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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 7, 2019 19:15:15 GMT
I have literally no idea how or what to do here... She's expressed she want to be friends but already made motions of withdrawing. She cut things off early last week, when we finally made plans to meet up for the first time in 7 weeks on the fourth. Saying she had no feelings, but wants to stay friends. Already retraced the plans we had, even though we were going to keep them.
Should I go NC and wait for her? I texted her earlier today asking how her event from this weekend went? But honestly what should I do? When she pushed to cancel our 4th plans, she suggested next weekend but i have a strong feeling she'll cancel that too, or stay noncommittal as long as possible.
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Post by slowlybutsurely on Jul 8, 2019 21:23:55 GMT
Sounds super frustrating. Sorry you are going through this—the push/pull stuff is hard, even as a friend. My hunch, though an FA would be best set to answer this, is that she perceives you as being on her 'inner circle' and thus, in some ways, you are an 'enemy' to her. You know too much about her, and she's hesitant to meet up because she's afraid of the intimacy of what you already know and panics as the time to hang out together gets closer and closer in time. Perhaps this will settle one day, but it's best to assume not. I reached out to my FA ex after 4 weeks of NC to 'regroup and become 'friends' because she expressed 'relief' in knowing that we'd stay friends when we broke up. She told me to reach out, and has now not responded a week after I've written her .... I suspect that advice I gave to you above holds true for me as well. I got too close.  For what it's worth, you are a threat because you are cared for ... that's the hard part for us non FAs to fully wrap our heads around. She doesn't want to see you because she knows you're close, and wants distance from that closeness even though she really wants it. Best of luck friend. |
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Post by Deleted on Jul 8, 2019 21:39:48 GMT
Sounds super frustrating. Sorry you are going through this—the push/pull stuff is hard, even as a friend. My hunch, though an FA would be best set to answer this, is that she perceives you as being on her 'inner circle' and thus, in some ways, you are an 'enemy' to her. You know too much about her, and she's hesitant to meet up because she's afraid of the intimacy of what you already know and panics as the time to hang out together gets closer and closer in time. Perhaps this will settle one day, but it's best to assume not. I reached out to my FA ex after 4 weeks of NC to 'regroup and become 'friends' because she expressed 'relief' in knowing that we'd stay friends when we broke up. She told me to reach out, and has now not responded a week after I've written her .... I suspect that advice I gave to you above holds true for me as well. I got too close. For what it's worth, you are a threat because you are cared for ... that's the hard part for us non FAs to fully wrap our heads around. She doesn't want to see you because she knows you're close, and wants distance from that closeness even though she really wants it. Best of luck friend. Wonderfully well expressed. |
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Post by alexandra on Jul 9, 2019 3:37:10 GMT
We're all not alone! I'm secure now, and acted it from start to finish recently getting to know a guy for a few months. It became more and more apparent that he is probably FA and, though we got on really well, we weren't looking for the same level of commitment (I want a serious relationship, he doesn't). So, I broke it off, and it was sad but fully discussed (it's not about how I feel about him, it's that we're not aligned on what we want and inevitably that will hurt me / us) and it was very mutually respectful and sweet. He said he wanted to keep hearing from me, I didn't promise anything in the moment.
I took about a month of no contact (including hiding his social media but no one deleted the other person) in order to give myself space to get over the situation and decide if I want to be friends, and I absolutely do. Just because we can't have a workable romantic relationship doesn't mean I never want to talk to him again. I wish him well and did start thinking of him as a friend too as we got to know each other. I reached out to say yes, I had to take some time but I want friendship if you do because I value you, and I never got any response. I'm finding that after a couple weeks without a reply it actually started triggering some anxiety, but there doesn't really seem like there's anything to act on. So I'm sad if we never speak again, but trying to ignore the anxiety and just take comfort that I communicated my needs/wants every step of the way and let the disappointment pass.
Plenty of rumination scenarios have run through my head about why I'm getting the silent treatment, but you can't know the other person's process if they're not sharing it. There's no right answer for how to handle it, besides respecting the other person's boundaries and not focusing too much energy on it if it's not a two-way street. Don't try to control the situation to produce an outcome, because you can't control other people (and you'll drive yourself crazy trying).
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 12:02:53 GMT
Ended up being stranded in her town (car got hit) and having to stay the last two nights in her house. So we hung out a couple times, and had a bad convo that I'll post about. Basically, I mentioned how even though I wasn't upset at all when she ended things, which she'd expected, I had been upset because I felt like I was being "faded" on. She was not happy about that, especially because I brought it up like 3 times. Felt insulted, because in her mind she had been telling me that she was busy, and stuff. She had, but it really had felt like I was being "faded" on and she wasn't interested. So that conversation ended not great...and apparently I had already done that earlier in the week, without realizing it? Kept apologizing, apparently I annoyed her with that. I'm in a very very weird position right now...
All the stuff was real, too. I felt pretty bad after and now I'm pretty confused. That conversation never should have happened.
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 14:01:49 GMT
Sounds super frustrating. Sorry you are going through this—the push/pull stuff is hard, even as a friend. My hunch, though an FA would be best set to answer this, is that she perceives you as being on her 'inner circle' and thus, in some ways, you are an 'enemy' to her. You know too much about her, and she's hesitant to meet up because she's afraid of the intimacy of what you already know and panics as the time to hang out together gets closer and closer in time. Perhaps this will settle one day, but it's best to assume not. I reached out to my FA ex after 4 weeks of NC to 'regroup and become 'friends' because she expressed 'relief' in knowing that we'd stay friends when we broke up. She told me to reach out, and has now not responded a week after I've written her .... I suspect that advice I gave to you above holds true for me as well. I got too close. For what it's worth, you are a threat because you are cared for ... that's the hard part for us non FAs to fully wrap our heads around. She doesn't want to see you because she knows you're close, and wants distance from that closeness even though she really wants it. Best of luck friend. Wonderfully well expressed. Honestly, after last night I'm not even sure what to think anymore. I posted about it here and in another thread. |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 14:04:05 GMT
We're all not alone! I'm secure now, and acted it from start to finish recently getting to know a guy for a few months. It became more and more apparent that he is probably FA and, though we got on really well, we weren't looking for the same level of commitment (I want a serious relationship, he doesn't). So, I broke it off, and it was sad but fully discussed (it's not about how I feel about him, it's that we're not aligned on what we want and inevitably that will hurt me / us) and it was very mutually respectful and sweet. He said he wanted to keep hearing from me, I didn't promise anything in the moment. I took about a month of no contact (including hiding his social media but no one deleted the other person) in order to give myself space to get over the situation and decide if I want to be friends, and I absolutely do. Just because we can't have a workable romantic relationship doesn't mean I never want to talk to him again. I wish him well and did start thinking of him as a friend too as we got to know each other. I reached out to say yes, I had to take some time but I want friendship if you do because I value you, and I never got any response. I'm finding that after a couple weeks without a reply it actually started triggering some anxiety, but there doesn't really seem like there's anything to act on. So I'm sad if we never speak again, but trying to ignore the anxiety and just take comfort that I communicated my needs/wants every step of the way and let the disappointment pass. Plenty of rumination scenarios have run through my head about why I'm getting the silent treatment, but you can't know the other person's process if they're not sharing it. There's no right answer for how to handle it, besides respecting the other person's boundaries and not focusing too much energy on it if it's not a two-way street. Don't try to control the situation to produce an outcome, because you can't control other people (and you'll drive yourself crazy trying). Honestly, after last night I'm not even sure what to think anymore. I posted about it here and in another thread. I honestly think I may have drastically damaged the chances of us being good friends, going forward. :/ |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 14:22:26 GMT
Also, I want to add, this having happened makes me hesitant to be super close with her in the future. I don't like not having closure on this. It's happened before, and it sucked then.
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Post by alexandra on Jul 9, 2019 15:47:45 GMT
isildur4797 I agree with the responses you're getting in the DA thread, and to introspect about what you really want in your situation. You are definitely anxious triggered, and you're projecting into the blanks and writing your own version of the narrative that's not listening to what she's telling you... and trying to explain your anticipation of her behavior through attachment theory that may or may not actually explain her. You've got to self-regulate this one, not look for closure through her words and actions, and respect her boundaries. Then she'll come to you when she's ready. The FA guy I just talked about. I'd started to pull away once before when it came up that we wanted different things, and he asked me to give it more time. I thought it through and agreed, and he was very distant in response -- he answered me slowly and curtly and said he was busy with something that sounded like an excuse (though he did still answer). I simply said okay, even though I felt it might be him deactivating, and a week later when he was done with the thing making him busy he texted to say let's make plans and his schedule was wide open for me. And then everything was fine until we broke it off because he wanted to keep seeing me but not get more serious (and now he won't talk to me at all). Last year I went on a few dates with a guy who was unaware extreme AP, and that became obvious to me by the third meeting. He was in therapy for anxiety but he just had no understanding yet of his issues. He didn't listen to anything I said I was looking for or wanted and twisted all of my words and stomped all of my boundaries. I didn't mention attachment theory to him, but when I said we shouldn't date and he asked me for closure, I said fine because I had been that level of AP like 15 years earlier. He asked to stay friends. I said I wanted a month of no contact so we both could have space first and then we could see. He kept texting and texting, and I wasn't responding because I'd stated I wasn't going to talk to him, and finally I texted back that I wasn't comfortable that he ignored the boundary we agreed on and I no longer wanted to even try to be friends. He said he didn't know I was serious about being strict about it then sent me so many triggered long texts that were him emotionally vomiting on me with projection and were really him fighting with himself. I never talked to him again, because he couldn't respect me or see me as my own person when I was always honest, direct, and my words and actions aligned. So, that's the perspective from an ex AP who understands it having someone else go totally anxious at me even though I did my best to give him some closure, because the closure really only comes from yourself.
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 16:15:30 GMT
isildur4797 I agree with the responses you're getting in the DA thread, and to introspect about what you really want in your situation. You are definitely anxious triggered, and you're projecting into the blanks and writing your own version of the narrative that's not listening to what she's telling you... and trying to explain your anticipation of her behavior through attachment theory that may or may not actually explain her. You've got to self-regulate this one, not look for closure through her words and actions, and respect her boundaries. Then she'll come to you when she's ready. The FA guy I just talked about. I'd started to pull away once before when it came up that we wanted different things, and he asked me to give it more time. I thought it through and agreed, and he was very distant in response -- he answered me slowly and curtly and said he was busy with something that sounded like an excuse (though he did still answer). I simply said okay, even though I felt it might be him deactivating, and a week later when he was done with the thing making him busy he texted to say let's make plans and his schedule was wide open for me. And then everything was fine until we broke it off because he wanted to keep seeing me but not get more serious (and now he won't talk to me at all). Last year I went on a few dates with a guy who was unaware extreme AP, and that became obvious to me by the third meeting. He was in therapy for anxiety but he just had no understanding yet of his issues. He didn't listen to anything I said I was looking for or wanted and twisted all of my words and stomped all of my boundaries. I didn't mention attachment theory to him, but when I said we shouldn't date and he asked me for closure, I said fine because I had been that level of AP like 15 years earlier. He asked to stay friends. I said I wanted a month of no contact so we both could have space first and then we could see. He kept texting and texting, and I wasn't responding because I'd stated I wasn't going to talk to him, and finally I texted back that I wasn't comfortable that he ignored the boundary we agreed on and I no longer wanted to even try to be friends. He said he didn't know I was serious about being strict about it then sent me so many triggered long texts that were him emotionally vomiting on me with projection and were really him fighting with himself. I never talked to him again, because he couldn't respect me or see me as my own person when I was always honest, direct, and my words and actions aligned. So, that's the perspective from an ex AP who understands it having someone else go totally anxious at me even though I did my best to give him some closure, because the closure really only comes from yourself. That's a fair point. I will give her space then. I just hope I have a chance to talk to her before I move my stuff out of her house and head home... That way it won't end on an awkward note. Just talk normally, don't even mention this stuff. I am pretty embearssed though about the night before. By "my version of the narrative" do you mean this post, me discussing what happened the other night and how I bothered her, or other posts that I made? That last one is definitely true lol, a thing I've especially begun to realize |
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Post by alexandra on Jul 9, 2019 16:20:58 GMT
isildur4797, I mean she's told you she's busy, and you have posted saying maybe she's busy but I think she's really distancing and deactivating and she's going to cancel again etc. etc. Then when you expressed that you felt that way about her behavior to her, she got upset that you read into it so much. Sure, it's possible your narrative may be true and she'll get overwhelmed by her attachment issues and detach. It's a risk. But it hasn't happened yet, and if you anticipate that will happen instead of giving her a chance to do what she's going to do, then you'll sabotage things. Even if she does end up doing that on her own, without you pushing her away first... you'll be fine. You will still be okay, with or without her around. But give her a chance first before giving into your fears that she's got a grand plan to distance herself from you just because she said she's busy and needs a little space for now.
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Post by alexandra on Jul 9, 2019 16:23:15 GMT
Also, look at your word choice. You describe your telling her how you feel as "bothering" her. Don't be so negative towards yourself. You're figuring out some pretty heavy stuff about yourself, and you're just at the beginning of it. Negative word choices, while unconscious, feed into the negative narrative common to APs and sometimes FAs.
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 16:29:53 GMT
isildur4797 , I mean she's told you she's busy, and you have posted saying maybe she's busy but I think she's really distancing and deactivating and she's going to cancel again etc. etc. Then when you expressed that you felt that way about her behavior to her, she got upset that you read into it so much. Sure, it's possible your narrative may be true and she'll get overwhelmed by her attachment issues and detach. It's a risk. But it hasn't happened yet, and if you anticipate that will happen instead of giving her a chance to do what she's going to do, then you'll sabotage things. Even if she does end up doing that on her own, without you pushing her away first... you'll be fine. You will still be okay, with or without her around. But give her a chance first before giving into your fears that she's got a grand plan to distance herself from you just because she said she's busy and needs a little space for now. I mean when I said it before, it was like a 4 week period of time, and we hadn't known each other for two long. But yeah, going forward I'm going to be better about that. I hop eI can fix this with her though. We talked this morning, in person, and things seemed fine. So yeah, I'm going to assume that. |
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Post by isildur4797 on Jul 9, 2019 16:30:59 GMT
Also, look at your word choice. You describe your telling her how you feel as "bothering" her. Don't be so negative towards yourself. You're figuring out some pretty heavy stuff about yourself, and you're just at the beginning of it. Negative word choices, while unconscious, feed into the negative narrative common to APs and sometimes FAs. I mean part of it is that I was like "all my apologizing last night probably annoyed you" and she said it did a little. Like I said I feel worse about the fact that I'm worried I'm ruining things. I've ruined things before, even when I thought they started out fine. Realizing I insulted her last week didn't help with that at all. |
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Post by lilyg on Jul 9, 2019 16:47:05 GMT
Hmm I had something like this happen to me some years ago (I was in her position). I met a very nice and handsome guy just after I ended a serious relationship and things moved too fast and I got scared and overwhelmed. I ended breaking it off with him and he was pretty nice about it at first but then got super mad at me for not 'showing' him that I wanted a friendship with him after long and long emails and pressuring me to go out with him as Friends and I don't know. I finally got mad at him and felt so pressured and turned off that we lost touch althogether. Of course you are not like him and well, what I really want to say is to stop contacting her and insisting on being part of her life. Or get mad at her for fading you away from her life. It won't help your case. You already expressed interest, let her go. Let it happen naturally. Maybe she will come back, maybe she won't. Don't invest too much in her, invest in her as much as she invests in you. Be reasonable... and really think why do you want a friendship with her. And don't feel bad about it, don't apologise anymore! It's normal to feel anxiety after we break up with someone we fancy a lot. I'm sure she's not handling it perfectly either. But time and space will help you either way: with her having to sit through her decision, and mostly for you to move on and focus on yourself and your real wants and needs. And give yourself a break  You haven't done anything unforgivable! |
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You haven't done anything unforgivable!