|
|
Post by louloulou on Feb 9, 2019 18:11:44 GMT
Hi there! Was hoping to get some perspective. My ex brokeup with me after 2 1/2 years in June (he was previously secure but I brought up getting engaged and think I triggered him) I moved from our apartment in Michigan to Florida with my parents to get my head right (I was devastated). I did no contact for all of July, then we started texting and snap chatting casually again. First far and few between, but I noticed his walls slowly coming down. I worked really hard all summer at improving my life, becoming earned secure, improved my body, mentality (not being so reactive to him when he screws up bc he's usually clueless). In October, I went up to Michigan for an art show I was in and we had a great time and started unofficially dating again "seeing where this goes." I told him all I really wanted was a good morning and good night text with other stuff sprinkled in but understand he's busy. It was going great. We saw each other every 6-8 weeks. He even bought me $300 Bose headphones for Christmas. Then he came to visit in January and we had a blast with eachother. The second to last day, I brought up (a little dramatically with tears but no blowout or even a fight) that it's hurtful when he just ghosts me for a day and for him to just let me know he needs space and I'll gladly give it to him. He said he does it because he's unsure of the relationship. I told him it's never 100% certainty with these type of things. Last week we were texting and he was saying how he agreed the distance sucks and that texting and chatting isn't a real substitution for us being together and how we wouldn't always be apart. Then I got impatient and pressed him about a timeline to close the distance and he said he wasn't ready to talk about one yet. Then Sunday he called and brokeup with me! He gave 10,000 different reasons but that may have been because I kept asking questions saying "why" or "I don't understand".
Said he doesn't think we're meant to be together right now or ever; said I gave him everything he wanted and he still had doubts so it's a sign to end it; said he doesn't think we can both manage our families, jobs and eachother and both be happy; said he doesn't see a future with me so it's pointless to date; he said he just doesn't want to put the effort into the relationship and doesn't have a desire to connect with me emotionally; said he lost feelings for me.
I'm certainly doing better mentally this time around and will really be able to move on if need be, but I really just have a gut feeling that he was freaked out about closing the distance and pushed me away. He also has been stressed at work with a vital colleague and his work bff leaving the company and moving to Berlin. I'm not sure if I'm being delusional by thinking this or if he really meant everything he said? He was very even-toned when he was speaking for the breakup but also told me he loves me and will love me forever. He also said he kept my things in our apartment and he didn’t pay me for the furniture because “he wanted it to be me so badly.” But he still hasn’t paid me for the furniture which makes me think he maybe knows this is a temporary state? Anyway I sent him some information on attachment styles that night and then started no contact the following day and plan to be in it for 4-6 weeks just so we can both get our emotions in check before interacting again. I would just like some clarification on if you think this is temporary and he is just pushing me away or if it's a final thing. And is there anything I can say to him that will put him at ease with exploring a relationship with me and will help him not be triggered? I’ve done a lot of research on attachment styles and this forum the past week and really think I’d be more than capable of giving him space freely like Mary’s partner does and not making him feel guilty or ashamed of it.
|
|
|
|
Post by sissyk on Feb 9, 2019 20:48:19 GMT
Welcome to the boards!
I am sorry for your heartache. I am APish and perhaps some FAs will weigh in more helpfully than I can. But from what you have written here, I am not sure we know enough to say he is an FA who was triggered if he was secure for the first two years. He may simply feel very deeply for you, have given it his best shot, but still not think you have a long term future together when he had to think about an actual engagement. That is a pretty big litmus test. Or he may be right now confused and stressed and didn't want the pressure of such a big life decision if his work is very difficult. (The furniture might not be on the top of his mind so I wouldn't read too much into it.) Or he could be FA AND still sincerely not quite think you two are right for each other for the long haul.
Sounds like you are doing all you can. Coming to terms with his statement that he doesn't see a future, doesn't want to work on things, and has lost feelings and preparing yourself to move on. Yes, he might feel different when his other stresses ease. But you are also getting data about how he will treat your relationship in the future when life gets crazy. And do you really want to be with someone who is not excited to be engaged to you, popping champagne and planning a future?
I am a big believer in being honest. When tempers have cooled and time has passed, you could try one more time to call him and say you still want to be together and you have learned and reflected and understand he needs more regular space and you want to do that for him going forward. If you do in fact want to live like that--do you want to be in a relationship with that much space if you thrive on regular, willing connection?
|
|
|
|
Post by louloulou on Feb 9, 2019 23:38:08 GMT
Welcome to the boards! I am sorry for your heartache. I am APish and perhaps some FAs will weigh in more helpfully than I can. But from what you have written here, I am not sure we know enough to say he is an FA who was triggered if he was secure for the first two years. He may simply feel very deeply for you, have given it his best shot, but still not think you have a long term future together when he had to think about an actual engagement. That is a pretty big litmus test. Or he may be right now confused and stressed and didn't want the pressure of such a big life decision if his work is very difficult. (The furniture might not be on the top of his mind so I wouldn't read too much into it.) Or he could be FA AND still sincerely not quite think you two are right for each other for the long haul. Sounds like you are doing all you can. Coming to terms with his statement that he doesn't see a future, doesn't want to work on things, and has lost feelings and preparing yourself to move on. Yes, he might feel different when his other stresses ease. But you are also getting data about how he will treat your relationship in the future when life gets crazy. And do you really want to be with someone who is not excited to be engaged to you, popping champagne and planning a future? I am a big believer in being honest. When tempers have cooled and time has passed, you could try one more time to call him and say you still want to be together and you have learned and reflected and understand he needs more regular space and you want to do that for him going forward. If you do in fact want to live like that--do you want to be in a relationship with that much space if you thrive on regular, willing connection? Thank you so much for answering and for your wisdom. He definitely wasn’t super secure the first two years but his avoidant behavior weren’t huge red flags. His dad was a workaholic, his mom had severe depression, and he lost his only sibling to a drug overdose 3 years ago, so I do think he definitely has avoidant attachment issues, not sure if it’s DA or FA, he has low self esteem due to his weight and some issues with his parents which makes me think FA. January was the anniversary of his brother’s death and feb 7 was his brother’s birthday. Knowing that and the things he said to me about closing the distance, I can’t help but think he also wanted to close the distance but freaked himself out over it thinking he wouldn’t be able to meet my needs and I’d leave him. I should also say that when he was saying things like no future, not supposed to be together he kept saying “right now” at the end, which makes me think he was so sick of being confused and anxious about me that he decided to breakup just so it would end. He agreed that he has been so much happier since October, so I am just confused. I’m fully prepared to move on and really don’t think I’ll have a problem finding someone but this guy really holds a special place in my heart and if there was something I could say to him to let him know it’ll be okay and put him at ease I would do it in a second, he was a wonderful partner, we have so much fun together/we are best friends, and has treated me with nothing but kindness and love these last 3 years. |
|
|
|
Post by alexandra on Feb 10, 2019 0:02:15 GMT
He sounds avoidant and like he deactivates from you when you ask for a more serious commitment. The thing is, even though your description sounds more like he's got his own issues that he projects on to the relationship rather than this being an issue of him not liking you enough, it just doesn't matter. Because, the only way to get through a situation like that is for the insecurely attached person (or people, if both are) to want to confront their issues and do the work to heal.
If that willingness isn't there, and he's told you directly that it isn't -- even if is just isn't at this time -- then nothing will change and you'll stay stuck in the cycle. He likes being with you in all the good times, when you're not asking him to truly commit to a deeper relationship and be there for you to give you what you want. That's what he can handle. Is that fair to you and should you settle for it? No, definitely not. Can you assume he'll ever do the work to heal and address his potential avoidant attachment and problems with intimacy? Also, no, because that's completely out of your control if that's the real problem here. Even if he does want to do the work, it's a long time for a person to work out attachment issues, and you already seem to know you shouldn't be waiting around for him to start.
It stinks, it really does. And I give the perspective above because I've been there, cycling through twice with someone avoidant who isn't going to be there for me in bad times or do his own work in the near future. I went back a second time because I had been AP and inserted almost a year of space after he broke up with me the first time to focus on addressing my own issues. So I was able to see how my behavior totally changed the second time and his repeated.
It doesn't matter how perfect you are for him or how much space you give him or don't. If he's really got an avoidant insecure attachment and does not take it upon himself to do the work to heal his pain (or thinks avoiding/distracting is easier, or thinks he's happy as is and simply has an incompatible view on relationships against what you want), then you'll find youself in this position of almost but not quite. He ran when you wanted to get engaged after 2.5 years, and ran again when you got more serious about where the reconciliation was going. Focus on youself, and being there for youself, since at this time, he cannot be there for you.
|
|
|
|
Post by nottheonion on Feb 10, 2019 1:45:52 GMT
I’m an FA. I broke up with a guy after I told him I don’t wanna date other people. I think in my mind that wasn’t as official and serious as I thought it was. He then went all out to inform all his friends and family that we’re together and started to plan things to do as a couple. I was ... scared wasn’t the right word. I didn’t know what to think but just “I wouldn’t do this if I were him”. Spent the next few days calming myself down and getting busy with other things, I realised this was more real than I thought and he was way way more serious about this than I was (we were really close friends for years and he was in love with me the entire time). I had to break it off.
I was just not warmed up to the idea of dating him seriously even though at one point it was really what I wanted. Had he not been as serious about this and instead just got to know me romantically (rather than just as a friend like before), I would probs feel less scared. I’m not blaming this on him. We were just not on the same page. Maybe I just wasn’t in love with him (or anyone for a long time really)
|
|
|
|
Post by louloulou on Feb 10, 2019 2:24:23 GMT
He sounds avoidant and like he deactivates from you when you ask for a more serious commitment. The thing is, even though your description sounds more like he's got his own issues that he projects on to the relationship rather than this being an issue of him not liking you enough, it just doesn't matter. Because, the only way to get through a situation like that is for the insecurely attached person (or people, if both are) to want to confront their issues and do the work to heal. If that willingness isn't there, and he's told you directly that it isn't -- even if is just isn't at this time -- then nothing will change and you'll stay stuck in the cycle. He likes being with you in all the good times, when you're not asking him to truly commit to a deeper relationship and be there for you to give you what you want. That's what he can handle. Is that fair to you and should you settle for it? No, definitely not. Can you assume he'll ever do the work to heal and address his potential avoidant attachment and problems with intimacy? Also, no, because that's completely out of your control if that's the real problem here. Even if he does want to do the work, it's a long time for a person to work out attachment issues, and you already seem to know you shouldn't be waiting around for him to start. It stinks, it really does. And I give the perspective above because I've been there, cycling through twice with someone avoidant who isn't going to be there for me in bad times or do his own work in the near future. I went back a second time because I had been AP and inserted almost a year of space after he broke up with me the first time to focus on addressing my own issues. So I was able to see how my behavior totally changed the second time and his repeated. It doesn't matter how perfect you are for him or how much space you give him or don't. If he's really got an avoidant insecure attachment and does not take it upon himself to do the work to heal his pain (or thinks avoiding/distracting is easier, or thinks he's happy as is and simply has an incompatible view on relationships against what you want), then you'll find youself in this position of almost but not quite. He ran when you wanted to get engaged after 2.5 years, and ran again when you got more serious about where the reconciliation was going. Focus on youself, and being there for youself, since at this time, he cannot be there for you. So insightful, thank you so much. A similar thing happened to me too the second time, I changed quite a bit and he repeated a lot of the same patterns. I told him he should explore therapy and he agreed but who knows if he really will, but I think even he noticed the difference. I’m going to definitely continue with the NC and reevaluate reevaluate my emotions then. So appreciative of this forum. |
|
|
|
Post by louloulou on Feb 14, 2019 22:16:31 GMT
So he reached out twice, once he mailed me a w2 from an old job I had but included a handwritten note just saying he knew my boss was abusive so he put it in a new envelope so I didn’t have to see his handwriting. Then a week after I started no contact so I can heal, he texted me that he hoped my week was off to a great start and he saw ice boats and thought of me. I ignored the text. Later that night he texted again saying he got my valentines card (I cancelled it the day we broke up and got a refund and the company sent it anyway lol just my luck) and told me how thoughtful and wonderful I am. So I replied pretty coldly saying “yes I sent that a while ago. Still never got that ice boat ride. Doing well thanks.” But I can’t help but feel super guilty for being so cold and worrying that I have triggered him more. His mom was severely depressed when he was little and I think that’s where some of his attachment issues stem from. I replied coldly because I didn’t think it was healthy for either of us to be speaking so soon and also know there isn’t much he could have done in one week for self-help (during the breakup I suggested therapy and he agreed but not sure if he will actually go). I just want to make sure I’m not triggering or deepening his emotional wounds any further from that. I do love him dearly, would like to eventually reconcile, and am going to reach out in a few weeks when we both have more clarity, but I want to make sure this isn’t going to send him into a depressive spiral or anything because that really isn’t my intent. Hoping to get some insight from an FA...
|
|
|
|
Post by happyidiot on Feb 15, 2019 6:02:19 GMT
Self-aware FA here. Be more direct! For both your benefit and his. He has no idea why you responded the way you did to him. Why can't you tell him something like what you told us, such as, "I only replied coldly because I didn’t think it was healthy for either of us to be speaking so soon and I do really still care about you and am going to reach out in a few weeks when we both have more clarity."?
The secure thing is to be open and direct. If that scares him away then he is not in a place where he can be in a relationship with you and it's probably for the best. I think it's not really secure to be walking on eggshells terrified of scaring or upsetting the FA. What about what you want and need?
Also, to me, someone being indirect and mysterious and replying to things coldly and briefly is way more agonizing than someone being direct who is merely scary because they want something I don't know if I want/am capable of.
|
|
|
|
Post by 8675309 on Feb 15, 2019 12:23:01 GMT
Say what you need to say with no fear of triggering them as long as your communication is healthy.
Its not your problem if it triggers them. You cannot keep accommodating, walking on eggshells, etc because you might trigger them. While we may care and not want to add to their triggers you cant compromise yourself in the process because the issue is theirs.
I say what I need to to my FA even if it triggers him and he runs. It does make him run and thats on him. I communicated my healthy needs and poof, I wont walk on eggshells or compromise myself to accommodate him.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2019 23:41:32 GMT
What I said to my ex who demonstrates patterns of FA attachment insecurity, after suffering enough from the ups and downs (I broke up with him because of the push/pull instability) :
I'm sorry you're conflicted and unsure of your direction, or what you need, think, and feel. I thrive on stabilty, and having a plan, and committing to that plan. I have my own priorities and momentum in my life, I cannot be knocked off balance every time you are. I do not want my happiness and security threatened by your unresolved issues any longer. I want to go home to my life, my success, my peace, my priorities. I wish you the best."
It isn't easy to walk from something you've invested your heart in. But there's a point when this relationship madness just begins to just chip away at your soul.
|
|
|
|
Post by alexandra on Feb 19, 2019 18:30:51 GMT
What I said to my ex who demonstrates patterns of FA attachment insecurity, after suffering enough from the ups and downs (I broke up with him because of the push/pull instability) : I'm sorry you're conflicted and unsure of your direction, or what you need, think, and feel. I thrive on stabilty, and having a plan, and committing to that plan. I have my own priorities and momentum in my life, I cannot be knocked off balance every time you are. I do not want my happiness and security threatened by your unresolved issues any longer. I want to go home to my life, my success, my peace, my priorities. I wish you the best." It isn't easy to walk from something you've invested your heart in. But there's a point when this relationship madness just begins to just chip away at your soul. I said something very similar, except he'd already decided to break up with me again, so it wasn't very effective in making him think about his role in things, at least in the short-term. Though, sparking some sort of thought process or behavior in him wasn't the point in my saying it at all anyway, I finally was able to communicate in ways I'd never been able to about what I wanted and had been going on that was unacceptable (because prior I'd been too AP and afraid to lose him to say it so directly). I said it because I needed to stand up for myself and finally could. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 19, 2019 19:57:38 GMT
What I said to my ex who demonstrates patterns of FA attachment insecurity, after suffering enough from the ups and downs (I broke up with him because of the push/pull instability) : I'm sorry you're conflicted and unsure of your direction, or what you need, think, and feel. I thrive on stabilty, and having a plan, and committing to that plan. I have my own priorities and momentum in my life, I cannot be knocked off balance every time you are. I do not want my happiness and security threatened by your unresolved issues any longer. I want to go home to my life, my success, my peace, my priorities. I wish you the best." It isn't easy to walk from something you've invested your heart in. But there's a point when this relationship madness just begins to just chip away at your soul. I said something very similar, except he'd already decided to break up with me again, so it wasn't very effective in making him think about his role in things, at least in the short-term. Though, sparking some sort of thought process or behavior in him wasn't the point in my saying it at all anyway, I finally was able to communicate in ways I'd never been able to about what I wanted and had been going on that was unacceptable (because prior I'd been too AP and afraid to lose him to say it so directly). I said it because I needed to stand up for myself and finally could. I said it out of pure exhaustion. I finally truly gave up. Beyond a temporary deactivation. And that's how it came out. Finally. |
|
