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Post by single88 on Sept 14, 2019 9:50:26 GMT
Hello
My ex of 7 years and I broke up 4 months ago, only 3 months after getting engaged. The month before she was distant but that was nothing out of the ordinary.
We would seem to go through cycles in our relationship every 2 months where things would be good and then she would pull away and being the anxious type I would push harder. It would get to the point of a big row and me telling her this cannot go on and we needed to understand the problem better until she would beg me not to leave her (not that I ever said I would) and blame her behaviour on work, which I would accept (she has a stressful job). I realise now this was a massive red flag but I was committed.
She definitely has avoidant traits - she has a rocky relationship with her family and would let them treat me poorly and her but never call them on it. She was of the mindset there was no point rocking the boat. Her relationships with friends are superficial at best. Although this is where i question how avoidant she is as with friends and family she would make a lot of effort to please and put up with so much crap.
The month before we split she was so cold and to the point that 2 weeks before I had a bag packed to leave, I couldn't take it and didnt trust there was not someone else (she swore on my life there was not). But she begged me to stay and told me everything i needed to hear. Things seemed to get back on track and she made a lot more effort. Then only 2 weeks later we have a huge row after she goes on a night out and ghosts me the next day. I find out she was having an emotional affair with a co worker for a month and they had kissed that day.
I wanted to work on things but she told me I was not happy, I deserve better than her and that I did not love her enough (later saying I loved her too much and she deserved to be alone). Since the split I have moved away and we sold our flat. During the 4 months before I moved:
- she turned up to see me crying and upset and would spend whole weekends with me if she fell out with her friends she was staying with
- i did NC but she would turn up or message and made it hard for me to ignore
- she would tell me how much she loves me and misses but this is the right thing
- she says she doesnt know what she wants and makes it seem like she is confused about us and then says she still doesnt want to get back together
- she said we had a good relationship, i made her happy, did nothing wrong and we could have continued to be happy
- it recently came out that she thinks we are incompatible and romantic feelings for me have gone but she still finds me attractive and kissed me
I could go on, it has been a mess. She has started therapy recently and I hope it helps. Is there any chance she might return or is there anything I can do to create an emotional connection with an avoidant? Or am I getting this all wrong and she is not avoidant, just a secure person that lost feelings.
TL;TR: Ex of 7 years ends good relationship, are they avoidant and will they return/can i build a connection still?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2019 12:00:45 GMT
But why would you want her back?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2019 16:09:32 GMT
I think you deserve much better than this. Sounds like a really painful experience you have gone through.
You deserve an equal loving, mututal and respetful relationship with someone who can provide you with the same things.
I would advise you to work on and improve your self esteem via seeking therapy. Set clear boundaries with your ex.
It's your choice on whether you chose to return back to your ex. But I do think you deserve much better than what you've been through.
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Post by single88 on Sept 14, 2019 16:53:40 GMT
Thank you for your replies.
For me, I feel like I contributed to the loss of attraction and feel terribly guilty, like I left her no choice. I put on some weight and we were not as intimate in the last year as I know she wanted. She felt like we argued too much, although when I pushed her on this she could not tell me what arguments she was referring to. To me, it was nothing out of the ordinary. We never argued about money, goals, going out too much etc. It was all super silly things like her distance or usually her family.
I want her back because for me, love is a choice and I choose her. She was the one that proposed and wanted to push forward with booking a venue etc so I feel like I must be awful for her just to leave when she seemed so sure on our future together.
I have been to therapy since the split and my therapist helped me realise she made the choice to leave, that we could have worked on it if she wished. My therapist thought I was doing well considering but I might return.
The last time we saw each other she made me promise she would see me again even though I told her I couldn't be friends right now - she said she wants to be best friends and talk all the time! She was broken as I left and told me she still loved me as much but her feelings changed. But since when we have needed to talk re finances we shared she has been cold and distant. Polar opposite to how she was the last time I saw her.
Maybe in time i will realise i am wrong to want her back, it would be easier to walk away and find someone new. I just hope right now she will return.
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Post by stu on Sept 14, 2019 17:14:13 GMT
Thank you for your replies. For me, I feel like I contributed to the loss of attraction and feel terribly guilty, like I left her no choice. I put on some weight and we were not as intimate in the last year as I know she wanted. She felt like we argued too much, although when I pushed her on this she could not tell me what arguments she was referring to. To me, it was nothing out of the ordinary. We never argued about money, goals, going out too much etc. It was all super silly things like her distance or usually her family. I want her back because for me, love is a choice and I choose her. She was the one that proposed and wanted to push forward with booking a venue etc so I feel like I must be awful for her just to leave when she seemed so sure on our future together. I have been to therapy since the split and my therapist helped me realise she made the choice to leave, that we could have worked on it if she wished. My therapist thought I was doing well considering but I might return. The last time we saw each other she made me promise she would see me again even though I told her I couldn't be friends right now - she said she wants to be best friends and talk all the time! She was broken as I left and told me she still loved me as much but her feelings changed. But since when we have needed to talk re finances we shared she has been cold and distant. Polar opposite to how she was the last time I saw her. Maybe in time i will realise i am wrong to want her back, it would be easier to walk away and find someone new. I just hope right now she will return. She cheated on you and from everything you said it sounds like although you might have some of your own things go on, we are human no one is perfect. The bigger issues going on are from her. you are blaming yourself but in all honesty none of this is your fault. This girl is not relationship material. In the least not right now, you definitely don't want to get married and then have an even worse situation down the road. I would be very careful dude, and take some serious space from what's going on and this person to clear your head and make sure you feel out the whole picture. |
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Post by alexandra on Sept 14, 2019 19:07:19 GMT
single88, you're not misreading that she's a mature person who lost attraction, that's just the negative narrative you're telling yourself because you feel kicked in the gut. When you're dating a secure, you don't get blindsided... even if the issues are actually your "fault." You just don't, because they communicate about emotional things... they don't propose after 7 years only to quickly lose interest and have an emotional affair. What I think actually happened was she wasn't feeling what she felt she "should" because she likely has her own attachment issues, and you were inadvertently triggering her anxiety when you were calling her out on her distancing. Plus, you'd both already invested 7 years. So, to keep you around and convince herself her feelings of ambivalence would go away if she ignored them, she pushed you guys forward. And it didn't fix the problems, because the core problems are with ambivalence about herself (not you) and maybe with her inability to communicate her needs with you (you weren't perfect, maybe you let yourself go, but fine... a secure and committed partner discusses that with you and doesn't run off while you're engaged to have an emotional affair). When having the label "engaged" didn't make her feel closer to you, because that's her trying to make external changes instead of internal, she didn't introspect and she shut down instead, seeking external validation to feel better while not wanting to tell you how she felt (and probably not understanding it herself) -- hence, the cheating. I may be wrong, as I don't know her or you, but at the very least this isn't your fault as she handled conflict in an immature and garbage way. That's an insurmountable incompatibility unless she is motivated to do more work on herself than you deserve to have to wait for. It would make a terribly unstable life partnership for you, so I know, I know how much you still want her back because I've been there... but now you need to focus on yourself and mind your side of this and not obsess over her. Easier said than done. However, the best response here is for you to ask yourself if there was always a layer of distance and instability between you two, and yet you stayed anyway because you were compromising your own needs. That may take some time and perspective on your end to figure out. If that was the case, why did you stay -- are you secure or AP or anxious-leaning FA? A great way to figure this out is go totally no contact with her for a few months, and if you can also continue therapy during that time, all the better. But I suggest a few months because you're going to have a skewed perspective until your anxiety and grief and shock over the breakup calms down in your body physically and those tight bonds loosen enough that you don't feel like you're going through withdrawal. Don't let her stay over when she's fighting with friends. Don't let her manipulate you or give you hope until she's proven she's doing a damn lot of work and she's doing it FOR HERSELF, not for you, or the changes won't stick and the relationship cycle will repeat. I'm not saying never talk to her again, as that's a big step to decide right now, but tell her you need time and full-on block her so you can focus on your side of this without her triggering you further with her games of orbiting you. You can't get anywhere with this if you're not healing first. But don't wallow in guilt and blame and your negative narrative here. Even if you weren't perfect, you didn't force her to cheat on you and leave. You can be incompatible but still communicate with respect about it and not bandage it with avoidance and cheating, which it sounds like at least you'd been trying to do on your side.
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Post by alexandra on Sept 14, 2019 19:20:53 GMT
"Although this is where i question how avoidant she is as with friends and family she would make a lot of effort to please and put up with so much crap."
While it's more important to focus on yourself at this point as I just said, for me it helped to understand what was going on within the dynamic of the failed relationship as well so I'm going to add... people-pleasing is a common fearful avoidant attachment trait, because the person doesn't feel they're enough on their own to receive love and are trying to keep people around in ways they know how as they're unable to communicate their needs. Often, they grew up around family who was insecure/unstable and indeed wouldn't have received the proper love and respect a person deserves, so it was a survival defense mechanism that developed, but screws up healthy adult relationships.
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Post by serenity on Sept 14, 2019 21:33:26 GMT
Those last 4 months sounded so very painful, the way she held on to you and sent mixed messages while starting a new relationship, losing your home, and ending your new engagement  So much chaos and grief to go through, and all the harder when you've loved someone difficult for 7 years. Are you doing okay? How is your self care going? |
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Post by single88 on Sept 14, 2019 23:39:59 GMT
Stu - Thank you for your reply. I agree she could and should not be in a relationship with anyone right now, least of all me. It would not be healthy and I am almost thankful she didnt come back straight away as I have more insight than I did in those early days.
Alexandra - Thank you for your thought out reply, I really appreciate the time you took to write that out. Since the split I have found myself thinking the engagement was just a cover up for how she was truly feeling but you articulated it in a really insightful way that has helped me in a big way. I did ask her about the proposal and why she did it and she said 'she wanted me to come back' - no idea on where I went but it felt like she was putting blame on me. She was so excited and talking over with my friends and family first, I wish more than anything she had never proposed. Unfortunately the timing of the engagement sucked as she was in the process of losing her job and there was so much uncertainty about her future employment that the engagement took a back seat to everything else. Then we had the concern of the financial implications of a wedding. We had no opportunity to just be and enjoy the prospect of a wedding.
I know I need to stop over analysing, when I think logically I know this isn't my fault but it is so easy to blame myself because if I could pin point it on something I did I could fix it. I even said this to her and she agreed that she wished it was that simple and I told her it could be and she said maybe some day. It feels like she has convinced herself this is the right thing for me and she is doing me a favour. I am trying to cut the obsessing, I've deleted her off social media and her number off my phone so if we have contact it's only if she initiates.
When I look back on our relationship now, I can see that there were plenty of red flags. We had talked about marriage previously earlier on and she shut down completely. Marriage wasn't overly important for me so we worked through it. Every time we fought she would shut down and not talk it out. I was always on her schedule and when I didnt like something I always tried to communicate this in a respectful way but she never seemed to take it on board. I pretty much ran our lives and wanted input but she gave little to none. At times I felt desperate for attention and other times she was so opposite and needy. So yeah, I compromised but I was happy with what I had and didn't think I wanted more.
I have moved away and as I said, have no means of contacting her easily so I'm trying to get that distance. But it is terribly hard not to turn up at her door asking her to reconsider. I will continue therapy too as it did help. She has started therapy herself but it is early days.
I am trying to keep busy and I've started going to the gym too, which has improved my confidence as I feel and look better now. I agree she could have talked to me, there was not a lot I would not have been prepared to work through but she didnt. And to be honest, I wouldn't treat someone I hate how she did so being her friend is not an option for me right now.
How you described why avoidants people please is spot on with my ex. Her family dynamic is very strained and she has a lot of people in her life she is close to but don't know much about her. She even told me I am the person that knows her best and I dont think that is going to change. I feel sorry for her, which is why I've bent so much to take care of through the break up despite her reiterating she knows this is the right thing time and time again. I wonder if I am crazy for having any hope, she just seems so miserable.
Serenity - Thanks for the kind words. Its not been at all easy. Im having more better days but she is still on my mind almost constantly and the anxiety hits at least a couple times a day. I think I just feel overwhelmingly tired but can't sleep. Its definitely taken a toll. I was devastated to lose my house, she was reluctant to sell but there seemed no point delaying things. I have been doing little things to improve my situation where I can with silly things like a wardrobe change and haircut. But it helps.
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Post by serenity on Sept 15, 2019 0:14:07 GMT
Single88 , I was wondering, do you need to be in contact with her for any reason? Some people find that they start to heal quicker if they block their ex, and now you've moved away it would be harder for her to turn up. Its a hard thing to do; it can make the pain of abandonment worse for a little bit, make you feel like crying. But its something pro-active you can do to put an stop to the `will she come back' feelings that cause so much of the anxiety. Just a thought anyway.
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Post by stu on Sept 15, 2019 1:15:58 GMT
single88 after seeing more of what you mentioned dude you are extremely lucky you broke up now and did not end up getting married, or having kids together. I know you are trying to find faults in yourself to fix what was broke in your relationship. But right now you are feeling bad about yourself and trying to find things wrong with you to blame for it not working out. The truth is this was never going to workout no matter what you did, even if you were in every way perfect. This person is not addressing their own issues and no matter who they were with. If they weren't actively working on it and getting help, and making changes. The same exact thing would have happened to them too. Of course losing someone you were with for 7 years sucks and is going to be incredibly difficult to process the loss and grief. But it sounds like you are doing all the right things. I hope you know in time that there is nothing you needed to do different for your previous relationship. And although you're hurting now. You are going to be so much better off in the long term. Imagine once you find someone who is healthy and extremely compatible with you. You'll be stoked beyond belief. Work on yourself as much as you need to boost your self esteem, self respect, and boundaries, so you dont have to get into a less then absolutely fulfilling and happy relationship for yourself. Because you deserve nothing less.
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Post by single88 on Sept 16, 2019 12:34:20 GMT
Serenity - We are finishing up some financial loose ends but other than that, no. We dont need to be in contact. I suppose I held back from blocking because I hoped for reconciliation but I know she is never going to have a change of heart so maybe I need to be brave.
Stu - I know you are right, I have taken so much blame for this and has a result have allowed her to take advantage of me time and time again in the months leading after the break up. If i really think about she has behaved, it makes me sick. She even messaged today to tell me what a good weekend she had, like she deserves it. I dont think she has any idea on what she has done to me and never will.
I will continue to work on myself. Thank you for your kind words, I really hope I get the opportunity to meet someone new. And to be honest I would probably not do too much different in my next relationship, a few tweaks maybe but at least that shows I learnt something.
I honestly thought one day we could be friends but I really do not want someone like her in my life. I got her to exactly where she wanted to be and she disposed of me in a cruel and calculated way. I deserved so much more respect and decency. I cant believe i got it so wrong.
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Post by dhali on Sept 16, 2019 15:18:58 GMT
“When dating a secure, you don’t get blindsighted “
Brilliant!
I’m sorry you’re going through this, and this is going to be tough to hear and probably even more difficult to internalize, but you can’t have a healthy relationship with an avoidant. It’s like the scorpion and the frog fable. Don’t give the scorpion a ride across the river. It’s a scorpion afterall.
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Post by single88 on Sept 16, 2019 16:04:57 GMT
“When dating a secure, you don’t get blindsighted “ Brilliant! I’m sorry you’re going through this, and this is going to be tough to hear and probably even more difficult to internalize, but you can’t have a healthy relationship with an avoidant. It’s like the scorpion and the frog fable. Don’t give the scorpion a ride across the river. It’s a scorpion afterall. I am starting to see that. I just can't believe she continues to play the victim and appears to have little to no self awareness on how badly she hurt me. I know she should be further along in the healing process and its not that I want her pity. I just find it so hard to get my head round her never having regrets, never wishing for a second chance like I do. Good analogy! |
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Post by alexandra on Sept 16, 2019 16:31:25 GMT
single88, she may very well have regrets, but they may be extremely delayed. Even if she doesn't, don't feel bad about that. Hurt people hurt people in these sorts of ways, and it doesn't sound easy or comfortable to be her. The amount of pain and disconnection from yourself involved in acting that erratic reflects a troubled person that I wouldn't want to trade places with. You've started with some therapy, you're confronting this head-on within yourself -- you're going to get through this and find a better path more quickly in the long run while she's going to repeat and repeat until she stops to figure this out. You're showing tremendous strength in pursuing personal growth as you're coping with this. You deserve better, and it may seem like a long way off as you mourn, but if you keep going you're going to find it.
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So much chaos and grief to go through, and all the harder when you've loved someone difficult for 7 years. Are you doing okay? How is your self care going?