jules
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Post by jules on Oct 18, 2019 9:11:58 GMT
Hi all.
Just celebrated a year of my non relationship-relationship with my non boyfriend-boyfriend. As suspected no plans were actually made until the evening of and with no great fanfare, actually no fanfare at all. Thankfully I am both secure and used to this kinda thing from him so it didn't upset me or anything but it is a stark contrast from any other relationship I have ever had (I have never dated anyone other than a secure. Married a secure, albeit a jerk, but a secure jerk)
We ate, hung out a bit and climbed into bed. Again during sex he asked me if we were making love. He does this frequently, unsure why. I usually dont answer bc it catches me off guard. After he was rather mushy and sentimental. urging me to say something along those lines too. I froze. Kinda laughed and said I cant conjure things up on the spot. Even said "I dont think you want me to say mushy stuff, this feels like a set up!" We laughed. He mentioned I have said mushy stuff via text.. which I have, usually after I have broken up with him and a week or two later I circle back.
I feel like I am mirroring. Withdrawling myself helps me protect myself. If I really let myself fall in love here, I fear I will get really hurt. The rollercoaster is... ugh. Exhausting.
He met my parents and a sibling over the summer but stated that day he didn't want to define the relationship. OK. So periodically I continue to go on, usually awful, first dates. I don't talk about this with him. I dont think he does this. But hes pretty adamant about not defining things. Never once mentioned exclusivity. Well, maybe once last winter when after about 5 months I asked what we were doing here and he kinda snarked at me "what do you need a label?" Umm, yes!
So no labels.
I care tremendously for this man. I would happily give up the glory that is online dating and ride out my days with this man if I thought he'd be game. The thing is that I realize hes got a shit ton of self work to do, and I'm unsure if hes aware,much less interested.
I had a vague conversation with him a little while back about attachment and what I perceived to be true about his relationship with his mother. It was pretty quick. And he said he couldn't disagree with me and then said "this doesn't make me a bad person " I assured him it does not.
That said, it does not make him a person who is capable of fulfilling my minor needs. I'm ok with the distance, as we usually still maintain some communication daily. What I do not care for is spending Saturday nights on my couch. Seems pretty simple, right? I mean. What the actual fuck? And it has cultivated an attitude in me that says screw it, I'm going out. And i frequently do. It's like I'm just keeping this thing going until an active participant comes along to win me over. No such luck thus far.
I really want this one. We have a great repore. We laugh like morons. The sex is phenomenal. We understand each other. It's just this. This constant roadblock from true bonding. Lots of growth on his part in the past year. He is trying. But it's always come here go away. Hes not nasty, nor cutting to me. No idealic ex. In his words his ex tried to control him. I take that as the woman probably loved him and wanted to see him more and that engulfed him. I dont believe half the crap anyone says about their ex.
I just said my ex is a jerk, and he is, but I too was culpable in the demise of my marriage. Takes two.
So I guess year 2 is when the attachment really rears up?
Not sure what to do.
I periodically get fed up with his wishy washy and break up. Hes never broken io with me. About two months in I walked when I couldn't deal with the distance. Last year December. I had no clue until june that this was an attachment thing. I just thought he was hiding something. He circled back in February and we've been riding this rollercoaster since.
Am I a fool to stay. Someday I think I am. I'm not oblivious to the fact that hes got a lot to work on *if he wants to. I dont ask. Not trying to trigger him.
I dont feel its walking on eggshells...I feel like it's not cool to say basically "hey. You know all that painful shit from your past? Let's conjure that up for a real painful yuck experience" not my place.
I do not understand this bit. His parents are still married. he sees them and talks to them still. He is avoidant with me about the mother. I wonder how he maintains a relationship with her. Honestly my gut tells me she sexually abused him. Not sure why but its the feeling i get. It's not important that i know, I'd never ask. But it's the feeling I get.
I'm rambling. Not even sure why I posted. A vent. Just putting it out there. Thoughts?
Thanks.
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kelly
New Member
Posts: 47
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Post by kelly on Oct 18, 2019 22:08:08 GMT
Hi all. Just celebrated a year of my non relationship-relationship with my non boyfriend-boyfriend. As suspected no plans were actually made until the evening of and with no great fanfare, actually no fanfare at all. Thankfully I am both secure and used to this kinda thing from him so it didn't upset me or anything but it is a stark contrast from any other relationship I have ever had (I have never dated anyone other than a secure. Married a secure, albeit a jerk, but a secure jerk) We ate, hung out a bit and climbed into bed. Again during sex he asked me if we were making love. He does this frequently, unsure why. I usually dont answer bc it catches me off guard. After he was rather mushy and sentimental. urging me to say something along those lines too. I froze. Kinda laughed and said I cant conjure things up on the spot. Even said "I dont think you want me to say mushy stuff, this feels like a set up!" We laughed. He mentioned I have said mushy stuff via text.. which I have, usually after I have broken up with him and a week or two later I circle back. I feel like I am mirroring. Withdrawling myself helps me protect myself. If I really let myself fall in love here, I fear I will get really hurt. The rollercoaster is... ugh. Exhausting. He met my parents and a sibling over the summer but stated that day he didn't want to define the relationship. OK. So periodically I continue to go on, usually awful, first dates. I don't talk about this with him. I dont think he does this. But hes pretty adamant about not defining things. Never once mentioned exclusivity. Well, maybe once last winter when after about 5 months I asked what we were doing here and he kinda snarked at me "what do you need a label?" Umm, yes! So no labels. I care tremendously for this man. I would happily give up the glory that is online dating and ride out my days with this man if I thought he'd be game. The thing is that I realize hes got a shit ton of self work to do, and I'm unsure if hes aware,much less interested. I had a vague conversation with him a little while back about attachment and what I perceived to be true about his relationship with his mother. It was pretty quick. And he said he couldn't disagree with me and then said "this doesn't make me a bad person " I assured him it does not. That said, it does not make him a person who is capable of fulfilling my minor needs. I'm ok with the distance, as we usually still maintain some communication daily. What I do not care for is spending Saturday nights on my couch. Seems pretty simple, right? I mean. What the actual fuck? And it has cultivated an attitude in me that says screw it, I'm going out. And i frequently do. It's like I'm just keeping this thing going until an active participant comes along to win me over. No such luck thus far. I really want this one. We have a great repore. We laugh like morons. The sex is phenomenal. We understand each other. It's just this. This constant roadblock from true bonding. Lots of growth on his part in the past year. He is trying. But it's always come here go away. Hes not nasty, nor cutting to me. No idealic ex. In his words his ex tried to control him. I take that as the woman probably loved him and wanted to see him more and that engulfed him. I dont believe half the crap anyone says about their ex. I just said my ex is a jerk, and he is, but I too was culpable in the demise of my marriage. Takes two. So I guess year 2 is when the attachment really rears up? Not sure what to do. I periodically get fed up with his wishy washy and break up. Hes never broken io with me. About two months in I walked when I couldn't deal with the distance. Last year December. I had no clue until june that this was an attachment thing. I just thought he was hiding something. He circled back in February and we've been riding this rollercoaster since. Am I a fool to stay. Someday I think I am. I'm not oblivious to the fact that hes got a lot to work on *if he wants to. I dont ask. Not trying to trigger him. I dont feel its walking on eggshells...I feel like it's not cool to say basically "hey. You know all that painful shit from your past? Let's conjure that up for a real painful yuck experience" not my place. I do not understand this bit. His parents are still married. he sees them and talks to them still. He is avoidant with me about the mother. I wonder how he maintains a relationship with her. Honestly my gut tells me she sexually abused him. Not sure why but its the feeling i get. It's not important that i know, I'd never ask. But it's the feeling I get. I'm rambling. Not even sure why I posted. A vent. Just putting it out there. Thoughts? Thanks. I think you need to ask yourself if you want to be sitting here feeling the same way a year from now. If you are willing to feel this way in order to stay in this non-relationship with him, then carry on. If this is not enough, then you’ve got to do something. Don’t waste precious time. You’ll regret it. Personally, I find that I’m not really giving anyone else a chance if my heart belongs to another. I’m just going through the motions to tell myself I’m dating and not wasting time on one person I’m not compatible with. But that’s just what I tell myself to make it sound ok. If you really want to find someone more compatible, you’ve got to end it, give yourself time to heal and THEN date. You won’t find this great guy right now because you derp down don’t want to. You want your current guy to change and become that great guy. I just went through this myself. I learned a painful lesson. I need a secure man. |
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jules
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Posts: 142
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Post by jules on Oct 19, 2019 1:00:23 GMT
I think you need to ask yourself if you want to be sitting here feeling the same way a year from now. If you are willing to feel this way in order to stay in this non-relationship with him, then carry on. If this is not enough, then you’ve got to do something. Don’t waste precious time. You’ll regret it. Personally, I find that I’m not really giving anyone else a chance if my heart belongs to another. I’m just going through the motions to tell myself I’m dating and not wasting time on one person I’m not compatible with. But that’s just what I tell myself to make it sound ok. If you really want to find someone more compatible, you’ve got to end it, give yourself time to heal and THEN date. You won’t find this great guy right now because you derp down don’t want to. You want your current guy to change and become that great guy. I just went through this myself. I learned a painful lesson. I need a secure man. [/quote]
Thank you for the response.
I think posting this this AM really brought it into perspective.
I have had enough. After he refused to make plans and let me sit at home alone again over a weekend, and furthermore told me hes not stopping me from dating others. I am pretty much good here.
This relationshit has done nothing but cause my self esteem to take hits. Not usually the case. I think getting caught up in "potential" mixed with empathy for the traumatized has not served me at all. I'm not really sure why I have hung in so long? I should have listened to my gut; I know better.
I concur. I need time alone. I have just been offered a new job and that will be a welcome distraction. One where I need to focus.
I have known this all along. I just kept hanging onto some hope I guess. Pretty silly. All I have done is delayed the inevitable. Wasted time. This guy just leaves a bevy of women broken hearted in his wake. And I'm sorry. You cant go 40plus years unaware of your relationship failures. Oblivious.
If you dont want to change, admit you are lazy about it. Theres honor in honesty.
All day I have been thinking about how I had to change my life, my thinking, my inclinations when I got sober.
If you realize your life is suffering at your own hand and you do nothing about it? Well, you chose to stay sick in that kinda crap.
Not what I choose for me, nor who I associate with ordinarily. Its undeniable hes a sweet, smart soul and we all have baggage but some truly over pack.
I cannot help him unpack and I really do not have anymore time to give someone who doesn't want to or is not trying to actively get well. It's a total contradiction of my entire mentality.
Shame on me.
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Post by serenity on Oct 19, 2019 2:16:24 GMT
Hugs Jules <3 It really sucks to get to a (normally) exciting milestone like the one year anniversary, and feel like you're all alone and you've wasted time  Try not to let his distancing strategies hurt your self worth tho; he's doing this because he's formed an attachment to you and that's the only reason. It doesn't make you any less alone when you could be celebrating your anniversary though I've never bonded with a guy traumatically and been able to make a clean getaway either, even when logically I knew I should. These are very tough bonds to sever; the loss is so very painful to deal with, and your whole brain chemistry is setup to undermine you. I read somewhere that most partners try to leave up to 7 times before they finally leave for good. You're going to be okay. You're smart, you're doing your best. You're able to withdraw and give yourself space, which shows how strong you are, and you're already looking at other options. I believe you will find your way even if it feels like two steps forwards, one step back sometimes. <3 For strength: www.loveaddictionhelp.com/love-avoidant-partnerwww.loveaddictionhelp.com/12-distancing-strategies-the-love-avoidant-uses-to-avoid-intimacywww.loveaddictionhelp.com/no-contact-rule |
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Post by mrob on Oct 19, 2019 3:48:25 GMT
And I'm sorry. You cant go 40plus years unaware of your relationship failures. Oblivious. If you dont want to change, admit you are lazy about it. Theres honor in honesty If you’re sober, you’ll have seen people who really are that oblivious. Denial can be very powerful. |
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Post by serenity on Oct 19, 2019 9:21:59 GMT
You are so patient mrob. I bet you hear this all the time `my Fa guy is ignoring me, all the hate'. `My FA guy is back all the love'
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jules
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Posts: 142
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Post by jules on Oct 19, 2019 9:34:22 GMT
And I'm sorry. You cant go 40plus years unaware of your relationship failures. Oblivious. If you dont want to change, admit you are lazy about it. Theres honor in honesty If you’re sober, you’ll have seen people who really are that oblivious. Denial can be very powerful. Denial can be very powerful. That said its choosing to not acknowledge the thing. It doesn't negate the thing that everyone sees, including you. If, as you have said, you've nuked yet another relationship, you have to at some point realize it's you, not them. If you've gotten your 2nd DWI, you have to see your consumption of alcohol is an issue. You don't have to do anything about it. But its evident there's a problem. The thought of being an alcoholic crosses your mind, but you deny it's truth. Does not mean it fails to occur to you. So oblivion is out. If you are repulsed by spending time with someone who makes you feel warm things and it can even give you somatic complaints, there is no being oblivious to it. Particularly if you see the world around you living in contrast to you. I had no issue acknowledging I was an alcoholic. Zero denial. My hang up was how did I become one so fast? Then the question became "who cares? What are you doing about it?" For years my husband was the alcoholic/pill head. He maintained an incredible white collar career. I may have been in denial of his addiction. I didn't want to see what I saw in him. I didn't even start drinking until he left me after his stint in rehab. Just walked away. But there was no denial with regard to my own drinking problem. I knew precisely what I was doing. I was refusing to feel the pain by getting numb. Thank you Serenity. That no contact link you provided struck a chord. It is exactly what I did with Vodka, walk away from the thing that was hurting me no matter how I felt about it. I had to sever ties completely. And I did. And I felt better, not immediately, but not long after. Perseverance is key. And I am not stranger to it. I've seen far worse than the likes of this FA, lol. I'm going to be better than ok. I always am. This is going to hurt for a minute. That said I am a very bright, sweet woman. I have zero problems finding men who are interested in me. It's just that I am not usually interested in them. This one is a very different individual (duh, but not what i mean here) It is his soft, tender, thought out manner of being that attracted me to him. Hes very measured and kind and soft. The antithesis of the loud, obnoxious, scene stealer that turns me so off. Like I said, he's a good man. This is though no fault of his own. I'm just not taking hits for his failing to address his crap. Hes content, obviously, to be this way. Live alone. Despite all the "love" crap hes hung all over his home (either to convince himself or women like me that come by) and I'm going to let him be. Today is a new day. One day further away from a drink and from a toxic relationship. Tomorrow will only bring more strength and fortitude. And so it goes on. Thank you for your responding. So helpful. |
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Post by mrob on Oct 19, 2019 10:50:05 GMT
serenity. I see hurt people hurting people and the fallout. jules, I knew, from day dot I had a problem with alcohol. Now it’s the living stuff that gives me trouble.
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jules
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Post by jules on Oct 19, 2019 12:11:09 GMT
serenity. I see hurt people hurting people and the fallout. jules, I knew, from day dot I had a problem with alcohol. Now it’s the living stuff that gives me trouble. So did I! I very much saw what alcohol did watching my ex. And subtlety I began knocking back glasses of chardonnay while soaking in the tub playing scrabble on my kindle escaping the world outside my door. Turned into pancreatitis within 3 years. I was 35 when I picked up. Life termy things are challenging. But the world gets through it, predominantly. I'm not special. I'm not immune. Acceptance in all facets is how I have to approach life. Sometimes it hurts. Sometimes it is positively stunning. This relationship sadly had no balance. I need more security. The fear of the unknown is not at all stabilizing. We thrive on stability. Every good parenting book will drive that ideal home. Living in chaos, while once what I did is not how I do anymore. I have a tremendous amount of empathy for this man but as you once reminded me; sometimes love just ain't enough. I hope, for his sake and for the sake of his child he makes conscious strides to rewire what's been rewired so he can find peace and master regulation. Have positive self talk and really understand that feelings are not facts and fundamentally the world is good. I do not envy anyone who knee jerks utter fear. Healing from that is well worth while and most definitely deserved. Thank you! Great stuff! |
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Post by serenity on Oct 19, 2019 23:01:38 GMT
Congrats on giving up alcohol Jules <3. I've had some very bad moments with booze this past year too (during the sudden deactivations) and had to quit cold turkey as well. This last breakup has been so painful without a crutch But hopefully feeling the grief will make the duration shorter. Something that consoles me is my friendship with my first FA bf. I see him so differently now that we are platonic friends. That awful power he had over me as my lover is gone now, and instead of disappointment and fear, I feel mainly gratitude and security in the relationship. He contacts me most days, confides in me deeply, its just so much better now. Towards the end of our romantic relationship, I was seeing him as a monster; I expect he saw something awful and scary in me as well, such is the nature of romantic projection. But now I see mainly a lovely, lonely human being who struggles in life, and is trying really hard to stay connected to friends who care about him. I hope to get to that place with my most recent ex as well. |
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jules
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Post by jules on Oct 20, 2019 1:38:37 GMT
Thank you, sobriety feels amazing.
I hope someday he and I can be friends but I'm no where near there. I will say I cried minimally today. I kept busy. I walked town for 3 hours.
I feel better than expected probably because I have known all along this was not going to work. I wish it would, but it not in the cards.
Goodnight lovely people!
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kelly
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Post by kelly on Oct 20, 2019 1:49:38 GMT
Thank you, sobriety feels amazing. I hope someday he and I can be friends but I'm no where near there. I will say I cried minimally today. I kept busy. I walked town for 3 hours. I feel better than expected probably because I have known all along this was not going to work. I wish it would, but it not in the cards. Goodnight lovely people! Have you officially broken up with him? Had a conversation? |
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jules
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Post by jules on Oct 20, 2019 1:55:51 GMT
I did break up with him, yesterday.
Its like the 100th time but this time I am really done.
A year in and he cant commit to a day date? I am not banging my head against the wall anymore. I just can't. Hurts too much. The emotional oh so high and then splat again. I feel seasick most days.
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kelly
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Post by kelly on Oct 20, 2019 2:11:45 GMT
It’ll hurt but once you get through it, you’ll be better off. A relationship shouldn’t be that hard. Always analyzing, hoping, pulling back, not expressing what you want for fear of running him off. No. It’s not supposed to be that way. Congratulations on taking that big step toward a better relationship.
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Try not to let his distancing strategies hurt your self worth tho; he's doing this because he's formed an attachment to you and that's the only reason. It doesn't make you any less alone when you could be celebrating your anniversary though 