joan
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Post by joan on Nov 11, 2018 20:55:50 GMT
Some of you may slightly know my story, but to give a hopefully brief overview: I've been with my DA for three years in an exclusive non-relationship even though it's been very much like one in so many ways. Except I haven't ever met his friends or family aside from his father who has dementia. He lives at home with his parents and takes care of his father while his mom works. He works from home so that's how they're able to work out that situation. It's because of those factors that he says he doesn't have the time or desire for a relationship because it's another pressure for him that he can't deal with at this point in his life. I'll admit I struggled to understand or believe his reasons in the beginning and as an AP demonstrated a lot of the protest behaviors of asking for more time, defining our relationship and questioning his whereabouts and intentions. Over time I've quieted those behaviors down, but occasionally they will come out when I'm feeling highly triggered over certain events or a combination of events. Last night I was highly triggered and didn't expect it or know how to come down from it before reacting. I'll try to make this short because it's already getting so long. I've been missing him, his communication the past couple of weeks has felt like less. It's always gone up and done throughout our relationship, so it's been down recently. That triggers me. I start to think he's out with someone else, and that thought tends to linger. I know I can be sensitive, paranoid and anxious about that. He denies being involved with anyone at all. Yet he takes his phone into the bathroom with him, has it on him at all times, and last night when we were in the store it felt like he was always taking off into other aisles to maybe respond to a text without me seeing and getting suspicious. That's not his common behavior. Usually he's right there with me and he's very affectionate. He seemed a bit distant and detached. I questioned him and he left in anger. I recognize that my thoughts are mostly fear based, and I can't trust them. I have to seek out guidance from my therapist, friends or the forum to get some clarity. I guess I'm looking for any bit of reassurance or support that my feelings/suspicions are not totally off the wall and there's some reasonableness to them. I fight really hard to contain or ignore the negative thoughts. Sometimes I win, but last night I lost. I'm just in this awful place because I caused a fight when things had been going so well for so long  |
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Post by leavethelighton on Nov 12, 2018 0:51:43 GMT
Your feelings are valid in that they're your feelings.... but I do think you are being triggered by assumptions without evidence and should remind yourself that it may or may not be true. Even if he is having secret texting, it doesn't mean it's romantic. Like it could be a friend in crisis, or a medical thing (his or someone else's) or an addiction to Facebook or who knows what. Is there any change you could get him to talk about it? It may be you could benefit from learning more about communication styles so that you can try to initiate conversations in a way that won't be accusatory. Ultimately you're either going to need to be able to talk more openly with him or decide to trust him...
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joan
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Post by joan on Nov 12, 2018 1:15:02 GMT
Your feelings are valid in that they're your feelings.... but I do think you are being triggered by assumptions without evidence and should remind yourself that it may or may not be true. Even if he is having secret texting, it doesn't mean it's romantic. Like it could be a friend in crisis, or a medical thing (his or someone else's) or an addiction to Facebook or who knows what. Is there any change you could get him to talk about it? It may be you could benefit from learning more about communication styles so that you can try to initiate conversations in a way that won't be accusatory. Ultimately you're either going to need to be able to talk more openly with him or decide to trust him...
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Post by 8675309 on Nov 12, 2018 1:28:03 GMT
If this phone thing is not common behavior for him... Id be suspicious of this too, Im secure attached. Would I jump to seeing someone else and attack, no, but I would be like whats up this?! I would expect someone to ask me if I was doing this all the sudden... Ive only had relationships with secures and I know they would ask me whats up if my behavior changed.
Attachment aside, his behavior has changed even if its not a romantic thing. You've been around him for three years and its not his norm...
Also asking for more time and defining a relationship is not necessarily AP either, its normal to want those things, its more AP if you are jumping the gun early on that, pressuring and want to engulf all their time. There is a difference.
Im lucky I saw my avoidant twice a month,(I asked for once a week and he ran) asking for more time is perfectly reasonable/healthy needs/wants and after a year now I have every right asking to define us. These are healthy normal things that securely emotionally open people have.
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joan
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Post by joan on Nov 12, 2018 5:19:34 GMT
Your feelings are valid in that they're your feelings.... but I do think you are being triggered by assumptions without evidence and should remind yourself that it may or may not be true. Even if he is having secret texting, it doesn't mean it's romantic. Like it could be a friend in crisis, or a medical thing (his or someone else's) or an addiction to Facebook or who knows what. Is there any change you could get him to talk about it? It may be you could benefit from learning more about communication styles so that you can try to initiate conversations in a way that won't be accusatory. Ultimately you're either going to need to be able to talk more openly with him or decide to trust him...
You're right leavethelighton, I do need to decide to trust him. I already know his communication style isn't as forthcoming and open as what I would like. I have to take it or leave it and right now I'm choosing to take it. He's very private, and feels a lot of general questions like asking how his night was or what he did is intrusive. He gets defensive like I'm asking to interrogate him when I'm asking because I'm interested in knowing about his night. So then I get defensive like he's being evasive for some reason, and then the negative thoughts start. This is my internal war, and I know it. I just try to drag him into it, hoping he'll go to battle alongside me, but it's something I have to fight on my own. I've had partners willing to be there to support and reassure me, and while it's great and so very comforting, it doesn't push me to change, to look within. This relationship has done that for me. It's been painful and harsh, but it's forced me to stand on my own emotionally or at least work towards that. With a supportive partner I lean on them and they become a crutch. I'm going off on a totally different tangent now, I apologize. I'm just physically and mentally exhausted and trying to sort through my head out loud here. I understand what you're saying about giving more thought into his actions, like giving him the benefit of the doubt, and it's been so unfair of me not to. I can see why he'd get offended and hurt by that. He tries to show me in his own ways he cares and I take that for granted when I don't trust him. |
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joan
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Post by joan on Nov 12, 2018 5:29:33 GMT
If this phone thing is not common behavior for him... Id be suspicious of this too, Im secure attached. Would I jump to seeing someone else and attack, no, but I would be like whats up this?! I would expect someone to ask me if I was doing this all the sudden... Ive only had relationships with secures and I know they would ask me whats up if my behavior changed. Attachment aside, his behavior has changed even if its not a romantic thing. You've been around him for three years and its not his norm... Also asking for more time and defining a relationship is not necessarily AP either, its normal to want those things, its more AP if you are jumping the gun early on that, pressuring and want to engulf all their time. There is a difference. Im lucky I saw my avoidant twice a month,(I asked for once a week and he ran) asking for more time is perfectly reasonable/healthy needs/wants and after a year now I have every right asking to define us. These are healthy normal things that securely emotionally open people have. Well let me backtrack from my original post. When he was going in different aisles in the store I didn't even see him with his phone in his hand. I assumed that was what he was doing and that's more than likely my own paranoia. As far him going into the bathroom with it, he does it often. That's always kind of bugged me, but he says he likes to sit on his phone on the toilet. How can I argue with that, I do the same. I think I was just feeling highly triggered because of the distance I was feeling, and being even more sensitive because I'm on my period. Being AP and then it being that time of the month, he's already said he doesn't want to be around me during that time. I was surprised he wanted to spend the night knowing I was on my period this time, but I thought my mood was good until it wasn't. The ironic thing is I see how I've accused him of the behavior I displayed last night. Things had been going so well, he was being so sweet and kind and for the first time ever in our three years we'd gone five almost six months without any kind of conflict or pushing and pulling. The issues I was having were so benign, and I would've ignore it at any other time, but I started this fight. I got cold, distant, and quiet. I honestly didn't even care if he left, like I wanted him to. That's the very behavior APs accuse DAs of; when things are going well, they push away or start a fight. I did that last night. I'm still trying to figure out why. I know there's deeper things going on that were on my mind like wanting more time together, hearing from him more and feeling disconnected from him. So it looks like I pushed him away because I was hurting. |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 12, 2018 13:57:53 GMT
If this phone thing is not common behavior for him... Id be suspicious of this too, Im secure attached. Would I jump to seeing someone else and attack, no, but I would be like whats up this?! I would expect someone to ask me if I was doing this all the sudden... Ive only had relationships with secures and I know they would ask me whats up if my behavior changed. Attachment aside, his behavior has changed even if its not a romantic thing. You've been around him for three years and its not his norm... Also asking for more time and defining a relationship is not necessarily AP either, its normal to want those things, its more AP if you are jumping the gun early on that, pressuring and want to engulf all their time. There is a difference. Im lucky I saw my avoidant twice a month,(I asked for once a week and he ran) asking for more time is perfectly reasonable/healthy needs/wants and after a year now I have every right asking to define us. These are healthy normal things that securely emotionally open people have. Well let me backtrack from my original post. When he was going in different aisles in the store I didn't even see him with his phone in his hand. I assumed that was what he was doing and that's more than likely my own paranoia. As far him going into the bathroom with it, he does it often. That's always kind of bugged me, but he says he likes to sit on his phone on the toilet. How can I argue with that, I do the same. I think I was just feeling highly triggered because of the distance I was feeling, and being even more sensitive because I'm on my period. Being AP and then it being that time of the month, he's already said he doesn't want to be around me during that time. I was surprised he wanted to spend the night knowing I was on my period this time, but I thought my mood was good until it wasn't. The ironic thing is I see how I've accused him of the behavior I displayed last night. Things had been going so well, he was being so sweet and kind and for the first time ever in our three years we'd gone five almost six months without any kind of conflict or pushing and pulling. The issues I was having were so benign, and I would've ignore it at any other time, but I started this fight. I got cold, distant, and quiet. I honestly didn't even care if he left, like I wanted him to. That's the very behavior APs accuse DAs of; when things are going well, they push away or start a fight. I did that last night. I'm still trying to figure out why. I know there's deeper things going on that were on my mind like wanting more time together, hearing from him more and feeling disconnected from him. So it looks like I pushed him away because I was hurting. Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 14:14:56 GMT
Well let me backtrack from my original post. When he was going in different aisles in the store I didn't even see him with his phone in his hand. I assumed that was what he was doing and that's more than likely my own paranoia. As far him going into the bathroom with it, he does it often. That's always kind of bugged me, but he says he likes to sit on his phone on the toilet. How can I argue with that, I do the same. I think I was just feeling highly triggered because of the distance I was feeling, and being even more sensitive because I'm on my period. Being AP and then it being that time of the month, he's already said he doesn't want to be around me during that time. I was surprised he wanted to spend the night knowing I was on my period this time, but I thought my mood was good until it wasn't. The ironic thing is I see how I've accused him of the behavior I displayed last night. Things had been going so well, he was being so sweet and kind and for the first time ever in our three years we'd gone five almost six months without any kind of conflict or pushing and pulling. The issues I was having were so benign, and I would've ignore it at any other time, but I started this fight. I got cold, distant, and quiet. I honestly didn't even care if he left, like I wanted him to. That's the very behavior APs accuse DAs of; when things are going well, they push away or start a fight. I did that last night. I'm still trying to figure out why. I know there's deeper things going on that were on my mind like wanting more time together, hearing from him more and feeling disconnected from him. So it looks like I pushed him away because I was hurting. Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. I agree with this. In my last relationship, my style behavior was prominent and it was because I was unhappy in the relationship, but I wasn't recognizing my unhappiness until it became unbearable. I had legitimate concerns that I brushed away as my DAness. If you feel like you are being triggered too often, it's time to take a deeper look at your own happiness. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 14:24:42 GMT
Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. I agree with this. In my last relationship, my style behavior was prominent and it was because I was unhappy in the relationship, but I wasn't recognizing my unhappiness until it became unbearable. I had legitimate concerns that I brushed away as my DAness. If you feel like you are being triggered too often, it's time to take a deeper look at your own happiness. yes!!! double yes. good things don't feel so bad. in these pairings, both partners are unhappy and triggered. the opposite styles trigger the hell out of each otherZ it feels bad, most of the time i think, because it's unhealthy. |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 12, 2018 14:40:24 GMT
I think all or nothing thinking....you are to blame or I am to blame solely...is part of my growth edge....there are gradations of gray and both people have a part to play not only to protect self but also other (and vice versa). Learning to accept that legitimate needs are part of any relationship, they are healthy and when spoken about in a self and other caring way, can create peace where when unspoken there is chaos..is someything I am just starting to awaken to and explore.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2018 15:01:33 GMT
I think all or nothing thinking....you are to blame or I am to blame solely...is part of my growth edge....there are gradations of gray and both people have a part to play not only to protect self but also other (and vice versa). Learning to accept that legitimate needs are part of any relationship, they are healthy and when spoken about in a self and other caring way, can create peace where when unspoken there is chaos..is someything I am just starting to awaken to and explore. and the anxious/avoidant trap has both parties behind the eight ball on this. terrible dynamic for mutual satisfaction and safety!! |
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joan
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Post by joan on Nov 12, 2018 18:15:05 GMT
Well let me backtrack from my original post. When he was going in different aisles in the store I didn't even see him with his phone in his hand. I assumed that was what he was doing and that's more than likely my own paranoia. As far him going into the bathroom with it, he does it often. That's always kind of bugged me, but he says he likes to sit on his phone on the toilet. How can I argue with that, I do the same. I think I was just feeling highly triggered because of the distance I was feeling, and being even more sensitive because I'm on my period. Being AP and then it being that time of the month, he's already said he doesn't want to be around me during that time. I was surprised he wanted to spend the night knowing I was on my period this time, but I thought my mood was good until it wasn't. The ironic thing is I see how I've accused him of the behavior I displayed last night. Things had been going so well, he was being so sweet and kind and for the first time ever in our three years we'd gone five almost six months without any kind of conflict or pushing and pulling. The issues I was having were so benign, and I would've ignore it at any other time, but I started this fight. I got cold, distant, and quiet. I honestly didn't even care if he left, like I wanted him to. That's the very behavior APs accuse DAs of; when things are going well, they push away or start a fight. I did that last night. I'm still trying to figure out why. I know there's deeper things going on that were on my mind like wanting more time together, hearing from him more and feeling disconnected from him. So it looks like I pushed him away because I was hurting. Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. You're right tnr9, I suppose the AP in me is still taking all of the blame for the hurts and slights I feel and that I try to bury. Underneath the petty things I was accusing him of was the real issue of feeling like he doesn't share other aspects of his life with me. His family, friends and other things he has going on. That always leaves me feeling uneasy and suspicious. I have a tendency to be non-trusting, and suspicious, even with my ex secure partner. So it's trying to differentiate between what's a "normal" request for sharing, and what's the insecurity in me needing too much reassurance. I see what you're saying in expressing my true needs and I was working my way up to discussing things with him calmly. Not to make excuses but I was so dead tired, and hormonal and those factors made it too easy to get triggered and blurt out things I normally would've kept quiet about or found a way to express calmly and logically. I do feel responsible for that. I'm trying to fight against the shame and self-loathing from that. The voices in my head that say, "Look at what you did, you screwed up again. You don't deserve him." I'm trying to find the self-compassion to argue against those voices. |
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joan
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Post by joan on Nov 12, 2018 18:23:23 GMT
Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. I agree with this. In my last relationship, my style behavior was prominent and it was because I was unhappy in the relationship, but I wasn't recognizing my unhappiness until it became unbearable. I had legitimate concerns that I brushed away as my DAness. If you feel like you are being triggered too often, it's time to take a deeper look at your own happiness. Yes Mary, I agree my AP style shows up much more because of the unhappiness I feel but try so hard to suppress. I too rationalize that it's my APness when it's a legitimate concern. It's always this trying to discern, is this feeling coming from being an AP or a normal feeling. I don't have the strong conviction of who I am, what I need and how I feel, and that makes it so easy for me to turn myself into a pretzel to fit into what he wants. I do need to sit with myself often and write down/list these things until hopefully it sticks somehow. |
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Post by tnr9 on Nov 12, 2018 18:44:56 GMT
Joan...I think it is good that you are taking accountability for your AP thoughts...however...don't lose sight of your legitimate needs. This can't be a you doing all the work to be accommodating of him and him giving you an occational breadcrumb type set up. That is not fair to you either. Justifying that it is all on us is another AP behavior that can take any accountability off of a partner when there truly should be compromise and understanding on both sides. Sit with yourself and see if any protest behaviors are just symptoms of underlying concerns that your needs are not being met....and then see if there is a way that you can express those needs calmly before they turn into protest behaviors that appear to have nothing to do with the underlying need. I think that will empower you to trust yourself more to handle this relationship through an adult perspective. You're right tnr9, I suppose the AP in me is still taking all of the blame for the hurts and slights I feel and that I try to bury. Underneath the petty things I was accusing him of was the real issue of feeling like he doesn't share other aspects of his life with me. His family, friends and other things he has going on. That always leaves me feeling uneasy and suspicious. I have a tendency to be non-trusting, and suspicious, even with my ex secure partner. So it's trying to differentiate between what's a "normal" request for sharing, and what's the insecurity in me needing too much reassurance. I see what you're saying in expressing my true needs and I was working my way up to discussing things with him calmly. Not to make excuses but I was so dead tired, and hormonal and those factors made it too easy to get triggered and blurt out things I normally would've kept quiet about or found a way to express calmly and logically. I do feel responsible for that. I'm trying to fight against the shame and self-loathing from that. The voices in my head that say, "Look at what you did, you screwed up again. You don't deserve him." I'm trying to find the self-compassion to argue against those voices. Yeh....that is a result of thinking the success or failure of this relationship falls to you....and it doesn't.....everyone is allowed to be moody, crampy, needy....it is part of being human..and it is the time when we need to be gentle with ourselves. It sounds like your critical voice is having a field day....you can always tell it to shove off....but I find it works best to say...thank you for your concern critical voice....however, I adult caring voice am going to run the show right now and although I see I made a mistake...I am learning from it and will become stronger because of it. We all have a critical voice...it is there to keep us out of harm....but it tends to do a really horrible job of it....so, I like to counter it with a more balanced and loving voice.  . |
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Post by faithopelove on Nov 13, 2018 0:22:53 GMT
I agree with this. In my last relationship, my style behavior was prominent and it was because I was unhappy in the relationship, but I wasn't recognizing my unhappiness until it became unbearable. I had legitimate concerns that I brushed away as my DAness. If you feel like you are being triggered too often, it's time to take a deeper look at your own happiness. Yes Mary, I agree my AP style shows up much more because of the unhappiness I feel but try so hard to suppress. I too rationalize that it's my APness when it's a legitimate concern. It's always this trying to discern, is this feeling coming from being an AP or a normal feeling. I don't have the strong conviction of who I am, what I need and how I feel, and that makes it so easy for me to turn myself into a pretzel to fit into what he wants. I do need to sit with myself often and write down/list these things until hopefully it sticks somehow. I have this same feeling in the process of becoming aware of being AP and moving to more secure behaviors- I now question whether a need is too needy and my AP ways are resurfacing or my need is legitimate and something a secure would address. I find myself doubting and questioning my motives constantly- the analysis can be exhausting. Before...I just reacted, more or less |
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