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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 5:35:49 GMT
it's interesting that DA thinks with their heads and APs feels with their hearts. I was browsing the internet for self-love resources and saw this statement somewhere (paraphrased), about how true self-love is balancing the head AND the heart. Having too much head (so wrong i know) = only logical, but love is not a logic. Having too much heart = instability without rationality, but love is not just a feeling.
perhaps this is how a secure looks like - the ability to balance the head and the heart, and what the DAs and APs have to learn from each other, by truly listening to each other's perspective, and trying it for themselves.
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 27, 2018 5:38:06 GMT
kristyrose yes i felt close to my partner if they trusted me enough to let me be me without twisting my way of being into a personal attack on them. in other words, what killed my want to be close was being a villain in their eyes when i was caring, giving, listening, etc, and being what i thought was a decent partner. i think i posted before about how once when i was sitting outside enjoying the smells, sounds, sights of nature on a beautiful summer evening, my AP partner came and sat down next to me. i smiled and went back to enjoying the moment i was having, thinking he could enjoy it too. i looked over and he was absolutely seething and he attacked me for ignoring him. he was disgusted by me and my "rudeness". that was a day i remember feeling hate for him. he ruined every good moment by accusing me of doing it wrong somehow. i mean, that was such a great moment until he came and was so selfish and nasty. he was over the top, i don't know if all AP's behave that way. but yes, you said it well. just love me how i am, i am a feral creature a little bit but a very good creature!  Ah, I understand what you're saying about not being seen as a villain and feeling trusted. I definitely think my ex felt like a villain when I pointed certain things out, but he is a whole other kind of something we think... so lets take him out of the equation here. You also seem to be so much kinder and loving to ur partner, so for me, sitting quietly outside is entirely enjoyable! I can say, some of the AP stuff I definitely did not do- I did not text a lot throughout the day, or call or ask why I wasn't getting a response- if my ex and I were together and he wanted to be in another room, I happily gave him space, did not take it personal, i was just happy to have him around since we only saw each other 3 times a week tops. Sometimes a lot more, dependent on his mood/feelings. At any rate, guest, i can understand your feeling like T was too harsh or maybe even triggering, for me I felt the sting only when I thought of my ex and how I may have pushed him away, but after getting to know Tgat these past few weeks/months or so- I understand where she is coming from and have seen both her biting truth type posts and her extremely warm, supportive, loving, tough-love, wise posts as well. I have gotten to know the whole Tgat, not just the Avoidant, but the person who is quite dynamic and amazing. Bip, you and I as AP's definitely bring a special kind of something that comes easier for us than our Avoidant friends, while they bring a special kind of something we also long to have. By being all over the forum, we learn so much from each other in these rich conversations. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 5:40:53 GMT
at any rate, it can be useful , perhaps, if you want the DA perspective.
to sum up, i was asked. AP's frequently acknowledge their triggered behavior is over the top and all i did was confirm that.
madame mentioned what she thinks might go on when an avoidant feels "overwhelmed, threatened, stifled... or similar.
so there is an acknowledgement that the triggered behavior is difficult to bear for the avoidant.
all i did was share that from the avoidant side.
i should have spared and left it there but i didn't and it's not any good for me or you guys to get sidetracked by conflict.
so i hope something good does come out of it, i have done a lot of listening about avoidant behavior and i accept that it's difficult.
good night all, and i will go >>>>>>> over there somewhere now lol! 😘
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 27, 2018 5:46:49 GMT
@tgat - no you won't! sit your a$$ back down! lol! ;-)
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 5:52:08 GMT
kristyrose yes i felt close to my partner if they trusted me enough to let me be me without twisting my way of being into a personal attack on them. in other words, what killed my want to be close was being a villain in their eyes when i was caring, giving, listening, etc, and being what i thought was a decent partner. i think i posted before about how once when i was sitting outside enjoying the smells, sounds, sights of nature on a beautiful summer evening, my AP partner came and sat down next to me. i smiled and went back to enjoying the moment i was having, thinking he could enjoy it too. i looked over and he was absolutely seething and he attacked me for ignoring him. he was disgusted by me and my "rudeness". that was a day i remember feeling hate for him. he ruined every good moment by accusing me of doing it wrong somehow. i mean, that was such a great moment until he came and was so selfish and nasty. he was over the top, i don't know if all AP's behave that way. but yes, you said it well. just love me how i am, i am a feral creature a little bit but a very good creature! Ah, I understand what you're saying about not being seen as a villain and feeling trusted. I definitely think my ex felt like a villain when I pointed certain things out, but he is a whole other kind of something we think... so lets take him out of the equation here. You also seem to be so much kinder and loving to ur partner, so for me, sitting quietly outside is entirely enjoyable! I can say, some of the AP stuff I definitely did not do- I did not text a lot throughout the day, or call or ask why I wasn't getting a response- if my ex and I were together and he wanted to be in another room, I happily gave him space, did not take it personal, i was just happy to have him around since we only saw each other 3 times a week tops. Sometimes a lot more, dependent on his mood/feelings. At any rate, guest , i can understand your feeling like T was too harsh or maybe even triggering, for me I felt the sting only when I thought of my ex and how I may have pushed him away, but after getting to know Tgat these past few weeks/months or so- I understand where she is coming from and have seen both her biting truth type posts and her extremely warm, supportive, loving, tough-love, wise posts as well. I have gotten to know the whole Tgat, not just the Avoidant, but the person who is quite dynamic and amazing. Bip, you and I as AP's definitely bring a special kind of something that comes easier for us than our Avoidant friends, while they bring a special kind of something we also long to have. By being all over the forum, we learn so much from each other in these rich conversations. it does sting to hear how we affect others but that is why we need to heal. i have to show up as i am here, and everyone else should also. i tried to differentiate and say "don't take this personally" about your ex kristy because he makes my blood cold. i tried to explain this is about triggered stuff and what i experienced. and i know it's not graceful but i don't consider it a kindness to hide this from you. i don't. AP triggered behavior is as damaging as avoidant triggered behavior and i shared what you don't have access to otherwise. you can never know how it feels if someone doesn't tell you. i know it's important for people to understand how an anxious person feels and its also important for a DA to be understood. i would not have shared if not asked because i knew the propriety and etiquette of the forum. but, it is what it is. i gave the feedback. thank you @kristy for taking it in context of the rapport we have and the help i have tried to offer sincerely. i appreciate that. every time i hit "create post" i am clear on being willing to face the backlash and i will always face it. i always have. i gotta go sleep now. g'nite all. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 5:52:50 GMT
I just want to say I admire the willingness of the APs to put themselves out there, emotions and all. I see the raw vulnerability as a strength and it is this strength that has allowed me to see and learn through the lens of another. Receiving the love of an unwavering AP is very humbling and does make me see where I can do better.
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Post by guest on Feb 27, 2018 5:54:56 GMT
of course we were triggered kristyrose, just as AP's can say some pretty villainous things about a DA, a DA's PERSPECTIVE of our behavior can come off as being harsh... and know that I appreciate @tgat's insight as well and do enjoy our interactions, and will gladly say that along with other informed and aware participants in this forum, she has played a big part in my own healing. However I also want to point out the that when Tgat replied to my comment with the post quoted below NO ONE asked for her perspective at that point, yet she felt inclined to reply anyway, I do read the DA support section, like their posts there but let them have their space, I am sure any of us who have read that section would have noticed what tgat's reaction would be if an AP piped up to DA's agreeing on their own perspective. By putting in her 2 cents to me agreeing with madamebovary I believe tgat felt entitled to cross a boundry that she would have set for herself if roles were reversed. There in lies the double standard. "wow, this may have nailed the AP side but it is Waayyyyy off base from the DA side lol! at least from my experience. it's just a dynamic that doesn't mesh. that misperception about what goes on in a DA or what motivates behavior is a huge reason why the AP/DA dynamic can be so toxic. mary quoted Jeb's site about this, at least one aspect of it, in another thread." I'd be happy to spare you the analysis tho. 😘 |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 27, 2018 5:57:36 GMT
Ah, I understand what you're saying about not being seen as a villain and feeling trusted. I definitely think my ex felt like a villain when I pointed certain things out, but he is a whole other kind of something we think... so lets take him out of the equation here. You also seem to be so much kinder and loving to ur partner, so for me, sitting quietly outside is entirely enjoyable! I can say, some of the AP stuff I definitely did not do- I did not text a lot throughout the day, or call or ask why I wasn't getting a response- if my ex and I were together and he wanted to be in another room, I happily gave him space, did not take it personal, i was just happy to have him around since we only saw each other 3 times a week tops. Sometimes a lot more, dependent on his mood/feelings. At any rate, guest , i can understand your feeling like T was too harsh or maybe even triggering, for me I felt the sting only when I thought of my ex and how I may have pushed him away, but after getting to know Tgat these past few weeks/months or so- I understand where she is coming from and have seen both her biting truth type posts and her extremely warm, supportive, loving, tough-love, wise posts as well. I have gotten to know the whole Tgat, not just the Avoidant, but the person who is quite dynamic and amazing. Bip, you and I as AP's definitely bring a special kind of something that comes easier for us than our Avoidant friends, while they bring a special kind of something we also long to have. By being all over the forum, we learn so much from each other in these rich conversations. it does sting to hear how we affect others but that is why we need to heal. i have to show up as i am here, and everyone else should also. i tried to differentiate and say "don't take this personally" about your ex kristy because he makes my blood cold. i tried to explain this is about triggered stuff and what i experienced. and i know it's not graceful but i don't consider it a kindness to hide this from you. i don't. AP triggered behavior is as damaging as avoidant triggered behavior and i shared what you don't have access to otherwise. you can never know how it feels if someone doesn't tell you. i know it's important for people to understand how an anxious person feels and its also important for a DA to be understood. i would not have shared if not asked because i knew the propriety and etiquette of the forum. but, it is what it is. i gave the feedback. thank you @kristy for taking it in context of the rapport we have and the help i have tried to offer sincerely. i appreciate that. every time i hit "create post" i am clear on being willing to face the backlash and i will always face it. i always have. i gotta go sleep now. g'nite all. I have mad respect for you, T! I feel like you and I have really dug each other out of the trenches when needed and I cannot tell you what both your support and your perspective mean to me. You are absolutely right, there is no way to know how it feels on the other side of the coin without hearing it. I want to learn as much as I can about myself and my Avoidant comrades because honestly, there is so much to the Avoidant types I really enjoy, respect and love. I can tell you this, my dad is a total avoidant! But I love him very much and admire so many of his qualities. This forum has been an eye opener, quite life changing. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 6:00:26 GMT
Hey @tgat , Would you be willing to shed a little light on this? I think for me, I just assume my ex is flooded with anxiety from my reaching out too much or making him feel trapped, so he calms down by getting distance and allowing time to process before he can come back and engage. , kristy asked. |
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Post by guest on Feb 27, 2018 6:00:39 GMT
Now that i'm all riled up with my self-righteous AP anger I'm gonna diffuse this by inserting some humor elsewhere in the forum.
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Post by guest on Feb 27, 2018 6:03:42 GMT
Again Tgat, I'll post your response in quotes below, go back in the forum and tell me if Kristyrose asked for your opinion on that particular post before or after your reply.
wow, this may have nailed the AP side but it is Waayyyyy off base from the DA side lol! at least from my experience. it's just a dynamic that doesn't mesh.
that misperception about what goes on in a DA or what motivates behavior is a huge reason why the AP/DA dynamic can be so toxic.
mary quoted Jeb's site about this, at least one aspect of it, in another thread."
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 27, 2018 6:04:05 GMT
I just want to say I admire the willingness of the APs to put themselves out there, emotions and all. I see the raw vulnerability as a strength and it is this strength that has allowed me to see and learn through the lens of another. Receiving the love of an unwavering AP is very humbling and does make me see where I can do better. Hi Mary, that is such a kind thing to say, it warmed my heart because i honestly view myself as so weak at times. most times to be more honest. Hearing the perspectives from my DA/FA friends on here is also quite humbling and inspires me to seek out my inner strength and exercise it more! hugs to you. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 6:05:07 GMT
thank you kristyrose. i am thankful for you and will never forget how you were there for me for my first "aware" breakup. remember that day! so much emotion!!! you helped me a lot. this thread was also great for both of us and i'm glad we have each other to dig out of trenches. have a great night |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2018 6:06:14 GMT
Again Tgat, I'll post your response in quotes below, go back in the forum and tell me if Kristyrose asked for your opinion on that particular post before or after your reply. wow, this may have nailed the AP side but it is Waayyyyy off base from the DA side lol! at least from my experience. it's just a dynamic that doesn't mesh. that misperception about what goes on in a DA or what motivates behavior is a huge reason why the AP/DA dynamic can be so toxic. mary quoted Jeb's site about this, at least one aspect of it, in another thread." that was in no way against Ap, or DA? and i responded because my name was called out in madames post? and then kristy asked me to shed light? in the very next post? guest i don't know what you are trying to point out i don't see it. so. you win this one, i just don't know what else to say about that. |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 27, 2018 6:07:20 GMT
thank you kristyrose . i am thankful for you and will never forget how you were there for me for my first "aware" breakup. remember that day! so much emotion!!! you helped me a lot. this thread was also great for both of us and i'm glad we have each other to dig out of trenches. have a great night Of course I remember! Will never forget my friend! And I will never forget how you saved me more than once, first when I had "the talk" and was nervous, then when i went to the show, which was a hard night for you, then again this past weekend!!! Of course this doesnt even include all the times you have reminded me that I do love myself and have sent many helpful and inspiring posts. Sleep well! Big hugs! |
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