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Post by throwaway1713 on Dec 17, 2018 18:51:12 GMT
I've found posting on this forum has been really helpful, so I hope no one minds this stream of consciousness post! I'm 9 months out from my FA ex breaking us up, but it currently feels like week 1 again. Our connection was so strong and our relationship was a combination of incredible and terrible. We were absolute soulmates and best friends, we laughed all day every day, played with each other, we talked through our differences rather than fighting, worked on projects together, matched perfectly creatively (we work in the creative fields) and shared mutual friends but also had our own interests/friends. BUT he ended up unable to be intimate, couldn't kiss, couldn't have sex, couldn't bear to be looked at or touched in a sexual way. He started off as perfectly secure presenting and then the FA began to creep in at about a year together. It probably didn't help that we were living in a very small place together, he literally had nowhere to escape and I now understand the engulfment feeling that FAs experience, which must've been so intense and difficult for him.
He broke us up so abruptly and because of that, even though I instigated NC immediately, I didn't block him on anything. I didn't want to cut him off totally. And he did reach out in a sort of way about 6 months after the break up via the social media channel I'd left open.
But I found out one week ago that he's in a new relationship (he was in it when he reached out, unbeknownst to me) and I immediately blocked him. My bottom line was, if he gets with someone else, I have to cut him off completely because it will be too painful for me. So that's where I'm at. Something has definitely shifted for me, before I felt like it was possible he might return and I felt so much love and compassion for him. But now I feel like I'm giving up on him. I know this is the sane thing to do, I'm completely exhausted by this. It's occupied my mind almost constantly for the past 9 months and I could do with a breather.
I know this will get better, I've been in this place before. It just feels like the aftermath of being with a partner who has an attachment disorder is so different to a 'regular' break up. If you had an incredible relationship in every other way, you know that if they were secure your relationship could've possibly been a lifelong one. So I have this overwhelming feeling of sorrow. We are so right for each other...but only if we're both healthy. I guess that's the thing, accepting the other person isn't healthy. And for anyone who has an attachment disorder, that's ok, you can make yourself healthy if you're at the right place and you have the desire to do it. I hope he reaches his limit and can heal himself. I just feel like I need to cut him off completely now and let distance and time do their thing for me.
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Post by leavethelighton on Dec 18, 2018 1:00:46 GMT
Some people may not like the word "disorder" as if it were a disease... I'm not sure that's the best way to think of it. But maybe I'm just being sensitive about it.
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Post by faithopelove on Dec 18, 2018 6:18:54 GMT
Some people may not like the word "disorder" as if it were a disease... I'm not sure that's the best way to think of it. But maybe I'm just being sensitive about it. I agree “disorder” doesn’t seem appropriate when it’s a way of relating and attaching that may be more or less secure with various levels on each side. No judgments- just a way of coping and connecting. |
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Post by sissyk on Dec 18, 2018 14:41:41 GMT
I get that feeling of frustration. My DA/FA guy was in some ways a custom ordered specialty item...we had SO much in common and a connection that I have rarely experienced in my decades on the planet. So it seems ungallant of the Universe to get us so tantalizing close yet make it impossible for us to have a real if imperfect relationship.
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Post by throwaway1713 on Dec 19, 2018 2:08:18 GMT
Some people may not like the word "disorder" as if it were a disease... I'm not sure that's the best way to think of it. But maybe I'm just being sensitive about it. I completely understand. I guess I view the elements in myself that skew away from secure attachment and create suffering in me as ‘disordered’, which is why I used the term. They feel painful, create unhappiness in me and are not behaviours I wish to continue. They feel like unhealthy behaviours that I would like to shed. Secure attachment seems to be a goal for the majority of people experiencing other forms of attachment style on these forums, so I get the impression other people feel similarly to me. They would like to move away from behaviours that cause them suffering. I do completely understand the lack of control someone with an attachment style other than secure has, I know it’s not a choice. But it seems that the recognition that an attachment style is ‘disordered’ is part of the process of working towards a more secure style and healthier relationships. |
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Post by throwaway1713 on Dec 19, 2018 2:41:21 GMT
I get that feeling of frustration. My DA/FA guy was in some ways a custom ordered specialty item...we had SO much in common and a connection that I have rarely experienced in my decades on the planet. So it seems ungallant of the Universe to get us so tantalizing close yet make it impossible for us to have a real if imperfect relationship. Haha, yes I completely feel this! It’s absolutely crazy how connected we were, we exploded into each other’s lives and it was magnificent. I have wondered if he still feels it somewhere deep down, but I also know I cannot fathom what it’s like to be FA. For me, my feelings are right there and I know distance and time can heal me after a break up. But for him, I have no idea. Are the feelings there but hidden? Or is part of him being FA an ability to destroy his feelings completely until they’re dead? I guess no one except him could answer that, but I also get the feeling he doesn’t really know either. It’s so so sad. |
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Post by chipper on Dec 19, 2018 19:40:43 GMT
I get that feeling of frustration. My DA/FA guy was in some ways a custom ordered specialty item...we had SO much in common and a connection that I have rarely experienced in my decades on the planet. So it seems ungallant of the Universe to get us so tantalizing close yet make it impossible for us to have a real if imperfect relationship. Yeah, second this. It’s odd. I’ve seen time and time again folks explain the connection, only to have attachment mess it up. On the topic of disorder, I think one actually does exist, but attachment styles and attachment disorders are two separate things. |
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Post by leavethelighton on Dec 20, 2018 1:02:55 GMT
chipper, true. There are attachment disorders, often caused by major infancy/childhood neglect (ex: children in orphanages without nurturing caregivers), and that's a different thing altogether than this forum... I understand why throwaway1713 means by using "disordered" as an adjective, as it may be used in the field of psychology, though I think of it more as "dysfunctional." sissyk and chipper I do wonder about these intense connections. What is that essence that makes them seem so unique, beautiful, and often unprecedented-- something we most want to maintain and continue-- and yet the most difficult ones to maintain and continue. The irony is piercing sometimes. From reading Harville Hendrix, it makes me think sometimes the people we end up in this situation with (it's often a DA-AP or FA-AP matching) there's this subconscious recognition that the connection has the *potential* to be mutually beneficial-- the healing that would occur if both people were mutually moving towards a secure relation together-- they each have what the other needs. It's like finally finding someone who speaks your language. Unfortunately it can seem like that mutually moving towards secure together almost never actually happens, as most people in such a pairing lack the awareness, knowledge, tools, etc. to make it happen. Our subconscious knows it's the holy grail though, if only it could happen.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 1:17:32 GMT
chipper , true. There are attachment disorders, often caused by major infancy/childhood neglect (ex: children in orphanages without nurturing caregivers), and that's a different thing altogether than this forum... I understand why throwaway1713 means by using "disordered" as an adjective, as it may be used in the field of psychology, though I think of it more as "dysfunctional." sissyk and chipper I do wonder about these intense connections. What is that essence that makes them seem so unique, beautiful, and often unprecedented-- something we most want to maintain and continue-- and yet the most difficult ones to maintain and continue. The irony is piercing sometimes. From reading Harville Hendrix, it makes me think sometimes the people we end up in this situation with (it's often a DA-AP or FA-AP matching) there's this subconscious recognition that the connection has the *potential* to be mutually beneficial-- the healing that would occur if both people were mutually moving towards a secure relation together-- they each have what the other needs. It's like finally finding someone who speaks your language. Unfortunately it can seem like that mutually moving towards secure together almost never actually happens, as most people in such a pairing lack the awareness, knowledge, tools, etc. to make it happen. Our subconscious knows it's the holy grail though, if only it could happen. from my own experience, i think there is a deep, intense connection because both parties speak the same language of insecurity and understand that vibration, that nobody else seem to. oftentimes, we attract to ourselves who we are similar to deep down, not just surface level characteristics. we are also attracted to those qualities that are in stark contrast to us because we, deep down, know that that is what we lack and we hope to get it from each other. we see in each other what we need to make ourselves whole, but the problem is that rather than learning from each other what the other party does best, we aren't aligned that way. there is both a common denominator and a polar opposite in the pairing. it is that deep deep understanding that lies below all the differences that make the connection so intense, because we're really connecting at a soul level. but the surface physical differences keep telling us omg we aren't good together and we feel angry and hurt and sad, and we tell ourselves we're better off without each other > this telling ourselves is often what creates further insecurity. to heal and move towards security requires each party to look at their own wounding, learn from the other's strengths (e.g. DA, then the strength is independence and self-soothing), and expand ourselves to become more complete IN ourselves. to do this requires a complete belief and trust in each other that their actions are not hurtful nor meant to be hurtful, and that we will consult and learn from each other on how they do things so that we can develop those aspects ourselves while letting go of the things we do. however, the strengths that we initially see as attractive and the pairing that initially make us feel whole, over time, becomes an irritant and trigger, because in a very physical way, it keeps reminding us that we lack that and we have to change in order to accommodate the other person. psychologically, we grow to resent it because we aren't taking responsibility for expanding into that whole being by ourselves (which you'll need to in order to have this relationship). the refusal to see the duality and interaction of the pairing, and what it says OF you, and what you need to do to expand your being into a better one, often leads to a dead-end to that relationship. for me that was the hardest part - seeing this as a duality rather than as an expansion of self. seeing this as asking me to give up who i am so that i can be what he wants me to be, while not doing the same himself (he prob thinks the same of me). it doesn't have to be a conflict nor mutually exclusive, but rather simply an expansion of myself that is self-motivated so that i can be whole and complete, with or without him. |
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Post by leavethelighton on Dec 20, 2018 1:39:55 GMT
@shiningstar what a great way of putting it all...
And I think sometimes people may very much WANT to grow, develop, expand, etc. and may even see the need at the time, but just might not be ready to.
For what you mean by "duality" though, the other person has to also be trying?
I find it frustrating to think that to leave these patterns of insecure attachment behind, I may never again really feel like I connect with someone "at the soul level." I can have healthy, secure relationships with people and not REALLY feel that. It might not be a feeling that happens in secure relationships... I've accepted that possibility, but it's been hard to accept that this whole journey here may mean giving that up.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 2:35:45 GMT
@shiningstar what a great way of putting it all... And I think sometimes people may very much WANT to grow, develop, expand, etc. and may even see the need at the time, but just might not be ready to. For what you mean by "duality" though, the other person has to also be trying? I find it frustrating to think that to leave these patterns of insecure attachment behind, I may never again really feel like I connect with someone "at the soul level." I can have healthy, secure relationships with people and not REALLY feel that. It might not be a feeling that happens in secure relationships... I've accepted that possibility, but it's been hard to accept that this whole journey here may mean giving that up. Oh that is so good. I think you've pinpointed something! this need to feel connected on a soul level... and that we can't do it without being who we are and the ideas we have about attachment/love, and that is so driven by our insecure attachment styles. this need to hold myself in view of who i am still, in order to pursue what i want so much, because if i have to give up who i am to get what i want - then that's such a sacrifice isn't it. i think alot of times, people just can't see that they're getting in their own way, and then just keeps shaking the cord that doesn't work. when i say duality, i mean the duality in the pairing. i see my ex as so similar but so different to me. there's a duality of similarities and differences at the same time, but the "special feel" i get from that is that it feels so difficult to reconcile the similarities and differences without feeling like it's doomed. romeo and juliet much? |
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Post by faithopelove on Dec 20, 2018 2:53:32 GMT
chipper , true. There are attachment disorders, often caused by major infancy/childhood neglect (ex: children in orphanages without nurturing caregivers), and that's a different thing altogether than this forum... I understand why throwaway1713 means by using "disordered" as an adjective, as it may be used in the field of psychology, though I think of it more as "dysfunctional." sissyk and chipper I do wonder about these intense connections. What is that essence that makes them seem so unique, beautiful, and often unprecedented-- something we most want to maintain and continue-- and yet the most difficult ones to maintain and continue. The irony is piercing sometimes. From reading Harville Hendrix, it makes me think sometimes the people we end up in this situation with (it's often a DA-AP or FA-AP matching) there's this subconscious recognition that the connection has the *potential* to be mutually beneficial-- the healing that would occur if both people were mutually moving towards a secure relation together-- they each have what the other needs. It's like finally finding someone who speaks your language. Unfortunately it can seem like that mutually moving towards secure together almost never actually happens, as most people in such a pairing lack the awareness, knowledge, tools, etc. to make it happen. Our subconscious knows it's the holy grail though, if only it could happen. from my own experience, i think there is a deep, intense connection because both parties speak the same language of insecurity and understand that vibration, that nobody else seem to. oftentimes, we attract to ourselves who we are similar to deep down, not just surface level characteristics. we are also attracted to those qualities that are in stark contrast to us because we, deep down, know that that is what we lack and we hope to get it from each other. we see in each other what we need to make ourselves whole, but the problem is that rather than learning from each other what the other party does best, we aren't aligned that way. there is both a common denominator and a polar opposite in the pairing. it is that deep deep understanding that lies below all the differences that make the connection so intense, because we're really connecting at a soul level. but the surface physical differences keep telling us omg we aren't good together and we feel angry and hurt and sad, and we tell ourselves we're better off without each other > this telling ourselves is often what creates further insecurity. to heal and move towards security requires each party to look at their own wounding, learn from the other's strengths (e.g. DA, then the strength is independence and self-soothing), and expand ourselves to become more complete IN ourselves. to do this requires a complete belief and trust in each other that their actions are not hurtful nor meant to be hurtful, and that we will consult and learn from each other on how they do things so that we can develop those aspects ourselves while letting go of the things we do. however, the strengths that we initially see as attractive and the pairing that initially make us feel whole, over time, becomes an irritant and trigger, because in a very physical way, it keeps reminding us that we lack that and we have to change in order to accommodate the other person. psychologically, we grow to resent it because we aren't taking responsibility for expanding into that whole being by ourselves (which you'll need to in order to have this relationship). the refusal to see the duality and interaction of the pairing, and what it says OF you, and what you need to do to expand your being into a better one, often leads to a dead-end to that relationship. for me that was the hardest part - seeing this as a duality rather than as an expansion of self. seeing this as asking me to give up who i am so that i can be what he wants me to be, while not doing the same himself (he prob thinks the same of me). it doesn't have to be a conflict nor mutually exclusive, but rather simply an expansion of myself that is self-motivated so that i can be whole and complete, with or without him. I see it as much more than just an attachment level attraction- otherwise I’d be attracted to and want every insecure guy I meet and I’m far from that. I’m actually pretty picky and only have 2 guys in my life that got under my skin and only one that I was in a relationship with- they are the exception rather than the rule. |
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Post by faithopelove on Dec 20, 2018 2:58:03 GMT
@shiningstar what a great way of putting it all... And I think sometimes people may very much WANT to grow, develop, expand, etc. and may even see the need at the time, but just might not be ready to. For what you mean by "duality" though, the other person has to also be trying? I find it frustrating to think that to leave these patterns of insecure attachment behind, I may never again really feel like I connect with someone "at the soul level." I can have healthy, secure relationships with people and not REALLY feel that. It might not be a feeling that happens in secure relationships... I've accepted that possibility, but it's been hard to accept that this whole journey here may mean giving that up. Maybe you feel something better- more steady, secure and calm? I don’t know...I was with my ex husband for 24 years and he’s likely a FA but a mild one and I can tell you I never felt fireworks, passion or deep attraction with him. It felt more platonic physically and emotionally he was not shut down but didn’t care to connect in that way- the marriage eventually felt like a sham and I left. I didn’t have the physical or emotional connection with him. I just dated at 14 and got attached but in more like s family way- not a partner way. He would’ve been content in that unfulfilling state forever. So, that leads me to think maybe a stable relationship does feels boring to me but since he was likely FA, I should’ve felt sparks? I think it’s possible to have a solid relationship with passion and physical attraction. I can’t believe that only happens I’m insecure relationships?! |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2018 3:01:33 GMT
from my own experience, i think there is a deep, intense connection because both parties speak the same language of insecurity and understand that vibration, that nobody else seem to. oftentimes, we attract to ourselves who we are similar to deep down, not just surface level characteristics. we are also attracted to those qualities that are in stark contrast to us because we, deep down, know that that is what we lack and we hope to get it from each other. we see in each other what we need to make ourselves whole, but the problem is that rather than learning from each other what the other party does best, we aren't aligned that way. there is both a common denominator and a polar opposite in the pairing. it is that deep deep understanding that lies below all the differences that make the connection so intense, because we're really connecting at a soul level. but the surface physical differences keep telling us omg we aren't good together and we feel angry and hurt and sad, and we tell ourselves we're better off without each other > this telling ourselves is often what creates further insecurity. to heal and move towards security requires each party to look at their own wounding, learn from the other's strengths (e.g. DA, then the strength is independence and self-soothing), and expand ourselves to become more complete IN ourselves. to do this requires a complete belief and trust in each other that their actions are not hurtful nor meant to be hurtful, and that we will consult and learn from each other on how they do things so that we can develop those aspects ourselves while letting go of the things we do. however, the strengths that we initially see as attractive and the pairing that initially make us feel whole, over time, becomes an irritant and trigger, because in a very physical way, it keeps reminding us that we lack that and we have to change in order to accommodate the other person. psychologically, we grow to resent it because we aren't taking responsibility for expanding into that whole being by ourselves (which you'll need to in order to have this relationship). the refusal to see the duality and interaction of the pairing, and what it says OF you, and what you need to do to expand your being into a better one, often leads to a dead-end to that relationship. for me that was the hardest part - seeing this as a duality rather than as an expansion of self. seeing this as asking me to give up who i am so that i can be what he wants me to be, while not doing the same himself (he prob thinks the same of me). it doesn't have to be a conflict nor mutually exclusive, but rather simply an expansion of myself that is self-motivated so that i can be whole and complete, with or without him. I see it as much more than just an attachment level attraction- otherwise I’d be attracted to and want every insecure guy I meet and I’m far from that. I’m actually pretty picky and only have 2 guys in my life that got under my skin and only one that I was in a relationship with- they are the exception rather than the rule. oh for sure. it's not about just insecurity, it's this particular mix of this person and their insecurities and how it gels with you. but the most intense connections are always with those with wonky attachment, at least for me. i have many other partners, and many of them are secure - and I started dating at 14! there are only 2 who got to me - one was a self-identified FA (we're still friends and we talked about this very briefly) and the second one was a DA. but with the FA i didn't learn quite so much, though the breakup and all of that was devastating. the DA was really the straw that broke the camel's back.. at some point i just gave up resisting and resigned myself to whatever I was supposed to do to grow and end this BS. in between the FA and DA was a narc who discarded me before we ever had a real relationship. FA triggered a depressive spiral, narc sent me into depression, and DA showed me how lame i was and how i needed to just BE better. but the connections with these three people were always the strongest, albeit in different ways. |
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Post by faithopelove on Dec 20, 2018 3:06:48 GMT
I see it as much more than just an attachment level attraction- otherwise I’d be attracted to and want every insecure guy I meet and I’m far from that. I’m actually pretty picky and only have 2 guys in my life that got under my skin and only one that I was in a relationship with- they are the exception rather than the rule. oh for sure. it's not about just insecurity, it's this particular mix of this person and their insecurities and how it gels with you. but the most intense connections are always with those with wonky attachment, at least for me. i have many other partners, and many of them are secure - and I started dating at 14! there are only 2 who got to me - one was a self-identified FA (we're still friends and we talked about this very briefly) and the second one was a DA. but with the FA i didn't learn quite so much, though the breakup and all of that was devastating. the DA was really the straw that broke the camel's back.. at some point i just gave up resisting and resigned myself to whatever I was supposed to do to grow and end this BS. in between the FA and DA was a narc who discarded me before we ever had a real relationship. FA triggered a depressive spiral, narc sent me into depression, and DA showed me how lame i was and how i needed to just BE better. but the connections with these three people were always the strongest, albeit in different ways. Yes, a DA will tend to make you see the light w no drawn out formalities! I know mine did!! I am a polar opposite from that ex DA. Truly. He won’t try and I never give up...ugh I should say we respond to and process things completely differently but deep down, I think we are more alike than we realize. I also started dating at 14 but unfortunately I made the mistake of marrying the first guy I dated! Talk about attachment issues... |
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