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Post by ged12345 on May 14, 2024 12:23:05 GMT
Hey guys,
First time posting on these forums. And you can guess why: I dated a DA. For a year and 3 months.
Backstory: Knew her obliquely through the years. Friend of a closer friend, who is close with my best friend. Mutual friends said she was bad at relationships and made bad choices, but when i talked to her she seemed stable in general.
How we got together: I broke up with my BPD girlfriend 7 months prior (she was a close friend's sister, did not know she was BPD, too much AP in that relationship). I saw my now ex at my friend's bday party. We'd gone on two unofficial datesback in the day (this later turned into a private joke for awhile, that she'd left the country so we couldn't get together previously, but like this was destined to be [did no know she was DA then]). We went on a few dates, and things were slowly heating up, then one small roadtrip 2 hours away. Singing in the car with the radio turned up to old 60's/70's/80's tunes. It was a pretty magical day, and we were kissing at that point.
Now, on our second date, when I kissed her and told her I liked her, she said she liked me too, then about 10 seconds later as were walking she said: "Sometimes, I'm bad at relationships" and then "I also might be a bit avoidant". I lead her to a nearby bench and interrogated her briefly, but she downplayed both statements to the point where I was sufficiently satisfied (it did seem like at least 3 of her exes had turned out not to be amazing people).
On her birthday, she had no one to celebrate with ("Oh, I do things with my friend's later in the month"). I said that was a crime, took her to a movie, we went back to her house after and slept together and it was on from there. The whole thing moved somewhat quickly: she was staying over at my place for 3-4 days before and after the weekend (she had an online job), I'm at hers a lot, sometimes working. We're becoming entangled in each others lives and she's really opening up. She made us official with a: "I guess we're boyfriend and girlfriend now" and was telling me she loved me early on.
"I can't believe we found each other" makes my head spin.
We had a 5 hour phone call within the first 2 weeks of dating, and at the end of it she nearly told me the source of all her trauma (I did not know, again, how bad this was until later). A few months later, over Messenger, she opens up, tells me she's bawling her eys out, as she's telling me about the events (her family moving from England to Australia when she was 9) that lead to her crying everyday for 6 years, how they had a shameful (but fixable) family secret, how her dad was a tyrant and she couldn't make a loud sound without being yelled at etc. etc. Sounded horrible and my heart went out to her and she said she felt close to me because it felt like I understood her. Many many things like this came out over Messenger to begin with. I felt like she trusted me.
Then, over time, she starts saying things like (at 2am when we were falling asleep, in a dark room, out of nowhere) "I can't put the level of effort into this that you are". And a week later, "We're going to live our own, seperate lives". When I question hr about one small thing, she says, "I'm not going to change, ged12345". All of which were concerning. She also told me she felt like she'd "gone crazy" at the start of the year (which I now know means she'd over-extended herself and her avoidant tendancies were starting to slip in again). Note: During this time, she still continued to downplay her trauma...until she said "We're going to live our own, seperate lives" again, as if a command, so after I dropped her at the train station, I just sent her a series of texts saying for her to have a think about what she wanted because I didn't want to be in a relationship that was distant. She calls me that night, calls me two days later, stating she has always had a need for freedom and she can't feel caged etc. I roll my eyes internally because, yes, she's more DA than she said she was: Why start coming over more often if she knows she needs space?
We reconciled and were going to have a big talk but she was travelling overseas, so I pushed the talk back and she was very loving up until she left. You can guess that the trip did not go well between us. When she came home, I picked her up, and we had a fight about. what had happened and then she contracted COVID. I looked after her for 9 days, during which she said, "You can kick me out if you want" a few times, which I just internally blinked at. When she was better and had gone home, she todl me she was very depressed, and after the next time we saw each other, she said that night: "I feel like we're just friends."
We talked that out and I delved further into attachment theory. 8-9 months of hot and cold later (some actual improvements where she was telling me she love dme again for weeks), then her deactivating and "losing feelings" and acting bored, then another small breakup (I said to her not to call me again if she wasn't interested as she knew what I needed: She called me every 2nd day for 2 weeks). Then another trip overseas for her, with beforehand being a lull. She gets back, I meet her best friend from uni, everything goes amazingly well, and she breaks up with me that night. Funnily enough, she "lost feelings" the previous time after I met her other close friend (meeting her other friend was fine earlier on but that was during the honeymoon phase). There was also a "I'm having doubts about the relationship; I don't feel that big love for you I need" - some obsession or misunderstanding around limerance there, but she said she'd prayed to God she could talk to me about how she was feeling rather than running away, so some good intentions also.
So that's the story. 2 months NC at this point.
There are many other aspects: she was quite promiscuous (she sometimes has sex with someone to "generate feelings"), is bisexual and liked to attend a bisexual women's club (for sex or socialising - she tried to convince me that would be fine with us together, but I'm monogamous, have always been, expressed that to begin with, so—no—I'm not going to change my mind on that), liked to surround herself with guys at various distances who admired her in some way, had a threesome with a couple, who were close friends, before we dated etc. etc.
So perhaps not the most consistent, committed, person with character out there (all which I found out over time) but I believe she's like this to compensate for not being able to attach.
What I don't understand about it all is that I'm huggy, loving, caring, lots of PDA. Her ex, who is more DA than she is and just kicked her out of his life after there first real argument ever, is the opposite. She told me quite a lot about her backstory and said on the last phone call "I regret breaking up with you but this will all just happen again if we get back together. But I love talking to you. And I've never felt this comfortable with anyone before." I think she opened up to me more than anyone, asking me for advice, help with issues she was having, for her hobbies, said she'd never had anyone take care of her or be supportive like I had. When she called me 3 days after the breakup, she said she'd been reconsidering, had barely slept, and was crying on the call.
And yet she walked away, saying: "Everything has a hint of freedom to it now" and "The dating pool is quite sparse out there" due to her political leanings. We went from talking every 2nd day, and sometimes online, to nothing. In fact, she stated at the end of the last call that "sometimes I felt forced to call you, to contact you". Crazy. She even had this lost, disconnect voice that I sometimes heard her use; probably some form of disassociation from her feelings. She'd increasingly do that, talk like I wasn't on the phone with her or in the room.
I know this is long but...any insight would help. We had discussed couples therapy twice, but she obviously reneged on that with the breakup. I'm not crying everyday at the moment, but this is still hard. Due to certain reasons I can't explain, it's been hard for me to make friends for awhile, so she was a major support, even though I didn't mean for her to be.
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Post by ged12345 on May 14, 2024 12:36:43 GMT
P.S. Oh, three other relevant things: 1. I'm probably AP leaning Secure. I've been doing Ideal Parental Figure therapy for awhile and that has sort of helped, somewhat.
2. She was allegedly going to go to therapy for her issues: she said 80% of the issues in the relationship was her attachment style, with 10% being her other issues, and 10% being mine (I'd make it more like 5%, as I was very patient in those last few months, and she caused some fights over small things and seemed overly paranoid).
3. I feel a very large sense of resentment over the fact that I changed various aspects of my life for this person, on their request: There are about 20 changes I made to my house (some tidying, buying new furniture so the place looked nicer, moving certain things, I started dying my hair and beard (something I was going to do anyway, but not this early),I bought faster internet so they could comfortably work their job, I bought a dishwasher, and I would make sure to go shopping with them when they came over so they had all the food they needed to lose weight with (this was not cheap). I also let them use my spare room to record acting reels etc. which required shifting everything around. I can't move in my space now without seeing a reminder of them saying, "Changing this will make me feel more comfortable here" when nothing ever did and those happy earlier days started to return, but only fleetingly.
Meanwhile, I put together all their furniture in their apartment and helped them shop for it. I feel...cheated and robbed of a promise to improve things and to come and spend time here, which became more and more of a contentious issue but also showed me how much a lot of what went through her head was reaction-based rather than well-thought out (we'd be at her apartment in the last few months and about to leave for mine, then she'd push the time later and later, and then start yawning and saying: "I really love my apartment." And yet when she'd eventually come to mine, she'd love being there, wouldn't want to leave and often spent more time than planned — on the last phone call she said she'd generally sabotaged things when these domestic days in a row were going well by being distant later, but it felt like a program running rather than her choice. Just horrible.)
I felt like my needs were small. I loved her deeply and even towards the end, she often seemed so happy: I just wanted what we'd had previously. Apparently, that was too much to want in this life.
My main worry is that our split was pretty amicable, and the last time I saw her was accidental: no joke, I was dropping things off out front of her place at 11pm when she should have been asleep; I handed her box to her, I walked off very quickly, and before I hit the corner of the block, I hear, "Do you want to come up for a chat?". She would have had to run down the stairs to do that. I made it clear to her that I couldn't go sit on the couch she'd broke up with me on, she looked hurt, and I said, "We had a long phone convo the other day - let's leave it there for now." We hugged brusquely and then I walked off.
So my concern is that she will be back at some point. I wasn't overly emotional, I didn't yell, I just didn't see the need. She even said, when partly prompted, "I'm going to be in therapy so we can be together at some point."
She said, multiple times, that she felt 'trapped': You can only be trapped between two or more things. One of those things was her need for 'freedom'; I think the other was a very deep but unacknowledged love (as much as she could love) for me.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 13:47:51 GMT
Sounds like a typical insecure Rollercoaster. They always leave you feeling a bit sick in some way or another.
So. Leaving behind your detailed account of her behavior, what's the moral of the story on your side? You're looking for insight, right? You don't need any insight into her behavior because it speaks for itself and it's left you single.
You mention some anger about all the things you changed and gave up to please this woman. Can you honestly say you had a healthy basis for behaving that way? Is accommodating someone who warned and then showed you they are avoidant and unhealthy a secure behavior, or is it based in control as in giving in order to get? The insecure dynamic is frought with over-giving and overfunctioning on one side... and if that's what happened on your side then that's what you need to be focusing on. It may not seem too helpful right now to look at how you set yourself up for disappointment here, but in the end if you can take responsibility for your own insecure behavior you can get on the right track in terms of picking a partner who isn't waving red flags left and right from practically day one.
This isn't all about her, frankly. If I had a nickle for every anxious poster who came here to minimize their insecurity and describe how they "lean secure" after a short lived, intense entanglement with a traumatized avoidant person, I'd have a lot of nickles.
You're probably at least as insecure and dysfunctional as she, and if you can get your head around that you will be less confused. Take a good look at that, see what you come up with. If you come up with some denial and defensiveness, bingo, you know where to start.
Best of luck to you, it's not easy facing our own patterns. But it's the only way out of them, for sure.
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Post by ged12345 on May 14, 2024 14:08:11 GMT
"This isn't all about her, frankly. If I had a nickle for every anxious poster who came here to minimize their insecurity and describe how they "lean secure" after a short lived, intense entanglement with a traumatized avoidant person, I'd have a lot of nickles."
Oh, I can understand why you'd read it that way. I probably do float more towards AP, but my therapist said Secure leaning AP to me, and I test as such (not that they can't be gamed). I get that a secure person would just leave the relationship if there were hot and cold behaviours exhibited, but by the time a lot of this came out, I was trying to do what most people seem to on these forums: give space, negotiate more while being assertive, try and be less confrontational and use "I" statements etc.
I'm not going to be defensive because I asked for people's opinions and you gave me yours — thank you — but after going through Schema Therapy (I have a Self Sacrificing schema, so I'm aware I can over-give at times), and then Attachment-based Therapy in the past, I don't think I'm in denial. I do however have an "invisible illness" and some other health problems that lead me to attach a little too quickly sometimes, as the future is troubling because of that. And I was quite assertive throughout the entire time we were together, which I'm pretty happy with.
"Can you honestly say you had a healthy basis for behaving that way?" Well, not entirely, but somewhat. As I said, she described herself as a "bit avoidant" and my changing things at my place was to make her feel more welcome initially, like it was her place too, rather than accomodate her avoidance. We went through a really great couple of months where, as I explained, she seemed to change behaviour quite a bit and be doing a lot of reading on her dysfunction, and that's when a lot of these changes happened. And I figured that if she was putting effort in on her side, why wouldn't I make changes on mine in the interest of helping out? She told me she loved me repeatedly, something she hadn't been able to do for months. You'll have to excuse me for trying to believe that she could change, but that's where my head was at (I was also reading a lot of subreddits at the time where this occasionally does happen, that acting more secure can bring out secure behaviours in your partner). It was after this period where she started deactivating hard.
Anyway, my anger around that was because this was a continuing theme. I don't really care about putting together the furniture at her place (she helped with some of that) but I think it comes from the fact she would then not want to leave her 'comfortable nook', but I contributed to that, which caused issues between us. The whole situation seems unfair and it's sad to see someone you cared about act...so ungrateful. Because she wasn't always like that.
It's funny: I'm framing this to some stranger on the internet in more detail than my ex had in her head (due to a bad memory which is common in people who are DA) and even my DA said I was acting more securely in general and she felt more safe than previously, and that this was her issue and not mine.
I just miss the person I thought she was, that's how far she let me into her world and how well I got to know her. And I am worried she'll be back. I was looking for some insight into whether someone who shared so deeply would view you as a source of pain or would recognise you as a safe place?
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 14:27:48 GMT
If you want to know what she thinks, ask her.
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Post by ged12345 on May 14, 2024 14:31:33 GMT
We're not in contact, and I really don't want to reach out to her. Not after the hot-and-cold rollercoaster, as you put it, and not after some of the promises she made. And yet I worry about what my reaction will be if she does. But I'll take that as you not wanting to speculate
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 14:33:04 GMT
And I'll say this... you're imagining that your interpretation of feeling "trapped" is solid.
So you think she's trapped between her need for freedom and the love she has for you. How can you know her heart and mind in this way, and yet not be able to come up with the answer to your own concerns expressed in your last paragraph?
Just make it up as you go, however it suits you. And justify and rationalize all you need. Make it mean what you want it to, and call it whatever you want. Apparently it's what secure people do.. they lean the narrative in whatever way makes sense to them and then ask the internet for some kind of validation.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 14:35:22 GMT
We're not in contact, and I really don't want to reach out to her. Not after the hot-and-cold rollercoaster, as you put it, and not after some of the promises she made. And yet I worry about what my reaction will be if she does. But I'll take that as you not wanting to speculate You can take it as... if you're secure and you've got questions about what is I someone's mind, you ask them rather than asking strangers who have no possible way of knowing except to make generalized guesses. If you're in no contact then you've got a conundrum, indeed.
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Post by ged12345 on May 14, 2024 14:37:13 GMT
Can I ask why you seem so angry at me asking some questions on this forum? Is there a specific thing that set you off in my post or...? I thought that was the whole point of asking for advice, and yet your answers seem passive-aggressive, or even aggressive. I would ask for a little more respect than that, considering this is the first time I've posted here, thanks.
"How can you know her heart and mind in this way?" Easy. Because she expressed in words to me a few weeks before we broke up what every DA fears deep down: "If I let you get too close to me, you'll end up hurting me!". She actually said that to me. And a few weeks later, under her breath, but multiple times, "You've loved other people before, your love for me can't be that strong". As if she was trying to deny the fact there was love, or devalue it. Combined with her telling me she loved me on many occasions. We fricken held hands the last two nights we were in bed together as we fell asleep, and when I left to sleep on the couch because I snore, she actually begged me not to go.
There were other things as well that pointed in that direction. Does that mean I know 100%? No, but neither did she.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 14:50:52 GMT
Can I ask why you seem so angry at me asking some questions on this forum? Is there a specific thing that set you off in my post or...? I thought that was the whole point of asking for advice, and yet your answers seem passive-aggressive, or even aggressive. I would ask for a little more respect than that, considering this is the first time I've posted here, thanks. "How can you know her heart and mind in this way?" Easy. Because she expressed in words to me a few weeks before we broke up what every DA fears deep down: "If I let you get too close to me, you'll end up hurting me!". She actually said that to me. And a few weeks later, under her breath, but multiple times, "You've loved other people before, your love for me can't be that strong". As if she was trying to deny the fact there was love, or devalue it. Combined with her telling me she loved me on many occasions. We fricken held hands the last two nights we were in bed together as we fell asleep, and when I left to sleep on the couch because I snore, she actually begged me not to go. There were other things as well that pointed in that direction. Does that mean I know 100%? No, but neither did she. There's no anger. And I think I spoke directly to you, you just don't agree and there is more than enough room for that. All I'm saying is this... in the period of time I've been here your story is a dime a dozen, and always goes the same way. So it's your first time posting but the umpteenth time someone in no contact has come here wanting to mind read the person that they are not communicating with. I cant and won't give you what you're looking for, I've given you my perspective as unpleasant as that may be for you. I can easily refrain, as well.
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Post by alexandra on May 14, 2024 15:28:25 GMT
I just miss the person I thought she was, that's how far she let me into her world and how well I got to know her. And I am worried she'll be back. I was looking for some insight into whether someone who shared so deeply would view you as a source of pain or would recognise you as a safe place? The answer is yes. She'd view you as a source of pain and recognize you as a safe place because she's FA. That's exactly how FA works: their attachment style is totally disorganized because at least one of their childhood attachment figures was a source of pain and comfort at once, so their experience of love is inconsistent, hot and cold, don't get too close but don't get too far. There is no person you "thought" she was, that is your projection onto her (maybe coupled with her people-pleasing and masking parts of herself -- also childhood dysfunctional coping mechanisms to avoid pain and punishment by disassociating and creating a more pleasing false self to present). There is a person she actually is, which she's already told you she has no intention of changing, and which is an incompatible person for you. It's a person you tried to change for and minimize your own needs to make comfortable, which left you emotionally drained and resentful, which is why FA and AP are not compatible (very different relationship needs). I agree with @introverttemporary, and I wonder if you can find another therapist for a second opinion. There isn't an AP leaning Secure designation in attachment style. If you are AP, you are AP, even if that strategy primarily only comes out in romantic relationships and in times of dealing with stress. And that's okay, but it can lead you to have bad boundaries, which is why you keep tolerating relationships with other deeply insecure or personality disordered people whose needs come before yours. This probably reflects a relationship dynamic you had with an adult when you were a kid, which is what introvert is trying to guide you to focus on. Inconsistency in caretakers during childhood and not getting your needs consistently met as a result can very naturally lead to an AP attachment style as a survival defense mechanism. The child blames themselves for a caretaker unable to meet their needs and begins to look for "magic formulas" of behaviors to encourage that person to meet their needs. The AP patterns help you stay bonded to someone who can't meet your needs because when you're a child, you need to do that to survive. But then you don't grow out of those dysfunctional coping strategies as an adult without a lot of work and basically reparenting yourself. You wrote a lot focusing on your ex and very little comparatively about yourself and your own healing. It's really good you've seen a therapist, and it's good if you see progress with that therapist, though my sense is you can find a better one who can help you more productively. Some have strengths in different subject areas than others. I am sorry that you have some health difficulties and that is leading to what it sounds like are some feelings of isolation and loneliness, which is contributing to you wanting to connect with others who are also challenged in some way (maybe they'll accept you and you'll accept them, when you feel difficulty accepting you, which unfortunately leads to codependency and bad boundaries which are making you overextend yourself and then feel even more personal investment and loss when things don't work out). One thing that strikes me is you talked about how your ex feels you understand her so well, but is that because there's mutual trauma bonding going on and her pain is familiar? Rather than due to healthy relating and connection? I'd recommend watching some of Thais Gibson's free online videos about the AP attachment style (and healing it) to learn more about it and about which parts resonate with you so you can get a better sense of what you need and if another therapist with different specialties might be a better fit. Or maybe the one you have is a really good fit for you to cope with your illness and real emotional challenges that come with that, but another would be better at working through the romantic relationship aspects.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 15:53:17 GMT
Right... I know I know I don't want them to come back but I miss them but if they come back what are they thinking because I don't know how to react... help me I'm worried....
This is not secure "leaning AP" and if your therapist thinks so, find another therapist. This is insecure stuff, on your part. If you're secure, you base your responses on healthy boundaries in YOU, regardless of what kind of drama another person exhibits. You don't fret about what is she thinking because you have your own thoughts and feelings that determine your course of action. If that doesn't sit well with you you're on the wrong forum because there's not a lot of mollycoddling that goes on here. We aren't into gaslighting, or walking on eggshells with someone who is here asserting security while engaging in totally insecure shenanigans like this. There doesn't need to be any anger involved in this, it is what it is and there are a few people here who recognize the BS because we have been there in one way or another and moved past it by calling bullshit on our own screwed up ways of relating.
Again, if that doesn't suit then that's ok. Nobody will suffer but you if you cling to this way of approaching relationship.
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Post by tnr9 on May 14, 2024 19:48:43 GMT
So my concern is that she will be back at some point. I wasn't overly emotional, I didn't yell, I just didn't see the need. She even said, when partly prompted, "I'm going to be in therapy so we can be together at some point."
She said, multiple times, that she felt 'trapped': You can only be trapped between two or more things. One of those things was her need for 'freedom'; I think the other was a very deep but unacknowledged love (as much as she could love) for me.
I am a poster who has FA attachment and is working on it with a therapist. She was not trapped between freedom and love for you…she felt trapped by her own internal need to regulate her nervous system. When she felt a fear of being engulfed or overwhelmed…she pulled away…when she felt a fear of being abandoned…she would get closer…but neither of those were because of you….just as your overgiving nature was not a result of her. Overgiving is a boundary issue on your side…..you had expectations of what would be the result but that seems to have never happened to your satisfaction. I also suggest seeeing a different therapist….but make it about yourself and how to work through your own issues versus analyzing hers.
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Post by Deleted on May 14, 2024 21:01:46 GMT
So my concern is that she will be back at some point. I wasn't overly emotional, I didn't yell, I just didn't see the need. She even said, when partly prompted, "I'm going to be in therapy so we can be together at some point." She said, multiple times, that she felt 'trapped': You can only be trapped between two or more things. One of those things was her need for 'freedom'; I think the other was a very deep but unacknowledged love (as much as she could love) for me. I am a poster who has FA attachment and is working on it with a therapist. She was not trapped between freedom and love for you…she felt trapped by her own internal need to regulate her nervous system. When she felt a fear of being engulfed or overwhelmed…she pulled away…when she felt a fear of being abandoned…she would get closer…but neither of those were because of you….just as your overgiving nature was not a result of her. Overgiving is a boundary issue on your side…..you had expectations of what would be the result but that seems to have never happened to your satisfaction. I also suggest seeeing a different therapist….but make it about yourself and how to work through your own issues versus analyzing hers. 💯
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Post by ged12345 on Oct 28, 2024 8:22:44 GMT
Hey tnr9, Thanks for the reply I understand the feeling of being trapped was coming from her internal nervous system and had nothing to do with me. But she did admit to loving me at various points, and under no coercion from myself, and this was later on in the relationship when she was pulling away. There was no incentive to her saying that because I wasn't pulling away from her. My point is that something was keeping her in the relationship; I know there's a buried and hidden abandonment and rejection wound that DAs have, but I do think she loved me as best she was able. She was balling her eyes out when she called me 3 days after our break up. That doesn't sound like someone who didn't feel anything (could have been tears for herself, though, which is a possibility). I understand that DAs have a real problem with attachment but I was and remain the only relationship she's ever been committed to in that manner, outside of one that transitioned into friends with benefits and another with a DA who shattered her trust by stonewalling her over a fairly small issue (since he restricted sex between the two of them leading up to this, out of nowhere, seemed to be a pretty typical pattern of pulling away because they had gotten too close). I'm training to be a psychologist and I don't think that giving is a 'boundary issue'. I was giving in some senses because she requested changes so that she felt more comfortable being in my life: for instance, we would spend a weekend together and she would feel overwhelmed when going home because she hadn't done laundry, hadn't hit other personal marks etc. etc. So the 'giving' was about trying to accomodate her so that reasonably she would feel more relaxed about being here. I would do that for a loved one, sure; also considering she sometimes was overwhelmed with various forms of decision-making and had some underlying anxiety issues, why wouldn't I help reduce stress? My therapist is trained in attachment styles but I've also seen another therapist, neither of who think I have major attachment issues, although they said I could definitely have been more secure in this relationship (but that's fairly common when you're with someone who shows avoidant tendencies). I would say that trying to get into couple's therapy and not putting up distancing behaviour is secure, though. I've just always, as a personality trait, treated individuals like they're unique and so have a harder time sometimes moving on from people, probably because I believe in the Golden Rule. I've also been in therapy for many years due to severe OCD issues as a child (my dad would probably be clinically defined as NPD). I overcame my OCD issues and I do Ideal Parental Figure therapy regularly to pre-emptively deal with attachment issues (hate that leaning towards my anxious side), which I think helps. I started in the middle of the relationship and I guess I was trying to model therapy being a net positive. I recommend Cerdic Reeves attachment repair meditations and courses. He includes lecture slides along with the meditations, and if you're FA, I think they're a great resource. "Overgiving is a boundary issue on your side…..you had expectations of what would be the result but that seems to have never happened to your satisfaction." <-- This isn't really true, as she made statements to the effect of "I'm going to be in your life and at your house more often, can we please make these changes?" So I didn't give and expect nothing back out of nowhere; she'd made some requests and I agreed because they didn't really take much out of me. It's also not like she didn't give back in the first 7-8 months because she did. The issues came up when she set the expectation that changes would result in either more commitment or a more relaxed attitude to us being together/spending time, and of course I gave her some time to settle into that, and when that didn't happen, when she started to feel 'numb', I was understandably not happy. But by that time she suddenly began shutting down quite hard in general (coincidentally only a month after the unsolicited 'I love yours'). So other than leaving at this point it was hard to know what to do. I actually did tell her to go off and not contact me unless she wanted a committed relationship, and she came back and agreed to couple's therapy. So, again, trying to enforce some boundaries there but ultimately she just didn't engage in the way that would have lead to any lasting change. Really, thank you for your input. I am continuing Ideal Parental Figure therapy and though my psychology degree, I am learning about Acceptance and Commitment Therapy, CBT (although I'd already done and researched Schema Therapy before), and some Psychodynamics. I don't have any specific negative memories so I don't think EMDR applies, nor AEDP (which is new and quite gentle and also helps with attachment issues). Apparently, overall, Psychodynamic Therapy, as the actual theory comes obliquely from the psychodyamic tradition, can be the most beneficial for these sorts of issues into the long-run (we're talking 5+ years). I always thought long-term therapy was a bit of a scam, so it was really interesting to read the studies around this.
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