's what I plot and scheme about. Getting an FA to respond is relatively easy; but obviously a DA is a hard nut to crack.
It's forcing connection by starving the other person of it. With a fellow Avoidant, it can be a long wait. |
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 14, 2018 3:13:31 GMT
>>what does an avoidant flipped to anxious ruminate about? This is a great question, Juniper. I've read the posts by APs, and I would say my thought processes are not the same. However, that may be unrelated to the underlying Attachment problems. Because in my particular case, I have an overlay of narcissistic tendencies, so the low-self-worth aspect is missing. Plus I have high control needs. So in my case, I'm constantly plotting to orchestrate a scenario where the Avoidant partner feels like they miss me, feels a sense of loss, feels jealousy, etc. or otherwise is corralled into a situation which allows them to overcome their own avoidance long enough to reach out to me. That's what I plot and scheme about. It's forcing connection by starving the other person of it. With a fellow avoidant, it can be a long wait. Hmmm...that does not sound like typical AP behavior....it sounds like protest behavior...but my normal AP ruminations are fearing how easy it is that I could be abandoned and left..and my scheming (although I am not partial to that word) is to try to figure out how to meet my partner's needs....typically through encouragement, affirmation...in essense I don't starve my partner..if anything I am prone to smother. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2018 3:58:37 GMT
i can't remember what i thought when i felt the anxiety.
i do remember the physical feeling of anxiety around the relationship tho.
but i kind of snapped and thought
"i cannot give this all this power over me!"
and for a couple days when it cropped up i tamped it down by rebelling against going out of control of myself.
i think i broke up with him also- but it didn't last.
the overthinking i have done has been related to figuring out how i feel, what to do, how to do this, and how to protect myself, and trying to understand what is normal and healthy or not. stuff like that. but i couldn't say it feels like anxiety.
i wonder what other avoidants who have flipped to anxious actually experience around that, i was thinking it meant going into AP mode just like an AP?
but would that make one FA?
i think i just get more confused about all of it.
i have to try to stop figuring it out. i keep wondering if i am really dismissive. which probably seems silly from the outside. i don't know! i think i've had too much going on lately for anything to make sense!!
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Post by howpredictable on Oct 14, 2018 4:25:53 GMT
>> wonder what other avoidants who have flipped to anxious actually experience around that, i was thinking it meant going into AP mode just like an AP?
but would that make one FA?
Hmm. Not quite, at least not for me. I certainly don't flip to full-on AP: Because my core attachment style is Avoidant, so I'm never aiming for the type of connection that APs seem to be after. And I don't struggle with the "Am I good enough?" issue.
Yet FA doesn't quite describe it either. Because I don't think I ruminate on whether the partner is about to leave me entirely.
If I date someone even more Avoidant than me, I still have a DA underpinning but need to get things to where I'm comfortable. Which is still a distant, not-too-intimate connection. It's just that really severe DAs are too far along the connection spectrum for my tastes, so I work to get them within my range. Which is still nowhere near what APs need.
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 14, 2018 4:57:30 GMT
Personally...I used to think that I would exhibit DA behaviors when I was pursued by someone more AP then me...but I get the impression that they aren't truly DA behaviors as much as they are avoidance like behaviors as interpreted through my AP lens.
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Post by howpredictable on Oct 14, 2018 12:49:37 GMT
Yeah, not AP stuff. AP honestly don't feel like we are plotting and scheming. On the plotting: This may be more a function of my own personality, and what I mention are some tangential relational issues that I have, borne from other dysfunction in my family of origin.
But in any case -- and aside from the few self-aware DAs who come to this board -- there are probably very few of us in an Avoidant/Avoidant pairing in the first place, that could be polled. Usually these kinds of relationships never get off the ground.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 14, 2018 12:59:51 GMT
Personally...I used to think that I would exhibit DA behaviors when I was pursued by someone more AP then me...but I get the impression that they aren't truly DA behaviors as much as they are avoidance like behaviors as interpreted through my AP lens. there are times when i thought i was being anxious but the narrative is so different... but fear and self preservation underlies it all. |
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 14, 2018 13:59:35 GMT
Yeah, not AP stuff. AP honestly don't feel like we are plotting and scheming. On the plotting: This may be more a function of my own personality, and what I mention are some tangential relational issues that I have, borne from other dysfunction in my family of origin.
But in any case -- and aside from the few self-aware DAs who come to this board -- there are probably very few of us in an Avoidant/Avoidant pairing in the first place, that could be polled. Usually these kinds of relationships never get off the ground.
....I want to acknowledge that your version of anxious preoccupied is very real....it just isn't what those of us whose attachment is AP experience. Part of what I have come to realize is that what I would have described as avoidance isn't really that at all....it is my interpretation fed by what I experienced as a child from my parents, what I have read on the Internet and my own feelings/actions that I label as avoidance. That is why I like these boards so much...I am forced to face my misconceptions head on and see how I have mislabeled others. It is also helping me to take a pause and see that some of what I experienced as a child was not my fault or my responsibility, while acknowledging the very real issues that my parents were going through. Put another way, my mom's avoidance like behaviors were not about me and I now have a chance to see her for who she truly is without thinking I need to save her, encourage her, take on her pain, feel shame that she and I are different, or personalize the sense that I am not good enough and try to people please her by changing me or apologize for being me.<---This sentence was hard to write and I cried through it...which shows how resistant I am to change a dynamic with my mom that frankly is not working...but I am committed to push through that resistance. Back to the topic at hand...I really like when others share their personal experiences of their attachment because I learn so much. 💕💕 |
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Post by howpredictable on Oct 14, 2018 14:29:58 GMT
Hi tnr9,
Thanks for the comments. It sounds like you are doing some very important work around the dynamic and relationship with your mom. That can be very challenging, and I applaud your progress so far.
I did this kind of work several years ago. I have accepted my parents fully, and don't fault them for their shortcomings in nurturing me when I was young. I am at peace with everything. In truth, both of them had very difficult childhoods of their own, with poor role models, and this meant their own parenting skills were very limited when it came time to raise me. They did their best. Just as I'm doing my best with my own kids, who have an Avoidant mother to contend with. Hopefully I am self-aware enough to break the cycle.
Good luck with your journey on that, tnr9. And sorry for the tears but hopefully they were cathartic.
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Post by 8675309 on Oct 14, 2018 15:38:21 GMT
The talk on separate house thing... Im a secure and that would be ideal for me! LOL Its this weird? haha. I can feel smothered rather quickly and I dont sleep well with others. I enjoy intimacy but I need a balance of space surrounding it. I pull away if Im smothered. Part of this is my Sag nature, Im totally my sun sign in many ways.
Found this forum dealing with my DA.
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