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Post by charlii on Oct 19, 2023 16:48:45 GMT
Hello I just have a general question for FA (maybe DA) but I am curious.
So, I was in a relationship for a couple years with my ex BF, a little nuerodivergent and other MH struggles.
Long story short...Loved each other alot--We were together for 2 yeras, broke up the usual avoidant ways, but did manage to be friends or start to about a year after that (no contact).
No relationship intentions on my end. He said he wishes he could be but can't overall. (he has not dated anyone else). Last year he said he does not think he will ever get over it and wishes he was different.
Sure I wish things worked, but they didn't for these reaons.
But for 2 years in that we talk and see each other daily. (except being if he deactivates..the longest has beena week but he told me it was not me at all).
A year after we broke up and he explained more things to me about his childhood....He told me he has fear of abanonment (one reason we broke up bc he created a huge story/worry I was dumping him and never was).
Anyway--One thing I notice to this day
Whenever I 'go away' or travel, I notice he starts deactivating! If i am away for 1-2 night maybe it is fine. But once I go for 2 or 3+....I notice the start ofthe shutdown. Less communication, distance, all that when we texted.
Im not saying in some cases it is not a coincidence of other life stresses, but it happens the past 4-5 times I have traveled.
Most recently, and cojuld feel the distance.
I 'knew' he would seem stressed when I came home.
Sure enough-yes kind of bigger deactivation bc I was gone a week.
Got the oddest and confusing logic of why he can't come over anymore lol. Then when I agreed and understood the first reason (he's not sleeping well), a more non-rational reason. (he can't come over bc he will wind up staying for 5 hours lol).
I kind of got annoyed and said it was ridiculous (bc he can leave whenever he wants or doesb't even have to come over as often)
Usually I will talk him out of it, or rationalize why it is not making sense...but I was jsut drained from some other personal stuff going on and could not do it.
. He came over asked me to come outside and wouldn't come in to tell me all of that and left 5 minutes later. I said you could have texted that.
So we didn't speak again that night,but rain into each other and he asked to join me for dinner. Ofc we have been texting this whole time after (guess he got the needed releif)
But I was wondering why this still happens if we are not a couple and have not been for 2 years?? I know i know...But we were friends before so im patient w him.
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 19, 2023 17:51:06 GMT
Honestly…..the best thing would be to ask him….in a curious, non judge mental way. It could have nothing to do with his attachment….or it could…but he is the best one to provide that answer.
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Post by charlii on Oct 19, 2023 18:30:21 GMT
Sure that makes sense. But I was curious if this was something common in regard avoidant that I was not aware of about this attachment style. For example I have read deactivatoin can happen after family events, fanatastic vacations, etc. or anytihng. But I started to wonder in friendships if this happens too or the simple act of leaving is a common trigger.
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 19, 2023 18:54:25 GMT
Sure that makes sense. But I was curious if this was something common in regard avoidant that I was not aware of about this attachment style. For example I have read deactivatoin can happen after family events, fanatastic vacations, etc. or anytihng. But I started to wonder in friendships if this happens too or the simple act of leaving is a common trigger. I don’t deactivate when someone leaves….but I don’t know his trauma history nor his neorodivergence. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 19, 2023 20:10:42 GMT
Sure that makes sense. But I was curious if this was something common in regard avoidant that I was not aware of about this attachment style. For example I have read deactivatoin can happen after family events, fanatastic vacations, etc. or anytihng. But I started to wonder in friendships if this happens too or the simple act of leaving is a common trigger. I come from the avoidant end of the spectrum and yes, definitely, for me deactivation can occur in any circumstance whatsoever. I've grown more secure with the intentional addressing of my childhood and subsequent trauma. I also check all the boxes for the HSP trait (sensory and intellectual and emotional sensitivity). Key relationships of any kind, doesn't have to be romantic, can trigger the survival self protective response. Being a constant in his routine (routine is stabilizing for both avoidants and neurodivergents), could cause a feeling of destabilization with absence or change. Emotional investment is made in platonic relationships. And if that investment feels insecure, an avoidant will likely deactivate to minimize the importance of the connection and essentially train themselves back to non-reliance. I do this distinctly, I am aware of it, a large part of being secure is not just eliminating the impulse, but recognizing it and making conscious choiceswhen it arises. So I have experienced both the elimination of the impulse to separate emotionally and create distance, and also the continuing impulse in some situations with the ability to make conscious choices around it. Physical separation from my partner naturally sparks deactivation in me, and mostly I shrug it off and make intentional efforts to remain engaged and it passes. Unless I'm stressed as fuck about something else and my deactivation impulse is given a double dose of fuel and I get through it anyway, less gracefully. I don't really believe that this hard wiring can be totally repaired. It's deep survival stuff. But the short answer? Yeah, an avoidant in the situation could very likely deactivate, even though it's a platonic situation, simply because you are a close person. Often friends are more stable and safe to an avoidant than an intimate connection, it's just the way it is. |
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Post by charlii on Oct 19, 2023 20:35:53 GMT
Appreciate that information.
I sort of felt bad for just 'ridiculous' but I had no energy as I had a 'friend' do some really rotten things to me recently and mentally I dealing with that. Funny I purpose did not tell him everything about the friend issue bc I didn't want him to get feeling bad about himself bc the friend intentionally did some things out of the blue (ghosted/childish immature talk about me). I thought he may relive his own deficiencies or would relate that upset to himself (maybe he did) but difference is his is not intent. I can tell thatl....that is the line. But I never expect to come home to this particular scenario/story.
In this case, like the others, I don't know if somehtig else is happening- I was sort of hoping it was and not me. I can always tell though- the texting, increased gym (will not miss it and specific w times, etc, bailing on plans or group plans, etc)...So I saw all that.
I actually have written a note letting him know what I notice about going away and what happens, and if he notices it or not, and what it seems like to me when it happens.
I am not mad or anything, more to alert him of a pattern that story creating can do and the coincidence/timing I see.
Part of me did wonder if he felt 'why do I miss her". I shoud add it was a very lonely weekend where he was, lots of time to 'overthink'
He does not have alot of close friends at all- ALL surface level. I am probaby the one that 'knows him' the best. He's very much a loner.
Im conflicted to say anyting or just tell him when he seems better. He;s not totally frantic rightn now but trying to think whether to just back off. I wish I just dealt w it that night. My talks are usually pretty effective lol
He's got a ton of stuff going on and overly busy. It jsut made me softly chucke that he was blaming me for not sleeping well and I was away lol. I had nothing to do w that.
And he does know he has a 'problem' which is the whole bases for us not together.
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Post by alexandra on Oct 19, 2023 22:24:04 GMT
My opinion, though I've never been avoidant:
You are still an attachment figure to him, and he still cares, he just can't get TOO close (ie romantically) because he needs a comfortable distance. That would be true for him for anyone. If he's told you you can be friends but he will never fully get over your past together, then that means a few things. He doesn't know how or is unwilling to fully process your breakup, so he's a bit emotionally stuck, which is why he can't fully get over the old relationship. It also likely means friends is the distance / closeness ratio he can tolerate with you, but in a way he can also keep you as the phantom ex he can idealize romantically without acting on it. So he can feel that comfort of you being in his life and that close attachment figure without activating the engulfment side of things, plus he can use those feelings about your prior romantic relationship to avoid getting involved with anyone new. He still gets activated when you're too far and he feels anxious over past abandonment trauma (not about you, but projected onto you), so he backs off to ease his fears and re-regulate. Deactivation usually isn't fully conscious, but it just happens when unaddressed trauma from his past before you is involved.
That's what I'd think is going on that is related to his attachment issues. When insecures stay friends with exes, but there's unprocessed feelings or issues as well even if no one wants to get back together, people can get triggered more easily and often than in only platonic relationships that never had any romantic history behind them. So you can't just say, it's been 2 years, wasn't that enough time. If someone doesn't want to move forward or change or process or adjust, then time passing doesn't really mean anything. But it is him and projection, not you, so don't take it personally.
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Post by charlii on Oct 19, 2023 22:49:33 GMT
Yes thank you
AFter we broke up he told me about all kids of childhood/grwoing up trauma, that he never told me about before. He has also told me he does not want to be in a relationship with anyone else (ever?? who knows but he has not been in 2 years)...and says if not for this problem, he wants to be with me and is trying to get rid of it
. He just feels low self esteem, and his problems (this one of them) he doesn't know how to fix,
Im not taking it personally, I don't anymore actually. I wish it iwas different but it's not. If I knew things were fixed..i would get back.
Except I know there is no therapy happening to help etc. So I'm ok being friends. I have accepted it all for what it was and is.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2023 1:38:30 GMT
To add... inconsistency is very triggering to dismissive avoidants. So absence can feel like that. The abandonment fears aren't conscious, they are below the surface. But again it's the change of a routine.
As it's been said, a DA wants you in the same house but not in the same room. Leave the house, and then it's destabilizing. We like to feel your presence but are accustomed to neglect. Leaving town crosses the line to abandonment but instead of chasing you down and trying to reconnect we will dismiss the connection and it's importance so we can return to the homeostasis of being alone, what we are essentially wired for.
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Post by charlii on Oct 20, 2023 3:43:41 GMT
Thanks for all of the input:).
So probably doesn't make sense to send the "I noticed this.."?? Would that be harmful at all?
I am not meaning to look down or anything, it is just an observation (he knows I noitice everything in othert apsects) . I thought it might or might not be useful when he's in a good place
I think if I would want the observation if it iwas reversed, and I would.
Im not sure if he is dismissive--he could be. I dont see him anxious generally-- except when he does one of these 'sudden' things that don't make sense.More a little hectic/frantic.
The worst thing is i raelly need an ear/shoulder regarding my 'friend' situation and it is taking me everying not to call bc he knows the players, etc and he is the best to talk to, and I would get obejctive advice and honest. But I don't even want to bring it up and add more junk at this time exp bc the topic is questioning to not really consider this person a friend.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 20, 2023 6:04:25 GMT
Thanks for all of the input:). So probably doesn't make sense to send the "I noticed this.."?? Would that be harmful at all? I am not meaning to look down or anything, it is just an observation (he knows I noitice everything in othert apsects) . I thought it might or might not be useful when he's in a good place I think if I would want the observation if it iwas reversed, and I would. Im not sure if he is dismissive--he could be. I dont see him anxious generally-- except when he does one of these 'sudden' things that don't make sense.More a little hectic/frantic. The worst thing is i raelly need an ear/shoulder regarding my 'friend' situation and it is taking me everying not to call bc he knows the players, etc and he is the best to talk to, and I would get obejctive advice and honest. But I don't even want to bring it up and add more junk at this time exp bc the topic is questioning to not really consider this person a friend. Well now it's getting confusing, has your question changed then? I'm sorry, I don't get why not just call him, originally you were asking if deactivation in the situation was an avoidant thing but you guys were in contact? It's seeming to go down a rabbit hole here. |
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Post by charlii on Oct 20, 2023 6:26:37 GMT
Oh yes. sorry in the beginning I menionted asking if this kind of situation is a common trigger. I was unsure since platonic.
So since I didn't get to really resppond how I wanted when he seeminlgly deactivated (I had some friendhsp issues regarding other friend that is a mutual). I was mentally exhausted from that, therefore I never tallked to him the way I nornmally would while he was 'deactivating'.
So I wrote a letter describing my observations about traveling ..and I was joking here that maybe I should not send it.Will just make it all worse, and so would my discussing the friend issue.
Confusing..but not lol.
yes we are in contact..All the time. But thank u!
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Post by anne12 on Oct 20, 2023 7:29:42 GMT
You write that he is neurodivergent - so has he got adhd , add or Aspergers or ?
You are neurotypical yourself ?
I have noticed the difference between a guy I know with Asperger and a guy I know with adhd
Some traits overlap and some traits are VERY different
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Post by charlii on Oct 20, 2023 12:53:34 GMT
He does not have adhd (that I know of). He does have HFA, which I never even knew until he told me 3 years after knowing him. I am not sure the true difference between Aspergers and HFA. He was embarrassed by it  . Throw in ruminating thoughts at times for good measure which the HFA prob makes him. ultra focus on ;/. But yes these things all overlap Are you asking in relation to FA/DA or just curious since as your friend has it.  And yes, I am NT. |
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