annes
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by annes on May 19, 2020 21:13:58 GMT
It seems like nothing can break the emotional wall of a DA. As an AP person, this is a completely alien attitude to me, it has been hard to understand since the beginning. I didn't understand why a person who loves you would feel the urge to pull you away, but now, reading about it, it's becoming the more and more familiar to me. So I wanted to understand more from DA's direct experience...Would you like to share it? What, if anything, broke your emotional wall, and made you stop the deactivating behaviors?
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Post by alexandra on May 19, 2020 22:00:01 GMT
We don't have many DAs posting actively on the board at this time, so you may not be able to get an answer about direct experience. But there are older threads where DAs working to earn secure speak about their experiences and how difficult getting more secure is (just as it's incredibly difficult for any insecure style, AP and FA as well). While the differences in nervous system responses that cause emotional unavailability in all three insecure attachment types differ (and yes, AP is emotionally unavailable as well in their way), this is not about an external person or event breaking anyone's wall. Earning secure and becoming more emotionally available is an internal process, driven and motivated completely by an individual, and it's not something that happens for any other reason than the person wants to heal past trauma because it's negatively impacting their life. Often, it is about pain threshold -- being in so much pain that you are open to working towards real change, even if it involves going through more pain in confronting your core wounds and rebuilding your identity as you recondition your nervous system responses, learn healthy coping methods and communication styles, and reconnect to yourself. No one changes because someone else wants them to, just as no one wants someone else to try to change them. If/when someone is ready, likely due to a painful event, they'll take the steps they need.
But an AP truly wanting to learn and understand DA will first do better examining AP and understanding what kind of conditions cause AP to develop in childhood, and better connect to themselves. The reason this works is because avoidance is the flip side of the coin. It doesn't manifest in exactly the same way, but it's another defense mechanism that developed to survive childhood when faced with difficult (emotional) circumstances... and then, as the child became an adult, there was no natural next step to grow out of it and leave the style behind when it no longer served a solid purpose (ie adults can survive on their own). An AP starting with their own experience, seeing their own wounding, disconnection, nervous system flooding, triggering, etc. can then start to understand how other people may feel just as overwhelmed by fears but perhaps their bodies shut down instead of flood. Then the AP can depersonalize -- realize that, as much as an AP may feel a fear of abandonment that triggers them anxious, the DA may feel a fear of engulfment that triggers them into shutting down. This is why you can't, and shouldn't, regulate each other. It's codependent to try, and much healthier to self-regulate and have your own back instead of responding to someone else's deactivating behaviors by wanting to change them.
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annes
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by annes on May 20, 2020 9:21:32 GMT
Very wise response,Alexandra, thanks. You're completely right, and yet, I am absolutely devastated by the hopelessness of this whole dynamics. I feel like I need to do something to fix it - and I know, nothing I can do can really change things. And it is part of my being anxious wanting to fix things. It's horrible. Also because I do not seem to be able to find a way out of this trap. I am depressed all the time and I barely function, and nothing seems to help. It's affecting my career and everything else in my life. This stonewalling is a nightmare and I wish I never met this person in the first place. Sorry for the highly emotional response - on a rational level, I completely agree with you. I often worry: should I tell him about attachment styles? I discovered them after the breakup and I know for sure that he doesnt understand his own reactions either. It would be very illuminating I am sure. But I cant tell him about this out of the blue...Yes I kind of still want to fix him and get back with him, so I should better focus on changing this. I know, I know, it's just that it's so hard to give up
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maryt
New Member
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Post by maryt on May 21, 2020 11:01:03 GMT
Very wise response,Alexandra, thanks. You're completely right, and yet, I am absolutely devastated by the hopelessness of this whole dynamics. I feel like I need to do something to fix it - and I know, nothing I can do can really change things. And it is part of my being anxious wanting to fix things. It's horrible. Also because I do not seem to be able to find a way out of this trap. I am depressed all the time and I barely function, and nothing seems to help. It's affecting my career and everything else in my life. This stonewalling is a nightmare and I wish I never met this person in the first place. Sorry for the highly emotional response - on a rational level, I completely agree with you. I often worry: should I tell him about attachment styles? I discovered them after the breakup and I know for sure that he doesnt understand his own reactions either. It would be very illuminating I am sure. But I cant tell him about this out of the blue...Yes I kind of still want to fix him and get back with him, so I should better focus on changing this. I know, I know, it's just that it's so hard to give up I highly recommend checking out Tracy Crossley’s www.tracycrossley.com/podcast-2/ podcasts. They have helped me understand all of this and myself immensely. What I love is that she focuses on learning about and healing your own attachment issues instead of being focused on your partner. Best part is that, same as you, she knows how difficult it is when you feel “stuck” in a relationship like this. So she comes from personal experience. Hope it helps.
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Post by annieb on May 21, 2020 12:56:24 GMT
I’m an FA, and have been in relationships with DAs, and have sometimes turned DAish. The wall isn’t your’s to break. It’s the DAs only protection and you tearing it down without a replacement coping mechanism (that they don’t have and you can’t give it to them) will not bode well for them. DAs are best left to their own devices dealing with whatever pain they are dealing and hopefully one day they will seek help (professional) and will be able to abandon the outdated coping mechanism and also earn secure. For the most part DAs have anxiety just like APs, but it’s not on the surface; I find it’s more subdued because of their reliance on themselves. They are still anxious and often in pain. If you put your anxiety on them, they are in even more pain. It is kinder to leave a DA that to try and “help” them.
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Post by tnr9 on May 21, 2020 15:03:32 GMT
I’m an FA, and have been in relationships with DAs, and have sometimes turned DAish. The wall isn’t your’s to break. It’s the DAs only protection and you tearing it down without a replacement coping mechanism (that they don’t have and you can’t give it to them) will not bode well for them. DAs are best left to their own devices dealing with whatever pain they are dealing and hopefully one day they will seek help (professional) and will be able to abandon the outdated coping mechanism and also earn secure. For the most part DAs have anxiety just like APs, but it’s not on the surface; I find it’s more subdued because of their reliance on themselves. They are still anxious and often in pain. If you put your anxiety on them, they are in even more pain. It is kinder to leave a DA that to try and “help” them. I have to agree, walls for me are protection from feeling overwhelmed. It may come across as a reaction to someone else, but in reality, it is my way of dealing with a scenario that I do not have healthy boundaries with. I think that is the best way to view it...as non personal and about him. I also agree that trying to breakdown his walls is not going to go well...it truly is his to address. What you can work on is addressing your own reaction to his walls. You can determine if this relationship is working for you or not.
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annes
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by annes on May 21, 2020 23:06:08 GMT
maryt: thanks, I'll listen to the podcast. It's definitely time to think about self-preservation. As you may guess, I am not really good at it, being overly focused on him. I think that I don't know how to 'love' myself. I keep feeling like shit and care about him, and can't even be angry. This is devastating and really has to stop... annieb and tnr9: yes, and he's very sensitive and anxious. He shuts himself down when he's confused and overwhelmed. It helps to remember this, and see the wall as a reaction to the discomfort of anxiety. It's not personal, you're right, and yet...It hurts so much. Never felt so much pain in my life. If only he hadn't these issues...We could have been truly happy, that's what my mind keeps telling. The relationship is already over, so there is not much to determine on my side about this. We live far away, and he decided it has to end. It's been months now, and I guess the wall will never fall, and I should just stop to care about it. I know all my 'shoulds' very well...The problem is putting them into practice.
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Post by tnr9 on May 22, 2020 2:25:47 GMT
maryt : thanks, I'll listen to the podcast. It's definitely time to think about self-preservation. As you may guess, I am not really good at it, being overly focused on him. I think that I don't know how to 'love' myself. I keep feeling like shit and care about him, and can't even be angry. This is devastating and really has to stop... annieb and tnr9: yes, and he's very sensitive and anxious. He shuts himself down when he's confused and overwhelmed. It helps to remember this, and see the wall as a reaction to the discomfort of anxiety. It's not personal, you're right, and yet...It hurts so much. Never felt so much pain in my life. If only he hadn't these issues...We could have been truly happy, that's what my mind keeps telling. The relationship is already over, so there is not much to determine on my side about this. We live far away, and he decided it has to end. It's been months now, and I guess the wall will never fall, and I should just stop to care about it. I know all my 'shoulds' very well...The problem is putting them into practice. Hey Annes....there is likely another scenario that could have happened had he not had walls....you may have lost interest in him. Oftentimes., it is the intermittent...the push/pull...the come closer/move away that keeps each person hooked on the other one. It might be worth exploring what it is that drew you to him and kept you going. Also...change the word should to could....should feels like an obligation, could is a choice and right now....you have the right to grieve.
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AM
New Member
Posts: 41
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Post by AM on May 22, 2020 22:45:54 GMT
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