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Post by tnr9 on Jul 12, 2024 23:47:39 GMT
I've posted on here a few times and have found the comments very insightful. I'd appreciate any feedback or suggestions of how I could handle my situation better. I'll keep this brief because the minute details aren't that important and we all get the gist of this: I (34M, Disorganized - Working very hard towards secure) started dating a woman (31F, FA) who lives across the hall from me in my building for about a year. As you can guess it turned into a very long game of push and pull, hot and cold, back and forth, on and off again over and over and over. She is Fearful Avoidant to an extreme, but she is a great communicator and has alot of other great qualities. We've both been extremely communicative with one another about every aspect of this so there's really nothing I haven't expressed myself to her about and vice versa. She had a bad divorce a year ago and then also ran into some medical problems which increased her FA tendencies (not blaming her, it just is what it is!). Eventually I reached a breaking point, I was tired of her fear of commitment and her unpredictability, and she was overwhelmed by expectations and not ready to be in a relationship. I initiated a really compassionate breakup on pretty generous terms. We both agreed that we have strong feelings for each other and that this isn't healthy to continue, but that we'd both like to leave the door open for reconciliation when she's doing better and can function healthily. I told her I'd date other people, but we could stay on good terms and that I'd be open to hearing from her. In the aftermath of the breakup, she became extremely devastated and resentful towards me, and that upset me - she had asked for space from expectations, and now that I finally gave it to her, she was resentful around my home. I felt that that was pretty unfair, she got what she wanted and was still unhappy (The avoidant fear-of-abandonment was triggered by me initiating the breakup I guess?). She had a difficult time rationalizing these feelings and resorted to making up imaginary things to resent me (she accused me of stealing her mail at one point until she realized how silly that was). I called this out and we eventually were able to get things back to a place of being on good terms but giving each other space. I think the whole situation was pretty messed up, but it's not the worst breakup I've ever had. We both want to leave the door open for something possible in the future. I get that her behavior is not okay sometimes but I've also been through rough patches in life and I want to give her the opportunity to figure it out. So TLDR: she's emotionally unavailable, mentally unwell, and fearful avoidant. I hope she gets better someday but I refuse to stick around to try to fix it. Here's where I'm at an impasse and would like advice on how to handle: Now, I try to take space and stay away from her, and she can sense me doing self-work and moving on, which has caused her to sort of indirectly and sweetly reel me back in over and over, about every 1-2 weeks. It starts out as cute little texts, or it can be something deeper and more thoughtful, then she kind of reels me in closer but still pushes back if I get TOO close. I think her anxious side takes over and she wants to make sure I'm still available to her, but just at a distance (classic FA). I don't want to play this game anymore so I'm doing my best to just avoid her compassionately without being a jerk about it. But that's difficult, often she will run into me in our building (unavoidable) and she will be friendly or sweet, or sometimes cold (intermittent reinforcement) and that just pulls me RIGHT BACK INTO THE GAME. Now we're just playing a different version of the same game. She's about to leave the country for a month and I've asked her not to contact me during that time (she was cool about it and understanding). I plan to use that time to focus on total detachment and self-care. I'm worried that she's going to keep pursuing my attention in indirect ways when she returns, especially if she senses I'm more distant and moving on. I really don't want to get pulled back into this unless she's fully healed which will take alot of time. Can anyone offer advice on how I should handle things when she gets back? I don't want to be bitter or a jerk, but I am also easily susceptible to her flirting and charm. I worry that a full "stay away from me" style rejection will shut the door forever, but I do really want her away from me for at least a couple months. Thanks for reading and thanks for your insight. Honestly, I would suggest you do shut the door because you are not compatible with each other. I would not ghost her, but I also would be clear that the break up was final and you are now moving on with therapy. You can certainly wish her well on her journey. Also, I would suggest exploring the “mind reading” you are doing…because any focus you give on interpreting her actions is keeping you out of your own body…and that is not a secure move. A secure move is to talk simply about how her actions make you feel without interpreting them. If this is challenging for you to do…there may be some residual enmeshment going on. |
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Post by alexandra on Jul 13, 2024 5:16:47 GMT
I had an FA ex who dumped me but wanted to stay best friends. I was really upset about the entire thing and said I needed some space, and he wouldn't give it to me. Instead he kept steamrolling my boundaries. I eventually told him I was going no contact because I was a mess and the nicest thing he could do for me was not reach out. I didn't put any time limit on it. Presenting it as he was doing what was best for me and it was a very caring gesture for him, as well as me not just ghosting him, kept his abandonment anxiety to a minimum. I blocked him, and he did eventually go back to trying to indirectly contact me a few months later, but I luckily didn't know about it at the time. Having that space was the best thing, and honestly, it didn't even tank our reconciliation chances. We reconnected many months later once I was ready to test the friendship waters. We were still both single (what, two insecure attachers still single?? Imagine that!), and we actually took our time moving towards trying to reconcile. However, what tanked the reconciliation was I did a ton of healing and growth work during our time out of touch and he did not. So while it didn't happen right away, all his FA stuff that came up the first go-around happened again. This is all to say, I agree with tnr9. Concentrate on yourself, and close the door. While it probably should be permanent, if you're really not ready to do that for good right this minute, it's okay, it doesn't need to be a binary yes/no decision that needs to be made immediately. Because if you get to where you want to be and are still interested in reconnecting then, you'll be able to tell if things with her are any different and have any chance of working out, or if you're still incompatible and you've outgrown the dynamic. I wouldn't worry about her indirect outreach. Just block it out as much as possible, and keep any run ins in your building extremely short. Don't try to control the future with her (like wondering if pulling back now ruins future chances, it's just moot right now), don't use your time and brain power thinking through scenarios like what if she keeps indirectly reaching out. You have permission to focus on you so you can keep earning security instead of getting distracted by her triggering you with her own issues. |
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Post by chrislsderby on Jul 25, 2024 20:20:11 GMT
I had to take a crash course in attachment theory earlier this year. I met a woman on-line March last year and tbh stupidly ignored red flags.
At first she was a great talker, loved texting and long phone chats about nothing.
We were intimate quite quickly, but strangely it felt like there was no connection. I put it down to the fact that it can take a while to get used to each other.
She text me out the blue to tell me she couldn't get an ex out of her head. Block. A few days later, unblock and crying down the phone.
We started dating again and seemed to be moving forward. Then she manufactured a break up in June and slept with her ex. She told me and begged and cried for me to take her back. I did because I thought she was genuinely sorry. About 2 weeks later she did it again.
She made herself to be the victim of emotionally abusive relationships and family. Begged to try again and I did. Things moved forward quickly.
We started talking houses, moving in together and mortgages. In August I made an appointment with a mortgage broker because she wanted to " get things moving". Hours later I got a text breaking up.
We stayed in contact until the end of Sept. Then she blocked me telling friends it was her way of "getting rid of me". She reached out 55 days later, out the blue, just as I had come to terms with everything.
We went out and I found out she was seeing a new guy. But she dumped him by text while I was there!! No emotion at all.
We saw each other again over Christmas and just before NYE she backed off again. Contact until mid Jan and then wham!! Blocked on everything again.
I learned about attachment and she nearly ticks all the boxes of an FA. I also met another ex through a mutual friend and our stories were very similar.
In March this year she reached out again. After 55 or so days again. Wanting to know what she needed to do to break the cycle. I listened, but didn't lecture and gave her pointers about where she could find information.
Things developed and in April we were back together. She got a new job, and I helped her with the application, writing notice letters and such. I genuinely thought she had changed. Wrong was I!!
She started talking houses, marriage and even wanted to look at engagement rings. Days before my birthday she ended it again. But at least she called this time.
There has been some mind games on her part. She told a friend that she'd reconnected with an ex and slept with them on their date. A week later she admitted she lied about it but did it knowing that I would get to hear about it.
Months too late I've blocked her on everything as well and I hate blocking people and rarely, if ever,do it.
Last I saw she was back on Bumble claiming to want a LTR with a "man with a positive mindset".
To summarise it all an FA will use you for validation,an ego boost and will pick you up and put you down if you let them. The back and forth will never change.
They are toxic people who will break you and walk away with a smile on their lips while texting their next supply. Don't make my mistakes. The first sign of trouble get out of Dodge, don't look back. Find a partner that is capable of giving and receiving love, knows the value of themselves and others.
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Post by alexandra on Jul 26, 2024 3:00:51 GMT
This sounds very extreme for FA. Has your ex ever been diagnosed with BPD?
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Post by drfunkyshorts on Jul 26, 2024 14:57:53 GMT
She doesn't have a BPD diagnosis formally but I've wondered if that is a possibility.
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Post by alexandra on Jul 26, 2024 16:48:18 GMT
I intended that for chrisisderby, but BPD can definitely be mistaken for extreme FA, or be comorbid with it. It doesn't really change anything, though, besides giving more awareness that the relationship can't work out unless the person is seeking treatment to manage their mental health issues.
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Post by mrob on Jul 27, 2024 6:40:22 GMT
This sounds very extreme for FA. Has your ex ever been diagnosed with BPD? That’s my feeling. I’ve been there and done that. When it was good it was amazing, when it was bad it was pure heartbreak. I was able to see a pattern and eventually know when the disconnect was coming. We went around the merry go round 5 times in a textbook manner before I put a stop to it. I blocked her everywhere for my own peace of mind. I just had to. She’s one of very few people I’ve ever blocked. |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jul 29, 2024 6:14:57 GMT
To summarise it all an FA will use you for validation,an ego boost and will pick you up and put you down if you let them. The back and forth will never change. They are toxic people who will break you and walk away with a smile on their lips while texting their next supply. Don't make my mistakes. The first sign of trouble get out of Dodge, don't look back. Find a partner that is capable of giving and receiving love, knows the value of themselves and others. I have just come back to the boards for a read. I'll chime in on this one and my experiences with a couple FA attached girls. The above is not correct at all! FA's do not "use you for validation", this sounds far more extreme, and along the lines of narcissism/BPD which definitely is on the spectrum of CPTSD (complex post traumatic stress disorder). It appears FA's can be comorbid with covert narcissism and BPD. (A DA more aligned with grandiose narcissism.) It truly is "fear" triggered by internally projected anxiety on some level, over some issue that an FA wants to select "in that moment"! Whatever has happened in a FA's life which can be a variable number of things! (inconsistent parents/moving all the time in childhood/abusive parents/narcissistic parent/s/BPD parent/FA parent) It usually is the case that the "false persona" just can't keep up anymore the fascade and they are emotionally exhausted, they have limited emotional resources to give! An emotional bar, like in a game, theyre at 10-20 out of a 100! It could be literally one thing said to placate fears deep down! FA's are however, imao, as Briana McWilliam puts it, are "Spice of Lifers", they are very good to talk to, are VERY emotional deep down (and if you can be trusted and they open up, the most amazing experience tbh), very loving actually, are creative generally in some way whether via art/music etc(look at many musicians and the deep emotional songs they can write - their outlet as opposed to openly expressing directly! Typically avoidant), deeply opinionated on a specific topic, boundaries a little askew, have deep "emotional" eyes (dunno if anyone has ever noticed this, potentially the "pain" withheld). Excellent partners if you want to talk about "deep" things! (while not overwhelmed) An FA does not seek to be abusive or are "toxic", in my experience, they certainly can hurt you emotionally due to the lack of communication and withholding of key information pertinent to the relationship, no matter how secure you are, and no matter the "safe" environment you create. The little voices in the head, that just want to run, no matter how good a relationship is, and create distance will surface, and they will destroy a perfectly good functioning relationship! I've dated two FA's on the spectrum, one CPTSD and one I would say with just functionality issues from childhood, less extreme than CPTSD, they were markedly different experiences! The last one was a wonderful relationship which I cherish, she was very loving, very kind, always praised me for my efforts and literally told me I was the first person she had truly trusted, felt "safe" around and that I was her "soulmate", she still fled! I am secure attachment, very secure 80-90%+ secure on any test (PDS, Dianne Poole Heller etc). One thing is for sure, i've always had the FA wanting to come back at some stage! I literally have this girl from 4-5 years ago wanting to date again now! Which I have turned down, she has not worked on herself and two I do not have feelings anymore! Had to comment as FA attached people get a bad wrap, but they are good people that I have met deep down! Just who are in a battle with themselves over self worth, fear, and skewed boundaries! |
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