birdy
New Member
Posts: 8
|
Post by birdy on Feb 20, 2019 14:38:17 GMT
Hello Forum,
I posted once before over in the DA forum. I since figured out my friend is an FA so I'm posting here instead today. I dated this man for almost 6 months. We split up, and are now friends. All good.
I still find I regularly get his "running commentary of minor flaws" negativity about my behaviours, decisions etc. It particularly happens when we've spent more time together, or as a snapback after a really great outing etc. I don't take it personally or absorb the messaging; I know it's the FA attachment showing up.
When I'm tired and need a break from it, our contact ceases for a while and I spend time with other friends instead. My FA friend and I have some great common interests and he needs support, so I don't feel the need to walk away from the friendship.
I am interested in how to set better boundaries that decrease or deter the fault finding behaviour when it starts up. I don't want to make him feel bad. If I say things like, "You are becoming scratchy with me, are you aware of it?" he gets defensive and denies it is happening. Responding directly just makes him feel lousy. But I've not found good advice online about a better way to do this.
I feel that when I just put up with this, I'm disrespecting myself. I let him fall well below a standard I'd expect of others, when I permit him to pick away at me verbally. However, I don't challenge it because I'm just not sure how to do it without reinforcing his self loathing. So my only tactic is just to decrease our contact until there's enough distance that he chills out.
Could the wisdom of this forum help me? This man is aware of this trait in himself. He beats himself up about it, and expressed a wish to change it more than once. He knows it contributes to the demise of his romantic relationships. Over the months, it just got worse, and his view is presently "Ugh I'm just wired this way, it's hopeless."
|
|
|
|
Post by anne12 on Feb 20, 2019 16:01:08 GMT
I would try to say (with a calm tone of voice and kind eyes): "why do you say this ?" "What do you mean when you say xxxx"
Or
"I feel hurt when you say/when you criticize me/my xxxx"
And if he says "oh, it was just for fun/you are being too sensitive ect.
Just tell him again: "I do not find it funny and I still feel hurt ect. when you say xxxxx"
And if he keeps on saying something and doesn't want to take owner ship, about how he feels ect., you can say "I just told you, that the way you xxxx, makes me feel hurt and sad".
"I told you, that it makes me feel hurt. If you keep on, it must be your intention to hurt me. I want you to stop and otherwise I will have to leave "
]You have to do it without aggression. Do not tell the person, that he is acting passive aggressive! Use broken record. Use your voulnability. Soft tone of voice.
]"Yes, I am maybe over sensitive, but this is the way I am feeling'
Do not over explain ect.
He wants to provoke you and make you angry. Do not take the bait. Let him take ovnership of his own anger and his own drama.
|
|
birdy
New Member
Posts: 8
|
Post by birdy on Feb 20, 2019 16:23:12 GMT
I would try to say (with a calm tone of voice and kind eyes): "why do you say this ?" "What do you mean when you say xxxx" Or "I feel hurt when you say/when you criticize me/my xxxx" And if he says "oh, it was just for fun/you are being too sensitive ect. Just tell him again: "I still feel hurt when you say xxxxx" And if he keeps on saying something and doesn't want to take owner ship, about how he feels ect., you can say "I just told you, that the way you xxxx, makes me feel hurt and sad". "I told you, that it makes me feel hurt. If you keep on, it must be your intention to hurt me. I want you to stop and otherwise I will have to leave " ]You have to do it without aggression. Use broken record. Use your voulnability. Soft tone of voice. ]"Yes, I am maybe over sensitive, but this is the way I am feeling' Do not over explain ect. He wants to provoke you and make you angry. Do not take the bait. Let him take ovnership of his own anger and his own drama. Such a constructive set of suggestions. Thank you so much. I'm reflecting on what the patterns are when we speak. Yes he will often say "you know I only do this because you love it really and it makes you laugh." Regrettably, he is very funny in the way he expresses himself and I do laugh. It's still tiring though. I don't take it personally. What tends to happen is that in my social circle I am generally surrounded by grounded, positive people who are into personal growth and a bit more equipped than this guy. So whilst I love his intellect and worldview I find after a day of "why are you doing x?" or "you don't do x correctly" I just feel worn out by someone else's negativity. I invariably need a rest for a while after meeting up. This week I did try something different. I said, "you are going to try not to pick up on all my minor flaws and I am going to try not to respond with faux outrage because when we do this we both get worn out and fed up, so let's not." It worked for most of the day we were together, but he wasn't able to keep his mask up all day and got grumpy by the evening. There is definitely a strong need to make me adopt the stance of the weaker party in our relationship. He wants to be top dog. |
|
birdy
New Member
Posts: 8
|
Post by birdy on Feb 20, 2019 16:26:49 GMT
Do we know why FAs do this behaviour. Mine comments very negatively on people's appearance. Watching something on the TV can be very tiresome as he's constantly flaw finding. I do call him out and tell him it's really shallow and not very nice and he just laughs. It's not as though he's Mr perfect. Would really love to know the roots of this behaviour. I know he was bullied in school for having Auburn hair, could his criticism towards others them from there. Yes, he does this too. It's like a foreign country to me. I just don't have anybody else in my life that exhibits this kind of negging behaviour. |
|
|
|
Post by mistakes on Feb 20, 2019 16:31:12 GMT
From Jeb’s book, Avoidants have negative world view, for FA, they have negative self image as well, so I guess they are just sharing what’s in their mind...
|
|
birdy
New Member
Posts: 8
|
Post by birdy on Feb 20, 2019 16:59:30 GMT
From Jeb’s book, Avoidants have negative world view, for FA, they have negative self image as well, so I guess they are just sharing what’s in their mind... Definitely. This person is also currently experiencing some other difficulties and often is very unfiltered in his conversation. He often says "did I say that out loud?" He's not being disingenous. He is actually checking. I was / am a person who gets to see behind the mask far more often than others do. |
|
|
|
Post by anne12 on Feb 20, 2019 17:18:08 GMT
I do not agree, that you can use your attatchment style as an excuse.
You have to teach people how to treat you. Sometimes they will not listen and then there can be consequences.
Also you have to act healthy yourself - repair when we make mistakes ect.
We can all switch from different kind of angerpatterns in different situations with different people.
You can't change other people, but you can change yourself
Using humor, sarcasm ect can be kind of passive aggressive or aggressive behavior/way of communicating.
you can tell him how it makes you feel using I statements and that you do not find it funny. Why do you think you let him do it ?
We often learn how to communicate in our family of origin or from school ect.
|
|
|
|
Post by anne12 on Feb 20, 2019 19:22:53 GMT
H: do you know why you are getting triggered by the way your boyfriend comments about other people ?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 20, 2019 20:00:31 GMT
Do you want him to learn? Don't approve it.
|
|
birdy
New Member
Posts: 8
|
Post by birdy on Feb 20, 2019 20:07:53 GMT
I do not agree, that you can use your attatchment style as an excuse. You have to teach people how to treat you. Sometimes they will not listen and then there can be consequences. Also you have to act healthy yourself - repair when we make mistakes ect. We can all switch from different kind of angerpatterns in different situations with different people. You can't change other people, but you can change yourself Using humor, sarcasm ect can be kind of passive aggressive or aggressive behavior/way of communicating. you can tell him how it makes you feel using I statements and that you do not find it funny. Why do you think you let him do it ? We often learn how to communicate in our family of origin or from school ect. I'm thinking about this question of why do I let him do it... I think because in the beginning, this was not the person presented to me. This behaviour came in later. At first, it really disoriented me. I was waiting for that other person to reappear. I excused a lot that I should not have. Then I discovered this forum and understood the root cause. I understand intellectually that the original person is not coming back. My emotional self misses that relaxed, positive, open guy and hasn't caught up with my intellect yet. Much earlier on when this negative behaviour started I was more open about regularly saying, "why do you need to tell me that?" or "I am ok with how I chop onions, I like to do it this way" etc but he would then say "why am I so horrible all the time?" and feel regretful, to which I'd respond that you can work on this, you don't need to be that way. As time's gone on and his distance has increased I just feel less able to make those interventions gently. I feel too much like I just need to put a raincoat on and let it run off me. It's too tiring to keep reminding him when I have a lot going on for myself at present. It's the main reason why I don't see that much of him since reverting to friendship. The "faux outrage" trieds to communicate lightly that this behaviour is tiresome. That approach does not work yet I seem stuck in it. It just compounds things. To be gently truthful as I was before and say, "I don't like it when you say X, it feels demeaning / hurtful / undermining" feels too much like I am kicking someone who already goes away and thinks "I am so horrible for saying x, why can't I just let people be who they are?" I want to be kind. He's been through absolute hell, his attachment style is very unsurprising. I don't want my bit of his story to be another person that scars him, but rather be a constructive presence who believes and supports his worth as a person regardless of some difficult behaviours. I'm not willing to do that in a way that damages my own wellbeing and will keep as much distance as is necessary to preserve that. |
|
|
|
Post by alexandra on Feb 20, 2019 20:26:30 GMT
birdy It's a combination distancing behavior to keep others at an acceptable arm's length and negative outlook/frustration that everything isn't "perfect" and under the person's control, which is fear-based + insecurity. If it's disrespectful, I agree to speak up tactfully or ask why they say it to create open dialog, then take distance yourself if it's unacceptable to you and not excuse it as attachment style-driven. But it's good you can recognize that it's not really about you and want to have boundaries in place (which is really all you can do), because if that same FA is triggered anxious, they may suddenly idealize you and compliment the very same things they're complaining about.
|
|
|
|
Post by alexandra on Feb 20, 2019 20:34:21 GMT
Helsbells, his focus on physical and appearance probably stems from him feeling bad about who he is underneath and that he's damaged and unacceptable somehow "soul"-wise, but he has more ways to control superficial stuff which is lauded in western society anyway (people can really overvalue physical attraction), so it makes him feel better if he is more confident he can "offer" that and therefore also judgemental about those attributes in others. It's also possible he had someone close to him in childhood who overvalued physical appearance and their acceptance of him was too conditionally wrapped up in that, so that's what he learned to prioritize.
|
|
|
|
Post by alexandra on Feb 20, 2019 20:40:27 GMT
Oh, and one more thing. Sometimes that kind of nitpicking can also be projections about what the person actually doesn't like about themselves, without them realizing it. So it's also redirecting self-blame in a more palatable way for them. Again, my point is, please continue not to take it personally and let it erode your self-confidence. You deserve to feel good around other people you treat properly, even if they have attachment issues.
|
|
|
|
Post by faithopelove on Feb 20, 2019 21:02:19 GMT
Hello Forum, I posted once before over in the DA forum. I since figured out my friend is an FA so I'm posting here instead today. I dated this man for almost 6 months. We split up, and are now friends. All good. I still find I regularly get his "running commentary of minor flaws" negativity about my behaviours, decisions etc. It particularly happens when we've spent more time together, or as a snapback after a really great outing etc. I don't take it personally or absorb the messaging; I know it's the FA attachment showing up. When I'm tired and need a break from it, our contact ceases for a while and I spend time with other friends instead. My FA friend and I have some great common interests and he needs support, so I don't feel the need to walk away from the friendship. I am interested in how to set better boundaries that decrease or deter the fault finding behaviour when it starts up. I don't want to make him feel bad. If I say things like, "You are becoming scratchy with me, are you aware of it?" he gets defensive and denies it is happening. Responding directly just makes him feel lousy. But I've not found good advice online about a better way to do this. I feel that when I just put up with this, I'm disrespecting myself. I let him fall well below a standard I'd expect of others, when I permit him to pick away at me verbally. However, I don't challenge it because I'm just not sure how to do it without reinforcing his self loathing. So my only tactic is just to decrease our contact until there's enough distance that he chills out. Could the wisdom of this forum help me? This man is aware of this trait in himself. He beats himself up about it, and expressed a wish to change it more than once. He knows it contributes to the demise of his romantic relationships. Over the months, it just got worse, and his view is presently "Ugh I'm just wired this way, it's hopeless." I would say, I feel (blank) when you (blank). If you make it about yourself and how you feel then maybe he’ll be more receptive. |
|
|
|
Post by sissyk on Feb 21, 2019 0:42:05 GMT
I'm in a similar situation. My DA and I recalibrated and are just friends. It is nice, isn't it? All kinds of connections are possible in this big ole world.
My take would be if you are just friends, accept how he is. If it reaches a tipping point of annoyance for you, you have the right to stop hanging out.
It is like hearing someone else's baby crying on an airplane. Not your problem.
If his behavior is irritating you and you feel he might be amenable to change, can you make your point with humor? Otherwise, ignore the bad stuff. The lack of any reinforcement may help extinguish. Reward the good with enthusiasm.
|
|
