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Post by stayhappy on Jan 8, 2019 4:44:22 GMT
There is a lot out there that discusses dismissive and fearful as simply avoidant, lumping them in together as though avoidant is the primary description of their behavior and the anxiousness differentiating the two from each other. On here I have seen many posts about trying to determine if someone is dismissive or fearful but I never see anyone asking if someone is anxious or fearful. Is it rare for someone that is fearful to be so anxious they present as anxious or does the nature of being fearful mean that the avoidant traits typically dominate? Or is there likely some sort of selection bias in the literature and the community here? I read somewhere that APs are avoidants too because they in some way chose partners that won’t meet their needs. When they find someone more secure who can meet their meet they probably that feel that that person is the right one. I have also read that DA have anxiety but not in a councious way. Some experiments show that while triggered there are “anxious hormones” in their body even if they don’t act anxious. Their brain activity actually changes while triggered. |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 8, 2019 5:21:54 GMT
gaynxious, I think there is a selection bias. An FA isn't going to be very avoidant with someone more avoidant, and that avoidant may feel relief with some distancing anyway and not even notice. Most likely, if they did even decide to analyze the FA after the fact, they'd probably just talk about how they seemed oppressive when anxious and assume they were AP... unless maybe they knew a lot about this person's history and that they'd turned off and run away from non-avoidant partners in the past and put the puzzle pieces together. That same FA is going to swing avoidant with an AP. That AP will get caught in the dance, is much more likely to come to the board, ruminate, overanalyze, and know that the FA is some kind of avoidant so not assume they are also straight-forward AP. I can think of 3 examples of FAs off the top of my head who thought they were AP because they'd only dated avoidants, and 1 who thought she was DA but is FA, so it can be confusing all around. I can think of a couple more who I wasn't completely sure about between AP and FA (for example, one I've known a long time ended up testing secure in her relationships and overall but highly FA with her parents). But those are just anecdotal. Yes, and the attachment depends on the relationship as I score strongly DA w my parents....so I can relate to how a DA feels to an extent as it’s the way I respond to my parents. I score secure w friends and AP with romantic partners- and I completely agree w those scores. Friends rarely trigger me and I feel much more rational with them. Those attachment styles have been set since I was very young. |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 8, 2019 5:27:48 GMT
There is a lot out there that discusses dismissive and fearful as simply avoidant, lumping them in together as though avoidant is the primary description of their behavior and the anxiousness differentiating the two from each other. On here I have seen many posts about trying to determine if someone is dismissive or fearful but I never see anyone asking if someone is anxious or fearful. Is it rare for someone that is fearful to be so anxious they present as anxious or does the nature of being fearful mean that the avoidant traits typically dominate? Or is there likely some sort of selection bias in the literature and the community here? I read somewhere that APs are avoidants too because they in some way chose partners that won’t meet their needs. When they find someone more secure who can meet their meet they probably that feel that that person is the right one. I have also read that DA have anxiety but not in a councious way. Some experiments show that while triggered there are “anxious hormones” in their body even if they don’t act anxious. Their brain activity actually changes while triggered. I’ve read both those statements before also. It makes sense about DA- the anxiety is likely suppressed like their emotions. I never really bought into it that AP unconsciously choose an unavailable partner. AP have a hard time breaking away from a partner and can be avoidant as far as being too afraid to calmly assert one’s needs- but seeking an avoidant? My therapist used to say that and I didn’t agree. Whenever my partners were close to me and open I was always my happiness. I flourished in the intimacy. It’s a bit far fetched to me. |
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Post by stayhappy on Jan 8, 2019 5:54:54 GMT
I read somewhere that APs are avoidants too because they in some way chose partners that won’t meet their needs. When they find someone more secure who can meet their meet they probably that feel that that person is the right one. I have also read that DA have anxiety but not in a councious way. Some experiments show that while triggered there are “anxious hormones” in their body even if they don’t act anxious. Their brain activity actually changes while triggered. I’ve read both those statements before also. It makes sense about DA- the anxiety is likely suppressed like their emotions. I never really bought into it that AP unconsciously choose an unavailable partner. AP have a hard time breaking away from a partner and can be avoidant as far as being too afraid to calmly assert one’s needs- but seeking an avoidant? My therapist used to say that and I didn’t agree. Whenever my partners were close to me and open I was always my happiness. I flourished in the intimacy. It’s a bit far fetched to me. I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. |
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Post by gaynxious on Jan 8, 2019 20:38:47 GMT
I’ve read both those statements before also. It makes sense about DA- the anxiety is likely suppressed like their emotions. I never really bought into it that AP unconsciously choose an unavailable partner. AP have a hard time breaking away from a partner and can be avoidant as far as being too afraid to calmly assert one’s needs- but seeking an avoidant? My therapist used to say that and I didn’t agree. Whenever my partners were close to me and open I was always my happiness. I flourished in the intimacy. It’s a bit far fetched to me. I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. I think a better way to frame it is that APs are more comfortable with avoidants because the problems encountered are more familiar and you have practice dealing with them. Remember, attachment styles are heuristic problem solving strategies you developed to very specific environments. All relationships have problems and difficulties and each person has their own set of problems and difficulties they can tolerate and those they can’t. I think initially at least anxious people assume their problems with avoidants are just normal relationship problems. My dad is a textbook DA while my mom was a secure and from talking about attachment theory with him it sounds like she was the only secure he ever dated. All the other women he dated were anxious and this colored his view of relationships so he felt his relationship with my mother was unique. I posited this interpretation to him and he seemed to agree there is some merit to it. Remember partner selection is not entirely up to you, you only get to chose from those that are drawn or open to you. So maybe if the people that will be interested in perusing a given anxious person, most, or the ‘best’ on paper will be avoidant. It’s extermely complex. As far as an AP having difficulty being attracted to a secure I worry about that a lot. I can’t handle anyone I consider boring, although my ex of 10 years was boring Ina lot of ways, not a lot of exciting interests, minimal personality, he wasn’t boring emotionally or intellectually. This may be a learned heuristic for actually selecting an avoidant. |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 8, 2019 22:53:07 GMT
I’ve read both those statements before also. It makes sense about DA- the anxiety is likely suppressed like their emotions. I never really bought into it that AP unconsciously choose an unavailable partner. AP have a hard time breaking away from a partner and can be avoidant as far as being too afraid to calmly assert one’s needs- but seeking an avoidant? My therapist used to say that and I didn’t agree. Whenever my partners were close to me and open I was always my happiness. I flourished in the intimacy. It’s a bit far fetched to me. I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. Good question...in my last relationship, my avoidant boyfriend broke up with me and I had no intention of leaving. I was devoted and committed to making it work- although he started to pull away a month before the break and I noticed it. I felt we could work through it but he had a different opinion. I never felt such love and physical attraction for a person. I was all in and still hoping... In my experience, I’ve never seen the avoidant grow more secure in our relationship- married to one avoidant and dated the other. In my marriage I grew from anxious to secure as we got married, had more stability, saw each other more, and had children. All those factors cause me to be less anxious and hyper focused on our relationship- I relaxed; however, he always kept a relatively safe distance. In my dating relationship I never had a chance to relax as things were going awesome and I adored him, then he pulled away, which triggered my AP even more. He def didn’t turn more secure as he became fearful and ran after a handful of conflicts. We just triggered each other’s fears. So it makes sense and it’s my hope that avoidants evolve to be more secure in stable relationships, but I didn’t experience that with my two. Admittedly my dating relationship became rocky and felt unsafe as he pulled away. Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure. I’m trying that now as the ex boyfriend and I see each other casually- hard to be casual for me but it’s that or nothing for now. And I’m learning to stand on my own. |
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Post by stayhappy on Jan 9, 2019 7:23:04 GMT
I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. I think a better way to frame it is that APs are more comfortable with avoidants because the problems encountered are more familiar and you have practice dealing with them. Remember, attachment styles are heuristic problem solving strategies you developed to very specific environments. All relationships have problems and difficulties and each person has their own set of problems and difficulties they can tolerate and those they can’t. I think initially at least anxious people assume their problems with avoidants are just normal relationship problems. My dad is a textbook DA while my mom was a secure and from talking about attachment theory with him it sounds like she was the only secure he ever dated. All the other women he dated were anxious and this colored his view of relationships so he felt his relationship with my mother was unique. I posited this interpretation to him and he seemed to agree there is some merit to it. Remember partner selection is not entirely up to you, you only get to chose from those that are drawn or open to you. So maybe if the people that will be interested in perusing a given anxious person, most, or the ‘best’ on paper will be avoidant. It’s extermely complex. As far as an AP having difficulty being attracted to a secure I worry about that a lot. I can’t handle anyone I consider boring, although my ex of 10 years was boring Ina lot of ways, not a lot of exciting interests, minimal personality, he wasn’t boring emotionally or intellectually. This may be a learned heuristic for actually selecting an avoidant. I’m kind of secure and I don’t think the my partner have to like the same thing as me to be exciting. My ex husband was more nerd while I like sport, dancing and stuff like that. I have a lot of anxious friend and what I see is like the importance to earn love. Like if “I want what I can’t really get” is more exciting. While they met someone who is more open and “easy”, no games, no guessing, they lost the interest. I also have some friends who are more avoidant and all the vulnerabilities and feelings comes out when they are drunk! |
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Post by stayhappy on Jan 9, 2019 7:27:11 GMT
I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. Good question...in my last relationship, my avoidant boyfriend broke up with me and I had no intention of leaving. I was devoted and committed to making it work- although he started to pull away a month before the break and I noticed it. I felt we could work through it but he had a different opinion. I never felt such love and physical attraction for a person. I was all in and still hoping... In my experience, I’ve never seen the avoidant grow more secure in our relationship- married to one avoidant and dated the other. In my marriage I grew from anxious to secure as we got married, had more stability, saw each other more, and had children. All those factors cause me to be less anxious and hyper focused on our relationship- I relaxed; however, he always kept a relatively safe distance. In my dating relationship I never had a chance to relax as things were going awesome and I adored him, then he pulled away, which triggered my AP even more. He def didn’t turn more secure as he became fearful and ran after a handful of conflicts. We just triggered each other’s fears. So it makes sense and it’s my hope that avoidants evolve to be more secure in stable relationships, but I didn’t experience that with my two. Admittedly my dating relationship became rocky and felt unsafe as he pulled away. Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure. I’m trying that now as the ex boyfriend and I see each other casually- hard to be casual for me but it’s that or nothing for now. And I’m learning to stand on my own. I think my parents are two avoidants. They had a hard childhood but together could they grow into more securely attached and rease pretty secure children maybe they didn’t want their children to have the bad experience they have as a child. I do believe people can grow to secure in relationships after we learn how eachother works. |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 10, 2019 0:09:56 GMT
Good question...in my last relationship, my avoidant boyfriend broke up with me and I had no intention of leaving. I was devoted and committed to making it work- although he started to pull away a month before the break and I noticed it. I felt we could work through it but he had a different opinion. I never felt such love and physical attraction for a person. I was all in and still hoping... In my experience, I’ve never seen the avoidant grow more secure in our relationship- married to one avoidant and dated the other. In my marriage I grew from anxious to secure as we got married, had more stability, saw each other more, and had children. All those factors cause me to be less anxious and hyper focused on our relationship- I relaxed; however, he always kept a relatively safe distance. In my dating relationship I never had a chance to relax as things were going awesome and I adored him, then he pulled away, which triggered my AP even more. He def didn’t turn more secure as he became fearful and ran after a handful of conflicts. We just triggered each other’s fears. So it makes sense and it’s my hope that avoidants evolve to be more secure in stable relationships, but I didn’t experience that with my two. Admittedly my dating relationship became rocky and felt unsafe as he pulled away. Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure. I’m trying that now as the ex boyfriend and I see each other casually- hard to be casual for me but it’s that or nothing for now. And I’m learning to stand on my own. I think my parents are two avoidants. They had a hard childhood but together could they grow into more securely attached and rease pretty secure children maybe they didn’t want their children to have the bad experience they have as a child. I do believe people can grow to secure in relationships after we learn how eachother works. Yes, I agree that the two partners can learn so much from each other and grow together if they are willing to be open and face those fears. |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 10, 2019 0:29:33 GMT
I have read a lot posts from APs when they say that they don’t feel attracted to secure because it’s like something is missing. I don’t know about you but don’t AP get “stuck” in relationship with avoidants because of the hope they get when things are good? I would not be surprised if the avoidant partner become more secure and consistent the AP partner who haven’t work at themselves would maybe start to think that something is missing. I think a better way to frame it is that APs are more comfortable with avoidants because the problems encountered are more familiar and you have practice dealing with them. Remember, attachment styles are heuristic problem solving strategies you developed to very specific environments. All relationships have problems and difficulties and each person has their own set of problems and difficulties they can tolerate and those they can’t. I think initially at least anxious people assume their problems with avoidants are just normal relationship problems. My dad is a textbook DA while my mom was a secure and from talking about attachment theory with him it sounds like she was the only secure he ever dated. All the other women he dated were anxious and this colored his view of relationships so he felt his relationship with my mother was unique. I posited this interpretation to him and he seemed to agree there is some merit to it. Remember partner selection is not entirely up to you, you only get to chose from those that are drawn or open to you. So maybe if the people that will be interested in perusing a given anxious person, most, or the ‘best’ on paper will be avoidant. It’s extermely complex. As far as an AP having difficulty being attracted to a secure I worry about that a lot. I can’t handle anyone I consider boring, although my ex of 10 years was boring Ina lot of ways, not a lot of exciting interests, minimal personality, he wasn’t boring emotionally or intellectually. This may be a learned heuristic for actually selecting an avoidant. Yes, patience dealing with those familiar patterns or an acceptance and allowance of unhealthy dynamics to occur because that was modeled as your standard for many impressionable years growing up. The insecure has built a tolerance for it- more so the anxiously attached who don’t give up easily. A secure wouldn’t be familiar with it or tolerate it. They’ve experienced better. |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2019 3:38:05 GMT
In my dating relationship I never had a chance to relax as things were going awesome and I adored him, then he pulled away, which triggered my AP even more. He def didn’t turn more secure as he became fearful and ran after a handful of conflicts. We just triggered each other’s fears. So it makes sense and it’s my hope that avoidants evolve to be more secure in stable relationships, but I didn’t experience that with my two. Admittedly my dating relationship became rocky and felt unsafe as he pulled away. Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure. I’m trying that now as the ex boyfriend and I see each other casually- hard to be casual for me but it’s that or nothing for now. And I’m learning to stand on my own. , "Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure." That's a pretty big maybe. If someone is as avoidant as the exes both you and I have posted about dating in the past, I don't think it matters who they're dating, at least not in the sense you're thinking of it. While it doesn't help to be triggering your partner all the time by having an opposing attachment style, if the partner isn't already aware or isn't interested in working on themselves, you having a different attachment style wouldn't change that. That partner being able to pair with someone else of another type wouldn't result in the type of relationship dynamics you would most like either. Since the change needs to come from them, the only way being more avoidant or secure would matter is if that partner already started their self-work... and the further trick to it is in that case it still wouldn't matter quite as much which style you had at that point anyway because they'd be earning secure and likely much more willing to do the work with you and communicate as long as you were also trying to grow more secure (and not driving them crazy by repeatedly anxious/avoidant dancing with them). An entrenched avoidant dating another avoidant or a secure might not be triggered to the extent they would dating an AP, but the relationship that works for them would still be distant-- they're just paired off with someone who has more tolerance for distance and less need for frequent or close intimacy. If they're not challenged and are happy enough that way, it won't grow into something else, but the existing dynamic will just continue to be secure in regards to the relationship and possibly stagnant. The insecure won't just suddenly grow into a more present partner, which may be okay and what they both want... and there will be less turmoil than there would in an anxious-avoidant pairing. I've written before about how I was very AP the first long-term round with my ex FA and was closing in on earning secure the second long-term round with him, and my behavior towards him completely changed. I thought that would be enough to inspire things to work because I didn't understand attachment styles still at the time or what FA issues were, and I'd blamed my own AP problems so thoroughly. But what I found was, it didn't matter how secure I was, his behavior repeated exactly both times because that's where he is in his process. He recognized that my changes made me an even better partner, but since that was never the real problem, he still felt like, inexplicably, something was missing (which, in retrospect, was him missing feeling rejected into getting AP triggered and overwhelmed by desire because he mistakes it for passion). Unaware anxious/avoidant pairings are never going to work well. Secure/insecure pairings are more likely to be stable over time, but there's a spectrum of how much intimacy that will involve depending on the magnitude and type of insecure. And, as another poster wrote about in her experience a couple months ago, if one of you changes, even for the better, it's still enough to shake up the dynamic so much that it may create problems. She was AP (or FA? I don't remember) and her husband secure, and they were together for years, and suddenly she got in touch with an ex (platonically) and finally started facing and growing out of all her old issues and sounded like she was really making her way towards secure -- and her husband didn't know how to handle it. Those situations can work out, of course, but I think that's why you're supposed to find partners you already work with on a healthy level from the outset. There's a better chance you will have the relationship you want and be able to grow together if you're both still evolving. |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2019 3:58:46 GMT
As far as an AP having difficulty being attracted to a secure I worry about that a lot. I can’t handle anyone I consider boring, although my ex of 10 years was boring Ina lot of ways, not a lot of exciting interests, minimal personality, he wasn’t boring emotionally or intellectually. This may be a learned heuristic for actually selecting an avoidant. This is something I had a hard time believing until it happened to me, but you actually don't have to worry about it at all! This will work itself out when you're ready for it to. I spent most of my life attracted only to avoidants, without realizing it of course. I can think of one really good guy was secure who I had a thing with when I was pretty young, but the logistics didn't work and we were almost always long-distance, so it didn't become a relationship. The crazy thing I noticed though, was when we got closest to figuring out if we could be geographically closer and give things a try, I had an inexplicable and sneaking suspicion in the back of my head I'd get bored with him! And he really was great, and I was a little scared of that feeling because he wouldn't have deserved to be written off as boring if we had gotten to have a real relationship. My point from that example is, I totally get where you're coming from! (He's still great, and has a long-lasting marriage and kids.)
Once I actually earned secure, the type of people I'm attracted to completely changed, basically overnight. It was not something I expected, though always something I wondered about (how could I fix my picker and stop being attracted to bad matches? how do you change who you're attract to???). I wrote about this in one of my posts going into detail about earning secure, but I went from being attracted to guys with an "edge" to suddenly realizing that edge was instability and insecurity that I did not find cute anymore! I'm looking for someone who is emotionally available and stable, but also has interests and does things. Just, those things are no longer, playing hard to get and being evasive... things I might find more interesting now are like.... a passion for traveling or them having a job with work they are actually interested in or being up for wacky random or artistic local events sometimes. Basically, having a rich and full life they enjoy with some flexibility but with emotional grounding, and wanting to share that with a committed partner who also has the same. Additionally, I don't need someone else to entertain me or make me feel whole, so I feel responsibility for myself in regards to not getting bored.
My hypothesis on this is, when you're AP, the mental/emotional stimulation you are getting is from doing the work to "solve" the puzzle of your partner's avoidance and the challenges within your interaction. However, once you are close to earning secure, it means you feel comfortable with yourself, with others, with boundaries, with meeting most of your needs on your own and being a whole person. So, that kind of maturity, and someone's ability to balance independence with interdependence and not project all over you, becomes really attractive. It's not about stimulation through drama anymore, it's about calmness and really connecting with someone past the fantasy bond or superficial eggshell-walking level. That doesn't mean it's easy to find that person, and the number of people I'm attracted to who are also available at my age seems like it's diminished since this change happened. My problem right now seems to be that the number of people I was attracted to wasn't that big in the first place, since only ~25% of people are avoidant! But now that many secures at my age are married and I'm not attracted lately to insecures... the numbers game seems tough, but I also finally have full confidence in my picker abilities.
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 10, 2019 4:02:41 GMT
In my dating relationship I never had a chance to relax as things were going awesome and I adored him, then he pulled away, which triggered my AP even more. He def didn’t turn more secure as he became fearful and ran after a handful of conflicts. We just triggered each other’s fears. So it makes sense and it’s my hope that avoidants evolve to be more secure in stable relationships, but I didn’t experience that with my two. Admittedly my dating relationship became rocky and felt unsafe as he pulled away. Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure. I’m trying that now as the ex boyfriend and I see each other casually- hard to be casual for me but it’s that or nothing for now. And I’m learning to stand on my own. , "Maybe if I was avoidant or secure, they would’ve became more secure." That's a pretty big maybe. If someone is as avoidant as the exes both you and I have posted about dating in the past, I don't think it matters who they're dating, at least not in the sense you're thinking of it. While it doesn't help to be triggering your partner all the time by having an opposing attachment style, if the partner isn't already aware or isn't interested in working on themselves, you having a different attachment style wouldn't change that. That partner being able to pair with someone else of another type wouldn't result in the type of relationship dynamics you would most like either. Since the change needs to come from them, the only way being more avoidant or secure would matter is if that partner already started their self-work... and the further trick to it is in that case it still wouldn't matter quite as much which style you had at that point anyway because they'd be earning secure and likely much more willing to do the work with you and communicate as long as you were also trying to grow more secure (and not driving them crazy by repeatedly anxious/avoidant dancing with them). An entrenched avoidant dating another avoidant or a secure might not be triggered to the extent they would dating an AP, but the relationship that works for them would still be distant-- they're just paired off with someone who has more tolerance for distance and less need for frequent or close intimacy. If they're not challenged and are happy enough that way, it won't grow into something else, but the existing dynamic will just continue to be secure in regards to the relationship and possibly stagnant. The insecure won't just suddenly grow into a more present partner, which may be okay and what they both want... and there will be less turmoil than there would in an anxious-avoidant pairing. I've written before about how I was very AP the first long-term round with my ex FA and was closing in on earning secure the second long-term round with him, and my behavior towards him completely changed. I thought that would be enough to inspire things to work because I didn't understand attachment styles still at the time or what FA issues were, and I'd blamed my own AP problems so thoroughly. But what I found was, it didn't matter how secure I was, his behavior repeated exactly both times because that's where he is in his process. He recognized that my changes made me an even better partner, but since that was never the real problem, he still felt like, inexplicably, something was missing (which, in retrospect, was him missing feeling rejected into getting AP triggered and overwhelmed by desire because he mistakes it for passion). Unaware anxious/avoidant pairings are never going to work well. Secure/insecure pairings are more likely to be stable over time, but there's a spectrum of how much intimacy that will involve depending on the magnitude and type of insecure. And, as another poster wrote about in her experience a couple months ago, if one of you changes, even for the better, it's still enough to shake up the dynamic so much that it may create problems. She was AP (or FA? I don't remember) and her husband secure, and they were together for years, and suddenly she got in touch with an ex (platonically) and finally started facing and growing out of all her old issues and sounded like she was really making her way towards secure -- and her husband didn't know how to handle it. Those situations can work out, of course, but I think that's why you're supposed to find partners you already work with on a healthy level from the outset. There's a better chance you will have the relationship you want and be able to grow together if you're both still evolving. Yes, a lot of good insight, Alexandra. It’s hard also, at my age, finding a secure partner in the dating pool. I’ve read an estimated 80% are avoidant over 40. Maybe it’s best to wait until I’m in my 60’s and the married secure guys become widowers. Just kidding! Kind of... 🤷♀️ |
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Post by faithopelove on Jan 10, 2019 4:08:43 GMT
As far as an AP having difficulty being attracted to a secure I worry about that a lot. I can’t handle anyone I consider boring, although my ex of 10 years was boring Ina lot of ways, not a lot of exciting interests, minimal personality, he wasn’t boring emotionally or intellectually. This may be a learned heuristic for actually selecting an avoidant. This is something I had a hard time believing until it happened to me, but you actually don't have to worry about it at all! This will work itself out when you're ready for it to. I spent most of my life attracted only to avoidants, without realizing it of course. I can think of one really good guy was secure who I had a thing with when I was pretty young, but the logistics didn't work and we were almost always long-distance, so it didn't become a relationship. The crazy thing I noticed though, was when we got closest to figuring out if we could be geographically closer and give things a try, I had an inexplicable and sneaking suspicion in the back of my head I'd get bored with him! And he really was great, and I was a little scared of that feeling because he wouldn't have deserved to be written off as boring if we had gotten to have a real relationship. My point from that example is, I totally get where you're coming from! (He's still great, and has a long-lasting marriage and kids.)
Once I actually earned secure, the type of people I'm attracted to completely changed, basically overnight. It was not something I expected, though always something I wondered about (how could I fix my picker and stop being attracted to bad matches? how do you change who you're attract to???). I wrote about this in one of my posts going into detail about earning secure, but I went from being attracted to guys with an "edge" to suddenly realizing that edge was instability and insecurity that I did not find cute anymore! I'm looking for someone who is emotionally available and stable, but also has interests and does things. Just, those things are no longer, playing hard to get and being evasive... things I might find more interesting now are like.... a passion for traveling or them having a job with work they are actually interested in or being up for wacky random or artistic local events sometimes. Basically, having a rich and full life they enjoy with some flexibility but with emotional grounding, and wanting to share that with a committed partner who also has the same. Additionally, I don't need someone else to entertain me or make me feel whole, so I feel responsibility for myself in regards to not getting bored.
My hypothesis on this is, when you're AP, the mental/emotional stimulation you are getting is from doing the work to "solve" the puzzle of your partner's avoidance and the challenges within your interaction. However, once you are close to earning secure, it means you feel comfortable with yourself, with others, with boundaries, with meeting most of your needs on your own and being a whole person. So, that kind of maturity, and someone's ability to balance independence with interdependence and not project all over you, becomes really attractive. It's not about stimulation through drama anymore, it's about calmness and really connecting with someone past the fantasy bond or superficial eggshell-walking level. That doesn't mean it's easy to find that person, and the number of people I'm attracted to who are also available at my age seems like it's diminished since this change happened. My problem right now seems to be that the number of people I was attracted to wasn't that big in the first place, since only ~25% of people are avoidant! But now that many secures at my age are married and I'm not attracted lately to insecures... the numbers game seems tough, but I also finally have full confidence in my picker abilities.
I realized I just addressed this same dating conundrum to you in my last post! Lol I was bored and not attracted to my ex-husband as well, but I tend to think he was more of a mild avoidant. He didn’t like to be emotionally close and was basically an island but without any severe shut downs. I never want to be with another partner I’m not physically attractive to w desire and great chemistry again. Otherwise, I’ll end up leaving again. |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2019 4:50:45 GMT
I realized I just addressed this same dating conundrum to you in my last post! Yep. So far, I haven't found secure older gentlemen, but I'm only 6 months out of losing my attraction for (and attracting) avoidants, so we've got time to see if it improves lol. |
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