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Post by tnr9 on Oct 30, 2023 4:09:35 GMT
It's been 2 weeks of No Contact, which has felt like 2 years. I've spent the time trying to keep as busy as possible but the pervasive thoughts about the relationship are so hard to stop. I went to my first ever therapy session and I've been feeling positive about that. We discussed where I feel I want to get to and my therapist said they'll put a plan together and we'll work on that. One thing we discussed though really got to me. I basically broke down when I started talking about my ex and how it was her birthday party this week and I couldn't help but think she'd be surrounded by friends and family but feel like I'd abandoned her. I felt so unbelievably sad picturing that. And so I really don't know what to do now as my ex messaged me in the night after the party saying she missed me so much. I'm really trying not to read too much into it, but I'm not sure how to respond - or if I even should? Brene brown has a whole talk about…”the story in my head”…..and that is exactly what you are doing in the second paragrapgh. I do not read anything about her telling you she felt abandoned…and yet, you have created a story in your head about how she feels. This is very dangerous territory for anyone who has anxious attachment as it leads to a lot of misaligned behaviors based on “stories”. Also, her missing you could simply mean she misses having you around as opposed to missing you in a romantic sense. My suggestion would be…if you want to reply…be open to it being a response with no expectation of anything further…just as @kai stated. I would also recommend going deeper with your therapist on this feeling of abandoning someone…. Did you feel like you were abandoned by one or both of your parents and now you fear doing that to someone else?
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tyke
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Post by tyke on Oct 30, 2023 7:57:01 GMT
I think my issue with the 'abandoning' thoughts are that when we spoke a couple of weeks after we broke up she said she had felt like I'd abandoned her when I returned some of her stuff without seeing her (I left it in her front porch). She backtracked on this somewhat when we agreed No Contact, but I guess it's been a difficult thing to let go of as I know what she says and what she feels haven't always lined up (which has been a huge issue). I definitely do have my own issues around this theme as well and it's certainly going to be something to get into with my therapist. They've already told me I seem to be carrying a lot of guilt and we need to work on shifting that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 15:19:39 GMT
It's been 2 weeks of No Contact, which has felt like 2 years. I've spent the time trying to keep as busy as possible but the pervasive thoughts about the relationship are so hard to stop. I went to my first ever therapy session and I've been feeling positive about that. We discussed where I feel I want to get to and my therapist said they'll put a plan together and we'll work on that. One thing we discussed though really got to me. I basically broke down when I started talking about my ex and how it was her birthday party this week and I couldn't help but think she'd be surrounded by friends and family but feel like I'd abandoned her. I felt so unbelievably sad picturing that. And so I really don't know what to do now as my ex messaged me in the night after the party saying she missed me so much. I'm really trying not to read too much into it, but I'm not sure how to respond - or if I even should? In reality, this is predictable as her pattern, right? Hot and cold? At her whim? I'm not saying it's intentional on her part. But it certainly is unhealthy and also rather thoughtless, not considerate of you. She broke up with you, and chose not to go to therapy to try to repair. So she misses you, and I presume still chooses not to go to therapy and repair. You've expressed pain to her so she could consider how her reaching out might impact you, but probably didn't. Or at least was impulsive enough to not let that stop her. It's immature, and pretty meaningless in my view. It's a bit of a mindfuck. Here you are struggling, and she's throwing a wrench into your recovery, is how I see it. There are emotional hooks here, and this has the potential to make you spin. So my opinion, and only my opinion, is that it's appropriate to enforce a boundary out of self care and self respect. ONE of you have got to care about YOU and how you're doing, in a meaningful way that actually supports your best interests now and for the long term, and it's going to have to be YOU. She's wrapped up in her own dysfunction. One of you is going to have to respect your healing progress (that you are truly working on, good for you!!!) And it's not going to be her, she's eschewed all that... its going to have to be you. If you keep getting snagged by emotional hooks you could swirl around the emotional drain endlessly with her. That's how she's living, making a conscious choice to not move forward with you but to text you on occasion. It's not cool, even if it's not intentionally selfish it IS selfish. Put yourself first. That is the only way you can raise your bar and find the relationship that will reciprocate. Elevate yourself above the emotional games and acting out, and choose the challenging road that actually takes you where you want to go, instead of the hard road that is a dead end. And as long as she isn't doing the same as you, prioritizing her own attachment solutions, it is in fact a dead end.
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Post by alexandra on Oct 30, 2023 18:19:44 GMT
What introvert describes is what I had to do once upon a time with a serious FA ex. I needed space after being dumped and he wouldn't really give it to me for all the reasons introvert described. I felt bad about him potentially feeling abandoned too (that was one of my first posts here, asking how to be respectful but still not abandon my needs), and the answer is it doesn't matter. I say that from the perspective of anyone with an anxious-side fear of abandonment will be triggered at some point by the dysfunctional dynamics they have contributed to building, or will trigger themselves even in this way, unless they seek to overcome their own trauma and stop the cycle. So if she's not doing that for herself, whether you intend for her to feel abandoned or not, at some point she simply will no matter what you do or don't do. What I ended up doing was telling my ex I was going no contact because I was a mess, and if he cared for me so much, the kindest thing he could do was respect my space and not reach out. I eventually was ready to reach out almost a year later, and he wasn't too bad about my boundaries in that time but did try to get messages to me through friends who simply never delivered them. Which was exactly what I needed at the time, so go friends
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 30, 2023 20:51:14 GMT
I think my issue with the 'abandoning' thoughts are that when we spoke a couple of weeks after we broke up she said she had felt like I'd abandoned her when I returned some of her stuff without seeing her (I left it in her front porch). She backtracked on this somewhat when we agreed No Contact, but I guess it's been a difficult thing to let go of as I know what she says and what she feels haven't always lined up (which has been a huge issue). I definitely do have my own issues around this theme as well and it's certainly going to be something to get into with my therapist. They've already told me I seem to be carrying a lot of guilt and we need to work on shifting that. Yeh…I am going to third what introvert and Alexandra said….you need to put up a boundary so you can heal. Consider how crazy her comment sounds…she breaks up with you, yet she feels abandoned because you did not want to engage with her while dropping off her stuff? This is not a person who has your back, this is not a person who considers your feelings because she is too wrapped up in her own insecurity issues. It would truly be best if you could set a boundary, no contact until you are ready….
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 30, 2023 21:38:32 GMT
Right, on paper it looks pretty gross. All the insecure stories do. I look back on the insanity of my own dysfunctional relationship history and take it from me, take it from all of us... it does get better! You will be free if you keep doing the work and making decisions contrary to the illusions your attachment wounds confuse you with. It makes no sense to take care of her feelings or respond to her bids... she broke up with you and made her choices. Now it's time to push her out of the drivers seat and take over the wheel. Thesr things can drag on for freaking ever if you allow it, and it's just a waste of time. Sure, you can learn along the way, but the sooner you make yourself and your recovery the number 1 priority, the sooner you will see the relationship you're looking for. . Not with her, with someone who can be a good partner to you and not play these ego games.
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tyke
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Post by tyke on Oct 30, 2023 21:49:07 GMT
As always, I do appreciate your perspectives and advice on this. As I hopefully laid out in my original post, this is all a bit new to me so I'm really trying to learn and put stuff into practice at the same time - which can be a bit daunting.
So there was a bit of a twist as ultimately I did reply to her message. I think I did see it for what it was, a drunken and possibly unwelcome message, but when I engaged with her the next day she did say it was something she'd be thinking a lot since No Contact, not just when she'd had a few birthday drinks. So I suggested we meet up and she agreed.
And it was really lovely. We had a bit of a general catch-up about her birthday and how her little one is, but then did get around to talking about her message and generally how we've both been feeling without each other. We talked about how our communication had been so poor and that her unexplained (for me) hot/cold behaviour had left me feeling increasingly anxious, but that when I'd felt unhappy in the relationship I'd not said anything as I was too scared of her rejecting me and me ending up on my own - which in hindsight is ridiculous as ultimately that's where I ended up as the relationship ceased to function for either of us. She explained that she really is anxious avoidant, and that she had felt the relationship was just so intense and at times overwhelming but she hadn't been able to tell me she needed space/alone time as she thought I wouldn't be able to cope with that message, but equally she really doesn't want to be massively independent and that she wants me there for her at the same time, so she wasn't even sure how to relay that message. All in all, pretty tricky emotions to juggle and I do feel for her. I asked why she couldn't just tell me this in the moment, and she explained it's not "a moment", it's just a growing sense of unease. I asked why she didn't tell me about this growing sense and she said she was telling me now. She laughed when I pointed out we'd already broken up, so it was pretty late in the day.
From her side she has reached out to her therapist and is arranging to restart that. She was really interested in hearing I've started therapy as well. We were sort of skirting around the elephant in the room for a bit (she asked me if I was still living in the city, had I seen my ex etc. - both things which I think she's long felt insecure about i.e. would I just move back to where I came from at the first sign of trouble in our relationship and get back with my ex) but eventually she said had been thinking about her own comment about wanting to grow old together and that she wanted to find a way to make that happen.
I'm not getting carried away and we did speak about how therapy is no silver bullet for either of us - but for the first time since we broke up, and maybe for the first time since we got together in the first place, I feel like we are on the same page, we truly see each other, and there is a way forward for us. I'm pragmatic enough to know that even with all this in place things might not work out for us, but it feels like if that were to happen at least it wouldn't be for the lack of trying and wasn't just because we hadn't been great at communicating.
In terms of next steps, I think it's going to be a slow and steady approach. She would like us to be 'dating' - which she defined as doing nice things together and going out for meals and things like that. She also said I'd be seeing the little one again at some point, which made me feel that she wasn't just looking to downgrade to a friendship or situationship - as she puts her little one's needs above all else and doesn't just want men coming in and out of her life.
In the meantime, I'll be getting stuck into therapy, trying to create my own social network locally and getting used to the space living on my own for pretty much the first time in my life gives me.
So I'm cautiously optimistic - which for me isn't a bad place to be in given how the last month has gone. I don't feel at the moment like she's giving me false hope - but I guess time will tell if I was right on that.
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Post by alexandra on Oct 31, 2023 7:34:47 GMT
Good luck. I did this reset with my FA ex after our long period of no contact, it went similarly to what you described, and we spent 8 months moving slowly. He broke things off with me for all the same reasons within 2 weeks of officially getting more serious again. But at the end of that, I clearly saw it wasn't bad communication, timing, or lack of trying, it just wasn't going to work. Not saying that to be a debbie downer, and I'm not bitter about it because it was part of my process of earning secure and eventually getting to where I wanted to be. I'm saying it because your update resonated so much against what happened in my own experience, so do exactly what you've written and take it slow enough to see if anything changes with both of you going to therapy in the background -- but not so slow that you waste 8 more months of your own time.
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KAI
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Post by KAI on Oct 31, 2023 19:48:44 GMT
I agree with alexandra, you need to see it for yourself, and it will make you grow. You have this forum to explore and find more tools to help with the situation, and keep protecting yourself without forgetting to live. It is a tough road, but at least you will have tried. And sometimes it's better than not going for it, and keep thinking about what might have been. Just be cautious enough to cut your losses if things go south. But there will be people here to remind you if you keep coming on the forum, which i recommend. Good luck to both of you. Hope you will keep us posted
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tyke
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Post by tyke on Nov 1, 2023 13:07:22 GMT
I think I definitely do need to see if for myself. Given the strength of feeling I don't think I would want to spend (potentially) the rest of my life wondering "what if". So we shall see how it goes.
I met with my therapist again and we discussed attachment styles. Neither of us are totally convinced I'm actually AP. Certainly insecure in some ways, but much of the way I've felt and behaved when faced with seemingly unexplained behaviour from my partner wouldn't in itself make me AP. In the end I guess it's just a label though and I certainly do need to work on myself whatever my attachment style is.
Communication has been a huge issue throughout the relationship and that's something I will be working on. My therapist said I really do need to get some certainty around what "dating" means, and agree a structure to this so there's some stability and consistency for me. Previously I'd have shied away from this conversation as I felt like if I made a suggestion and my partner said "no" I'd have nowhere to go. But as my therapist said, if she says "no" then she's not the person for you. So I had this conversation straightaway after therapy and she was really receptive to it. She said it was in fact what she really needed as well as she has such a busy life with work and the little one that it makes life less stressful for her if she knows what's happening and when, well in advance. So we'll be putting 'date night' in the diary every week.
We're also both going to put down what we "want" and what we "need" in life - which we'll then discuss. For me there's some key needs around having a social circle in my new home city and a life outside the relationship. I'll be interested what she comes up with. And again, whilst part of me worries a bit that she may have some needs that I can't meet or accommodate, the reality of that would be that we therefore just aren't compatible.
And if that's the case, so be it. I've had a shocking month in terms of emotions, but ultimately I'm still here, still moving forward with my life, and if this doesn't work out in the coming days, weeks or months, I feel like I know there is a life for me outside of this relationship. Right now though I'd obviously prefer that not to happen.
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KAI
Junior Member
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Post by KAI on Nov 1, 2023 21:53:15 GMT
I think I definitely do need to see if for myself. Given the strength of feeling I don't think I would want to spend (potentially) the rest of my life wondering "what if". So we shall see how it goes. I met with my therapist again and we discussed attachment styles. Neither of us are totally convinced I'm actually AP. Certainly insecure in some ways, but much of the way I've felt and behaved when faced with seemingly unexplained behaviour from my partner wouldn't in itself make me AP. In the end I guess it's just a label though and I certainly do need to work on myself whatever my attachment style is. Communication has been a huge issue throughout the relationship and that's something I will be working on. My therapist said I really do need to get some certainty around what "dating" means, and agree a structure to this so there's some stability and consistency for me. Previously I'd have shied away from this conversation as I felt like if I made a suggestion and my partner said "no" I'd have nowhere to go. But as my therapist said, if she says "no" then she's not the person for you. So I had this conversation straightaway after therapy and she was really receptive to it. She said it was in fact what she really needed as well as she has such a busy life with work and the little one that it makes life less stressful for her if she knows what's happening and when, well in advance. So we'll be putting 'date night' in the diary every week. We're also both going to put down what we "want" and what we "need" in life - which we'll then discuss. For me there's some key needs around having a social circle in my new home city and a life outside the relationship. I'll be interested what she comes up with. And again, whilst part of me worries a bit that she may have some needs that I can't meet or accommodate, the reality of that would be that we therefore just aren't compatible. And if that's the case, so be it. I've had a shocking month in terms of emotions, but ultimately I'm still here, still moving forward with my life, and if this doesn't work out in the coming days, weeks or months, I feel like I know there is a life for me outside of this relationship. Right now though I'd obviously prefer that not to happen. Well, best is to see for yourself, and even if this doesn"t work out with this person, at least you will know and/or you will grow from the experience as you already seem to have started to do. I think this is amazing. If there's more heartache to come, then our community will still be here to second.
Good luck Tyke, you seem like an amazing partner
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