m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 15, 2019 23:07:55 GMT
The other thing to add, is that being a partner to an avoidant person tends to bring out anxious behaviour even in the most secure of people. Attachment styles certainly have a situation component. Most people would be triggered by what you've been through - intimacy requires vulnerability and it's not safe to be vulnerable with someone who's behaviour doesn't quite add up. Yes, I have heard that before. A lot of people wouldn't tolerate the situation I had with her. And had I not been co-parenting my kids half the time I would have demanded more time with her which probably wouldn't have worked. So it seemed to be symbiotic that way as she wanted time by herself and I needed time to focus on my kiddos. Whatever the case, it feels terrible right now. And worse, I inadvertently came across her new facebook photo today, and she looks gorgeous - looks like a professional work photo. We were never friends on facebook (it just leads to bad things if you are FB friends with someone you are dating) but a friend of mine is friends with her and she popped up in his friend list. It is just a photo but it reminded me that she's starting a whole new life out there and should be free to pursue whatever and whomever she wants -- just as I should here. It feels like that is what is behind her not wanting me to visit anytime soon. And I feel sort of out of place trying to wedge my way into her new world. I know in my mind I'm probably sensationalizing her new life out there but its just the state of mind I'm in at the moment. So I really feel I need to detach and let this fade into my history, which I think will happen anyway as its hard to see her reaching out to me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 15, 2019 23:49:10 GMT
Ignoring someone on their birthday to generate interest is a shit move. It might trigger anxiety in an FA or something, but as a DA if someone ignored my birthday it would validate the distance I've allowed. It doesn't matter, it's just manipulative.
I think it's terrible what's happened with your relationship, and I know it's very painful. It's a raw deal. I think it's a wise move to distance yourself, have you thought about no contact? As to the birthday, not considering any kind of manipulation at all, you could let it pass because truly, the relationship has ended and hanging on will prolong your pain. It's just one birthday, the distance is indeed valid, and you're not obliged to be friends or take care of her feelings at all while you grieve and recover from the breakup.
Perhaps at some point later on you can reconnect when you aren't hurting and this isn't fresh
Not a bad idea to block her on facebook. I agree that friending on FB is a horrible idea, it causes so much drama. Blocking would just prevent you from seeing what WITHOUT STUPID SOCIAL MEDIA, you wouldn't. It's not mean it is practical. I swear social media is the lamest thing for a breakup and is a way to avoid closure if you don't take control of what you're seeing. Lots of anxious people on here check up on their ex's FB and make themselves miserable with it. Protect yourself.
Again, I'm sorry you've experienced this. That was a lot of involvement to end suddenly, kids and family all involved. ?Very painful.
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m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 16, 2019 0:56:53 GMT
Thanks. It seems surreal to be dealing with this. I am sure as I move on with life the dysfunction of this relationship will be more vivid. I sort of knew what I was getting into with her knowing her and our history. She would tell me her only child/daughter would get frustrated with her inability to be stable and be so flighty. Her own daughter is very grounded, stable, and is a homebody. There's a ton of family history here I could elaborate on but suffice to say it makes total sense to me why that is the case.
So I really don't feel like I need to sustain this relationship. And the b-day is rapidly becoming a nonevent for me. I don't want to be friends with someone I was intimate with. So at this point we are in effect broken up in my eyes. Maybe I'm getting off the canvas and having some self respect now. She has to figure our her own stuff. I hope the best for her but for me to seek to be supportive seems masochistic. I've never dated an avoidant, so to be honest I stuck with her because she is a very attractive woman so I was willing to tolerate her DA style - maybe I was hoping she would bond more closely to me. I did say to her maybe someday we will be old and gray and living on a boat somewhere. Sometimes you just feel connected to someone and you don't want it to end despite the difficulties you experience. I know she battles her own self-esteem issues relating to her (still) neglectful mother, but I can't keep trying to battle that without her willingness to recognize how it affects her in relationships. So I can be happy that we shared some great times, and I know she valued what we shared over the past few years. We all move through chapters in our lives that includes different places and characters.
I will block her FB page. Social media is so misleading and stupid. Since my mom joined FB I have tended to avoid it. And I don't see the need to. The woman I speak of is eastern european so she posts stuff for her family back home. FB reminds me of watching TV, which of course is nothing but fiction. What gives me comfort is knowing life is a long continuum of time and events that we can't predict, which makes it so intriguing. Who knows who we will meet, what opportunities will open up, and how we will feel in the future. Don't resist, accept life.
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m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 16, 2019 15:19:06 GMT
I know this is a lot of ruminating, but I'm still angry and heartbroken about it. I realize she's a deeply hurt person who's learned through her life to not trust or rely on anyone she is romantic with. Her daughter is the only person in this world that I think she fully trusts and loves, and has been the only constant in her life. But her daughter is now on her own, and that must be terrifying for my ex. What is interesting is that her daughter lived on her own for all of 6 months after she moved out following college before her apartment burned down, so she moves back into the house with her mom, and never left! Its been 18 months now, and she is now renting the house with friends from her mom now that her mom moved away. Also interesting was how she would describe how different they were -- her daughter was always 'emotional' and nostalgic about things whereas she(her mom, my ex) was not that way at all....and that she'd tell her daughter to get over things etc. Clearly mom was the avoidant here and couldn't even relate to her daughters emotional energy. I don't know why I'm rambling about this. I want to move on, but I want her to come back...but its really distracting me and weighing on my productivity at work, and being a present father for my kids. She's a toxic person for me and I know I have to move on from her completely. Will this ever end??? Ugh!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2019 16:44:53 GMT
Even if you have AP attachment, even if there are a million reasons why you feel the way you do, think the way you do, and choose unavailable partners,
IT ENDS WHEN YOU END IT.
Time heals nothing if you spend your time looking back. If you don't believe this read around at AP who are still ruminating about getting dumped months, even YEARS ago.
Get yourself some support for moving on. Get yourself some support for figuring out why you ended up here with a woman who clearly had issues. You have issues.
This is scary stuff because the reality is, you have the option to stay in your own pattern for years and years. Miserable. Or you have the option to get really proactive and beat your own self defeating habits.
That's the case for all of us. No one can do it for us. PERIOD.
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m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 16, 2019 21:30:58 GMT
I feel like for me its a process of gradually letting go. I want to just turn off the switch like she can but I'm not wired that way. It takes me weeks to process it, get back to a self-improvement routine of working out, maybe go on some dates, see friends. I can intellectualize the whole thing and it makes perfect sense, but on an emotional level it does not. I know I am imagining her in a light that was much better than she is - she doesn't deserve to be on a pedestal of course. And her life in her new city is probably no more fabulous than it was here (ok, it must be a little better given that its a much bigger city on the west coast). But she'll still carry the same traumas and relationship drama into whatever she gets into out there.
And the likely reason it 'worked' for us is because we avoided difficult conversations mostly by only seeing each other 1-2x per week, and it was usually dinner at home, stay overnight, and leave the next morning...sometimes a weekend day/evening together...and then a trip somewhere every few months. No conversations about what the future holds for us, or do we want to make a commitment; we didn't even ever define the relationship or talk about exclusivity. I figured out she was uncomfortable about talking about our future...that day to day is better, and who knows where the wind will blow her now that she's an empty nester. All of these were signs that I shouldn't get deeper with this person. But I kept on, and now experiencing the downside of it. Live and learn!
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Post by mrob on Jun 16, 2019 23:13:16 GMT
Even if you have AP attachment, even if there are a million reasons why you feel the way you do, think the way you do, and choose unavailable partners, IT ENDS WHEN YOU END IT. Time heals nothing if you spend your time looking back. If you don't believe this read around at AP who are still ruminating about getting dumped months, even YEARS ago. Get yourself some support for moving on. Get yourself some support for figuring out why you ended up here with a woman who clearly had issues. You have issues. This is scary stuff because the reality is, you have the option to stay in your own pattern for years and years. Miserable. Or you have the option to get really proactive and beat your own self defeating habits. That's the case for all of us. No one can do it for us. PERIOD. While I absolutely agree with all of that, it needs to be said that there is time for grief. It is a process, and it goes at a different pace for different people. I would also agree that the saying “time heals all wounds” is rubbish. I went around in a spiral for two years after my first marriage, treating myself with alcohol and not dealing with anything. Don’t be too hard on yourself, m2. The time will come, but the inward look is the answer.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2019 23:28:27 GMT
Even if you have AP attachment, even if there are a million reasons why you feel the way you do, think the way you do, and choose unavailable partners, IT ENDS WHEN YOU END IT. Time heals nothing if you spend your time looking back. If you don't believe this read around at AP who are still ruminating about getting dumped months, even YEARS ago. Get yourself some support for moving on. Get yourself some support for figuring out why you ended up here with a woman who clearly had issues. You have issues. This is scary stuff because the reality is, you have the option to stay in your own pattern for years and years. Miserable. Or you have the option to get really proactive and beat your own self defeating habits. That's the case for all of us. No one can do it for us. PERIOD. While I absolutely agree with all of that, it needs to be said that there is time for grief. It is a process, and it goes at a different pace for different people. I would also agree that the saying “time heals all wounds” is rubbish. I went around in a spiral for two years after my first marriage, treating myself with alcohol and not dealing with anything. Don’t be too hard on yourself, m2. The time will come, but the inward look is the answer. Oh absolutely, there is a time for grief. Unless one is totally self medicating somehow, it won't be avoided. All I am saying, is grieve to let go of someone who let go of you. That's the quicksand that I see so many get stuck in- grieving while hanging on or looking back trying to recreate what was lost. I do believe one has to be discerning about how they process, who they process with, and what they do with this time. You have to let it burn, and it's painful as hell. I think we have all been there at some point but some never face the final end, and spend years holding on. It's an AP think so if you aren't aware of that tendency, be careful to not set yourself into a rut while you grieve. This stuff is rough.
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m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 17, 2019 1:28:12 GMT
Thank you all for the responses, it's very helpful to me. And yes, this is very rough! And yes, a slow burn that finally goes out. That sounds dramatic but it's an accurate metaphor. I feel like its basically a process of starting a new routine that I really don't want to do. It's hard as hell to start, but it starts with one week, then another week, until eventually that becomes the familiar and comfortable routine without this other person. But I do wish she would feel the same thing, but I know she doesn't, which makes it more aggravating. Of course, if she did feel as I do, I probably would have never crossed paths with here since she'd likely have been in a long term relationship or marriage long before I met her. She'll move to the next one, and another one, and another one. It helps me process this knowing that.
This is the first breakup that ended on such a high note. My prior relationships ended well after their expiration date, so it seemed easier to accept those. But, even in those, I felt a deep sense of grief and separation anxiety, which I know is some sort of abandonment issue from childhood. So as I look at this further it does seem like a pretty bad anxious-avoidant combination that was bound to implode at some point. In some ways, I felt like I was dating someone that had no long term memory. Like each date was like a first date. Maybe that is how it felt for her -- no harm done because it wasn't ever a deep relationship.
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Post by alexandra on Jun 17, 2019 2:16:16 GMT
m2, I'm sorry you're going through this. I know it's difficult to lose someone when things are mostly good and it's likely attachment issues rearing their ugly head. One thing I can't help but notice in your posts is you've filled in a lot of her narrative. You keep saying how easy it was for her to flip her switch off and walk away while you mourn and hurt. This is very much an AP thing to do -- project a negative narrative and get caught up in ruminating in it and putting yourself down, making it worse. Yes, she's avoidant. Yes, she has different coping mechanisms than you (unlikely to be healthy ones). But that's really all you can assume. Maybe she's not hurting in the same way right now because she hurts all the time in other ways. Maybe she'll feel your loss later. Maybe she does feel it now but doesn't want anyone to know, including herself. You can actually learn a lot about how you feel about yourself through the assumptions you're making about how she is feeling and handling the break up.
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m2
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Post by m2 on Jun 17, 2019 2:36:50 GMT
Great points. Yes, I can feel myself creating that negative narrative! It feels like I'm obsessed with it. I feel like I created this highlight reel in my head of her in her new life, so happy and enjoying herself and others with no recollection of her past. And I keep thinking that she left here because she needed a change and felt bad about her life here -- and since I was part of her life here I am part of that bad part of her experience here. In reality, it seemed I was one of the best parts! So why does she leave that then? How do I reconcile that? Maybe even if she was secure she'd still opt to move to advance her career and leave the relationship -- likely handled a bit differently, but it does seem that maybe I am taking the move too personally.
Update: With a little therapy I can see this a bit more clearly...my avoidant was very affectionate and encouraging about our future just before she left because she had her escape hatch of moving across the country in a matter of weeks - so there was less fear about drawing closer, and also helped avoid a confrontation. And I am trying to view the 'relationship' for what it was...really just a companionship that had no long term commitments, so an exit like that shouldn't be surprising. The problem was that I got attached and made it/hoped that would be more in my mind. This too shall pass.
2nd Update: I've now discovered that she is now "in a relationship" according to her FB status, just a few weeks after she relocated (she never changed its from 'single' when we were dating)....even though she told me to my face at least 3 times that she was moving there for her career and not moving for a relationship and that we would maintain our relationship. Just reviewing the timeline this year it seems now so obvious she was seeking to move out there to be with this other person, and maintained her relationship with me so that she had something here in case she couldn't get a job offer out there. It's been really distressing to me that someone can lie, manipulate, and betray so easily with someone she's been with for 18 months. Maybe she's not avoidant at all, but rather never saw a long term future with me and therefore viewed my relationship as disposable. I am sad that I spent so much time with someone that is capable of hurting me so effortlessly and without any explanation.
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