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Post by alexandra on Jan 30, 2020 22:58:22 GMT
On the flip side, FAs expect people to perfectly abide by their rules of "don't push me" "give me the perfect amount of space" while at the same time expecting someone to perfectly entertain them in such a way that makes them feel longing and attraction. This is a really great description of what's been difficult for me about dating FAs in the past. I'm not ignoring the AP part, but wanted to highlight that you're really onto something here. It creates such a lose-lose dynamic for everyone involved (and of course then combined with an insecure partner with their own AP/DA/FA issues, it's like lose-lose on steroids).
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Post by amber on Jan 31, 2020 0:55:23 GMT
Wow that’s an insightful analysis. I can see that in FA and AP for sure. My therapist recently challenged me on the part I played in the ending of my r/ship with my FA.... she said that I can demand that someone loves me in a childlike way: in the way my parents never did... an unrealistic expectation. I see now how the dynamic with him was set up from the start; he showered me with love and praise and gave me care and affection I’ve never received before;I suspect the child part of me was looking for a union like this. And then when he began to withdraw I unconsciously demanded that he couldn’t, that he must continue loving me in the way that I need, and because he is a people pleaser and lacked boundaries he went along with this, was not honest about his feelings of uncertainty out of fear of hurting me. At first i blamed him entirely for his inability to be honest and upfront, cursing him for being such a liar and for breaching my trust. However, the part of me that had mini tantys when he was honest in the past would have likely scared the shit out of him and made him feel responsible for my feelings (his pattern)...there’s also two peoples patterns that come into play, it’s never one sided. I can see how I contributed to this unhealthy dynamic... I put unfair expectations on him (perhaps even energetically?) and wanted him to fulfill my childhood fantasies of the perfect love... it’s almort like we entered some unconscious contract to fulfill certain unmet childhood needs, which ultimately we never could, and as a result the r/ship came crashing down, which is inevitable unless both people are willing to get real and own their shit.
So yeah, I see my AP-ness but more strongly now than I ever did... my pattern is “helping, giving, offering, rescuing” which may come across as generous and altruistic but is ultimately hidden with an agenda of “I’ll give to you but I expect something back,”it’s not pure in a sense.i need to be needed so I found someone who I could try to rescue, in order to fulfill my need of being special and needed
Wow, have I epically fallen down from the relationship fantasy cloud with a big crash and burn. It’s super super painful and at the same time freeing and liberating
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Post by amber on Jan 31, 2020 19:55:10 GMT
amber I appreciate your comments. I think a key word you keep using is child and childish. I have had some discussions with close friends recently about some of this. One in particular, we both feel like we had burdens as kids to be adults. I was always super responsible and an overachiever. I found myself in adulthood liking boyish men. I love creative types. And I just thought "well, I like the childlike creativity etc in them." But I am wondering if there was something more to it. Maybe we all were halted in our emotional development as children in order to deal with external adult matters and we never got to finish developing in that area. So we are all stuck in childhood relationally. I can easily see this in others. Yeah I think so. I’ve worked with an amazing therapist for sixteen years who’s work is based around how much we transfer our childhood patterns to our adult romantic r/ships etc... she’s helped me so much see how much projection goes on to partners, it’s quite frightening. I think unless we bring the young parts of us into consciousness they just run the show incessently.sometimes I wonder if much of my adult self is present at all in romantic r/ships?! Since my previous breakup I feel a bit like I’m having an identity crisis, like who I think I am is not really me per say, it’s just unresolved child parts projecting and expecting all over the place. Like you I had a mother who put a lot of responsibility on me as a child and I became a high achiever in life generally; and I can see how I place these expectations onto men too. Especially when it comes to “you should be doing the growth/healing work” like me! Although I do feel this is necessary to some degree, but there’s a fine line between requesting someone worknon themselves for the sake of the r/ship and putting your unmet needs onto them in some way. Fascinating what you said about being attracted to creative types, I wonder if because you had to grow up too quickly as a kid you are looking to get in touch with the parts of you that you couldn’t as easily when you weee young, through the men you are attracted to?
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Post by Helsbells on Feb 1, 2020 15:38:15 GMT
amber I appreciate your comments. I think a key word you keep using is child and childish. I have had some discussions with close friends recently about some of this. One in particular, we both feel like we had burdens as kids to be adults. I was always super responsible and an overachiever. I found myself in adulthood liking boyish men. I love creative types. And I just thought "well, I like the childlike creativity etc in them." But I am wondering if there was something more to it. Maybe we all were halted in our emotional development as children in order to deal with external adult matters and we never got to finish developing in that area. So we are all stuck in childhood relationally. I can easily see this in others. Yeah I think so. I’ve worked with an amazing therapist for sixteen years who’s work is based around how much we transfer our childhood patterns to our adult romantic r/ships etc... she’s helped me so much see how much projection goes on to partners, it’s quite frightening. I think unless we bring the young parts of us into consciousness they just run the show incessently.sometimes I wonder if much of my adult self is present at all in romantic r/ships?! Since my previous breakup I feel a bit like I’m having an identity crisis, like who I think I am is not really me per say, it’s just unresolved child parts projecting and expecting all over the place. Like you I had a mother who put a lot of responsibility on me as a child and I became a high achiever in life generally; and I can see how I place these expectations onto men too. Especially when it comes to “you should be doing the growth/healing work” like me! Although I do feel this is necessary to some degree, but there’s a fine line between requesting someone worknon themselves for the sake of the r/ship and putting your unmet needs onto them in some way. Fascinating what you said about being attracted to creative types, I wonder if because you had to grow up too quickly as a kid you are looking to get in touch with the parts of you that you couldn’t as easily when you weee young, through the men you are attracted to? Amber you say you have worked with a fantastic therapist for 16 yrs. Yet you still dont know how much of adult you shows up in your romantic relationships. 16yrs of therapy seems a long time to me. I do fear that one can get stuck from really moving on by reigniting to much old stuff by staying in therapy to long. That's just my personal opinion and you do whatever you need too. Best wishes x
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Post by amber on Feb 1, 2020 21:24:37 GMT
Yeah I think so. I’ve worked with an amazing therapist for sixteen years who’s work is based around how much we transfer our childhood patterns to our adult romantic r/ships etc... she’s helped me so much see how much projection goes on to partners, it’s quite frightening. I think unless we bring the young parts of us into consciousness they just run the show incessently.sometimes I wonder if much of my adult self is present at all in romantic r/ships?! Since my previous breakup I feel a bit like I’m having an identity crisis, like who I think I am is not really me per say, it’s just unresolved child parts projecting and expecting all over the place. Like you I had a mother who put a lot of responsibility on me as a child and I became a high achiever in life generally; and I can see how I place these expectations onto men too. Especially when it comes to “you should be doing the growth/healing work” like me! Although I do feel this is necessary to some degree, but there’s a fine line between requesting someone worknon themselves for the sake of the r/ship and putting your unmet needs onto them in some way. Fascinating what you said about being attracted to creative types, I wonder if because you had to grow up too quickly as a kid you are looking to get in touch with the parts of you that you couldn’t as easily when you weee young, through the men you are attracted to? Amber you say you have worked with a fantastic therapist for 16 yrs. Yet you still dont know how much of adult you shows up in your romantic relationships. 16yrs of therapy seems a long time to me. I do fear that one can get stuck from really moving on by reigniting to much old stuff by staying in therapy to long. That's just my personal opinion and you do whatever you need too. Best wishes x Hell’s bells, to put that into perspective for you, I started therapy when I was 19. I’m now 36. The therapy hasn’t always beeen consistent, especially when I was in my early twenties. I’ve done a lot of other things too like breath work, cranio sacral therapy, energy healing, acupuncture, NLP, dabbled recently in psychedelic therapy, neurofeedback, and many other things. My mother had severe BPD and as violent in many ways with me from a very young age. My father was ok but he had a long standing pot addiction. When I first started therapy I was in a really bad way. Extreme social anxiety, extreme generalised anxiety, suicidal until I was 28, extreme inner critic and constant negative thoughts, very poor sense of self, lots of chronic health problems like fatigue, extreme shyness, hyperactivity and a bunch of other stuff. Now, I am not suicidal, I almost never get social anxiety, I have a fairly good sense of self most of the time, I make friends more easily and am not usually shy, and my anxiety has improved massively. I no longer have chronic health problems. So I have come a long, long, way. I was also very moody in relationships when I was in my twenties and very defensive and reactive. I noticed a this was a lot less in my recent r/ship with FA where I felt like I could regulate my emotions better. When we broke up we went two months no contact (except for a few texts from him about practical stuff) which was instigated by me. In the last I NEVER would have been able to tolerate no contact,it would have been back and forth texts and calls, pleading to get Him back, etc. now when I say I wonder how much my adult self shows up; I say that because just recently I’ve realised how deep our patterns run. When I was with him I felt adult in his presence a lot of the time, not like a child, but I’m talking about the dynamics of how we engaged; ie, unconsciously wanting to save and fix him, staying with him longer than I should have out of hope etc. So I’ve come a long way in therapy. However I do agree with you to some extent that some retraumatisation has probably occurred; and after reading extensively about somatic therapy (which I’m starting next week) I am realising a different approach is now needed,one where I work more gently with the nervous system in a slower fashion.
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Post by Helsbells on Feb 1, 2020 22:33:30 GMT
Amber you say you have worked with a fantastic therapist for 16 yrs. Yet you still dont know how much of adult you shows up in your romantic relationships. 16yrs of therapy seems a long time to me. I do fear that one can get stuck from really moving on by reigniting to much old stuff by staying in therapy to long. That's just my personal opinion and you do whatever you need too. Best wishes x Hell’s bells, to put that into perspective for you, I started therapy when I was 19. I’m now 36. The therapy hasn’t always beeen consistent, especially when I was in my early twenties. I’ve done a lot of other things too like breath work, cranio sacral therapy, energy healing, acupuncture, NLP, dabbled recently in psychedelic therapy, neurofeedback, and many other things. My mother had severe BPD and as violent in many ways with me from a very young age. My father was ok but he had a long standing pot addiction. When I first started therapy I was in a really bad way. Extreme social anxiety, extreme generalised anxiety, suicidal until I was 28, extreme inner critic and constant negative thoughts, very poor sense of self, lots of chronic health problems like fatigue, extreme shyness, hyperactivity and a bunch of other stuff. Now, I am not suicidal, I almost never get social anxiety, I have a fairly good sense of self most of the time, I make friends more easily and am not usually shy, and my anxiety has improved massively. I no longer have chronic health problems. So I have come a long, long, way. I was also very moody in relationships when I was in my twenties and very defensive and reactive. I noticed a this was a lot less in my recent r/ship with FA where I felt like I could regulate my emotions better. When we broke up we went two months no contact (except for a few texts from him about practical stuff) which was instigated by me. In the last I NEVER would have been able to tolerate no contact,it would have been back and forth texts and calls, pleading to get Him back, etc. now when I say I wonder how much my adult self shows up; I say that because just recently I’ve realised how deep our patterns run. When I was with him I felt adult in his presence a lot of the time, not like a child, but I’m talking about the dynamics of how we engaged; ie, unconsciously wanting to save and fix him, staying with him longer than I should have out of hope etc. So I’ve come a long way in therapy. However I do agree with you to some extent that some retraumatisation has probably occurred; and after reading extensively about somatic therapy (which I’m starting next week) I am realising a different approach is now needed,one where I work more gently with the nervous system in a slower fashion. [b Amber I feel after all you have tried your new therapy sounds very positive. You have been through so much and somatic appears to be showing good results for others that are using it on this forum so I truly hope it helps you too. Will be great to hear how you get along with it. Blessings to you xx
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