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Post by leavethelighton on Jun 6, 2018 0:23:56 GMT
Anyone else go through a lot of mental oscillations, even in the absence of any interaction with the person in question and while in a state of no-contact?
Like (while having no contact with the person):
We're done/I'm done. No wait, I want to try again. I miss the person. No, we're done. No, let's try again. I wish they'd return. This is stupid, I'm not going to try anymore if they're not trying. Or maybe I should give it one last shot. I would accept them back with open arms. No, I'm angry about their walking away. Etc. etc.?
What's this ongoing ambiguity about? It's like a push-pull dynamic in the mind. A mental wavering. I keep thinking over time I would reach a greater state of peace and acceptance, but it seems to be realllllllllly slow in coming. I don't even think I really want to be done, just that the anger of the other person being done makes me somehow want to retaliate by being done.
Is real and final/complete peace and acceptance about it actually achievable, or does the mental ambiguity just linger into perpetuity?
I have achieved an essentially final peace and acceptance about most people and so I think it can be possible, but with one of them that peace is sure taking its sweet time even though we've had almost no contact for years.
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Post by mistakes on Jun 6, 2018 4:04:14 GMT
Wow, I have that swing in my mind too, I was happy to let go last night, but then I’ve been trying to reach out to him through my dreams!
I’m not done with the process yet, and I certainly wish there will be days that I don’t think about him. But I find that, recognising some unfinished business does help the emotions in more steady range between the swing. Like in my case, I didn’t want to let go, is because it felt like how I lost my father suddenly without sign.
But the problem is, after detaching the person from the experience of my father, I hold on to him because he is special to me when we bond... and that, I don’t know how to let go without dreams like last night...
Is cutting attachment that hard? Even we don’t contact anymore, and telling ourselves how bad the relationship was and it would only get worst? 😔
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Post by leavethelighton on Jun 8, 2018 1:23:39 GMT
Wow, I have that swing in my mind too, I was happy to let go last night, but then I’ve been trying to reach out to him through my dreams! I’m not done with the process yet, and I certainly wish there will be days that I don’t think about him. But I find that, recognising some unfinished business does help the emotions in more steady range between the swing. Like in my case, I didn’t want to let go, is because it felt like how I lost my father suddenly without sign. But the problem is, after detaching the person from the experience of my father, I hold on to him because he is special to me when we bond... and that, I don’t know how to let go without dreams like last night... Is cutting attachment that hard? Even we don’t contact anymore, and telling ourselves how bad the relationship was and it would only get worst? 😔
You probably meant it as a rhetorical question, but yes, cutting attachment is that hard! I find logic doesn't affect these things at all.
By dreams do you mean when you are asleep he keeps appearing in your dreams?
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Post by mistakes on Jun 8, 2018 4:58:14 GMT
Wow, I have that swing in my mind too, I was happy to let go last night, but then I’ve been trying to reach out to him through my dreams! I’m not done with the process yet, and I certainly wish there will be days that I don’t think about him. But I find that, recognising some unfinished business does help the emotions in more steady range between the swing. Like in my case, I didn’t want to let go, is because it felt like how I lost my father suddenly without sign. But the problem is, after detaching the person from the experience of my father, I hold on to him because he is special to me when we bond... and that, I don’t know how to let go without dreams like last night... Is cutting attachment that hard? Even we don’t contact anymore, and telling ourselves how bad the relationship was and it would only get worst? 😔
You probably meant it as a rhetorical question, but yes, cutting attachment is that hard! I find logic doesn't affect these things at all.
By dreams do you mean when you are asleep he keeps appearing in your dreams?
My dreams react the reality, that is, I’m trying to reach out to him, but he is disconnected. |
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Post by boomerang on Jun 9, 2018 2:59:24 GMT
We're done/I'm done. No wait, I want to try again. I miss the person. No, we're done. No, let's try again. I wish they'd return. This is stupid, I'm not going to try anymore if they're not trying. Or maybe I should give it one last shot. I would accept them back with open arms. No, I'm angry about their walking away. Etc. etc.?
What's this ongoing ambiguity about? It's like a push-pull dynamic in the mind. A mental wavering. I keep thinking over time I would reach a greater state of peace and acceptance, but it seems to be realllllllllly slow in coming. I don't even think I really want to be done, just that the anger of the other person being done makes me somehow want to retaliate by being done.
Is real and final/complete peace and acceptance about it actually achievable, or does the mental ambiguity just linger into perpetuity?
Oh yes--I go through this endlessly, exactly as you describe, in my current situation. The only time I feel "balanced" is when I am in the "this is stupid, I'm not going to try anymore" state of mind. Then I feel in control of myself. And then..something triggers me--memories, seeing him (our paths cross all the time), thinking about how I feel about him (especially that)--and off I go. I want to get to the place where "this is stupid", which is what my brain tells me is true, is my new normal. It is so frustrating to not be able to stay there. But it is stupid as he is making it quite clear he does not want to re-engage. So why am I caught in this loop, instead of accepting it from a place of "this is pointless" because I am not going to get, ever, what I want from this particular person? I was reading something Tnr9 said in another thread: "so I own that when I feel this desire for him...it is a very young place where there are not 'options'." [I.e., no other mother or father or whomever is the root of the attachment issues who can provide what is missing.] And what it comes back to is that. Seeing that this person could have, and did for a time, fill that hole and wanting that so much... That's what keeps us in this loop.
Part of the challenge is our brains get trained to go in a certain thought pattern and that is so hard to break. An effort of will is needed, but the heart shies away from it. I think, though, one can re-pattern one's thought cycle, if one can find a way to make a decision to put aside the heart's longing. Very hard to do.
That said, I do think it is possible to break that longing. I was in a long relationship with another man that was very hard. I went through the same cycles. And then one thing he said finally did it and I was free. It was a straw that broke the camel's back moment. It was not an effort of will--it just...was too much. Finally, I reached that point. I physically moved away, made a new life, and felt such relief. For years, I felt only a strong sense of relief and escape after that. So maybe the way out is to focus on the one thing that is/was intolerable to your core sense of self. And keep that at the forefront. That's asserting self. And I think that may be the only way to do it.
I am trying now, but not able to fully do it as no contact is not possible so I just get triggered over and over and back in--but I do see that as a the way out, if one can get there. And I should add I was not in N/C first in that other relationship--the camel's back broke and I went N/C naturally. But I think the key may be finding that one intolerable thing that your core self definitively will not accept and making that paramount in one's mind. The anchor thought. Rather than letting a memory of the good part of how the former partner made one feel be the anchor thought.
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Post by leavethelighton on Jun 11, 2018 0:05:29 GMT
You've given me some useful things to think about here.
The idea of an "anchor thought" and also thinking about any "violation of one's core sense of self" can be useful strategies here.
Also I think your point about owning that some of this pre-dates any particular relationship is a good point, that it also connects to our younger selves in some way.
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Post by notalone on Jun 18, 2018 15:52:51 GMT
I'm going through it right now, and it's frankly driving me nuts. I know this guy I was seeing is avoidant, there's no future, and terrible for my anxiety, so I ended things a week ago, but my mind loops between "But I want him" And "No, you really don't, it's bad for you". I've always been frustrated and upset with the part of me that longs for a person and relationship that just hurts me. Recently, I'm approaching it differently. I've read a lot that says self-compassion and self-love are really important in healing and changing our responses. I think of myself as 2 people - the adult that knows what's best, and the baby that feels like I need this attachment. You'd never yell at a baby, you'd loving nurture the baby. So I think of that part of me as a part that is genuinely afraid and sad, and can't distinguish the difference, and I lovingly and compassionately tell it "I know this is so hard, but I promise we're ok. I love you. You don't need or really even want that. It's not what you think it is." It sounds corny, but everything I've read suggests that calling myself stupid will just reinforce the lack of self-love that makes me feel empty and unworthy of love, and keep me drawn to unhealthy relationships. But my God, it's hard. Sometimes I want to shake the baby. It takes a lot of patience.
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Post by tnr9 on Jun 20, 2018 10:46:25 GMT
I'm going through it right now, and it's frankly driving me nuts. I know this guy I was seeing is avoidant, there's no future, and terrible for my anxiety, so I ended things a week ago, but my mind loops between "But I want him" And "No, you really don't, it's bad for you". I've always been frustrated and upset with the part of me that longs for a person and relationship that just hurts me. Recently, I'm approaching it differently. I've read a lot that says self-compassion and self-love are really important in healing and changing our responses. I think of myself as 2 people - the adult that knows what's best, and the baby that feels like I need this attachment. You'd never yell at a baby, you'd loving nurture the baby. So I think of that part of me as a part that is genuinely afraid and sad, and can't distinguish the difference, and I lovingly and compassionately tell it "I know this is so hard, but I promise we're ok. I love you. You don't need or really even want that. It's not what you think it is." It sounds corny, but everything I've read suggests that calling myself stupid will just reinforce the lack of self-love that makes me feel empty and unworthy of love, and keep me drawn to unhealthy relationships. But my God, it's hard. Sometimes I want to shake the baby. It takes a lot of patience. I think that it is also important to validate the desire to connect as being a good desire...a healthy desire. So it might help to tell the child in you..."I love you, I love how you want to connect and love someone with all your heart. I validate that this is healthy and I will help you to find someone who will want to connect and love you that way." I think a young child doesn't always distinguish between "this person isn't a good fit for you" from "your desire to love and connect is not ok". The more specific and positively framed the message..the better. At least, that has worked a bit better for me. The little girl in me experienced so many "losses" that telling her that B is not what she wants or that it is not what she thinks causes her to panic and go into ruminating/checking mode. It is not perfect, I regress a lot, but every day does hold within it a small victory of awareness/patience/gentleness....and I find that I bounce back much faster then I did before. Good luck. |
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Post by leavethelighton on Jul 2, 2018 0:19:54 GMT
I think you both make an important point-- part of the struggle is that even if something isn't working, walking away from it can also feel like rejecting the parts of it that are beautiful/meaningful/even sacred. We desire someone because when the connection is good it's really good, and so even if when it's bad it's bad, the moments that felt like real love or connection are something we want to validate and hold onto and not just walk away from.
I have more to say but my kids are crying so I have to go.
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Post by notalone on Jul 11, 2018 15:07:19 GMT
I'm going through it right now, and it's frankly driving me nuts. I know this guy I was seeing is avoidant, there's no future, and terrible for my anxiety, so I ended things a week ago, but my mind loops between "But I want him" And "No, you really don't, it's bad for you". I've always been frustrated and upset with the part of me that longs for a person and relationship that just hurts me. Recently, I'm approaching it differently. I've read a lot that says self-compassion and self-love are really important in healing and changing our responses. I think of myself as 2 people - the adult that knows what's best, and the baby that feels like I need this attachment. You'd never yell at a baby, you'd loving nurture the baby. So I think of that part of me as a part that is genuinely afraid and sad, and can't distinguish the difference, and I lovingly and compassionately tell it "I know this is so hard, but I promise we're ok. I love you. You don't need or really even want that. It's not what you think it is." It sounds corny, but everything I've read suggests that calling myself stupid will just reinforce the lack of self-love that makes me feel empty and unworthy of love, and keep me drawn to unhealthy relationships. But my God, it's hard. Sometimes I want to shake the baby. It takes a lot of patience. I think that it is also important to validate the desire to connect as being a good desire...a healthy desire. So it might help to tell the child in you..."I love you, I love how you want to connect and love someone with all your heart. I validate that this is healthy and I will help you to find someone who will want to connect and love you that way." I think a young child doesn't always distinguish between "this person isn't a good fit for you" from "your desire to love and connect is not ok". The more specific and positively framed the message..the better. At least, that has worked a bit better for me. The little girl in me experienced so many "losses" that telling her that B is not what she wants or that it is not what she thinks causes her to panic and go into ruminating/checking mode. It is not perfect, I regress a lot, but every day does hold within it a small victory of awareness/patience/gentleness....and I find that I bounce back much faster then I did before. Good luck. I struggle with whether my desire for romantic love can be healthy right now. I feel like I until I'm better within myself it will always be unhealthy, regardless of any partner. Then again I've read that a relationship with a secure partner can be healthy, even for an insecure person. So maybe I'm wrong. I'm trying to work through this.
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