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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 10, 2020 21:24:56 GMT
"Basically like the person doesn't want to react via fight or flight because maybe they don't know if they're correct in their assumption — so they just freeze?" I think this talk explains it very well: youtu.be/br8-qebjIgsHe compares it to traffic lights: Green is normal state Yellow is fight or flight Red is freeze. Like animals can behave, when they are scared, but can't attack or run away, they play dead. My ex had a fully dissociative freeze response after a period of 6 weeks no contact. Literally walked in a pub, I was standing inside the door at a table and she literally froze in place for over 10 seconds. |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2020 22:16:28 GMT
But to clarify, though I know the phrase is colloquial, they don’t play dead. It just happens. It’s not a choice. It’s a survival instinct. I’m going to keep saying this as I parse it out in myself. Not all actions that look like all the things we are discussing are due to the subconscious. Some are very clear choices made by a person and their preferences, and they may blame some other reason, not be honest with you about it or just not communicate. mrob has discussed cohabitation being a deal breaker. I definitely need time and space (especially space) to myself. This has nothing to do with attachment theory. I’m not dissociating or deactivating or distancing. It’s just what I know I want and need. Totally agree. You can't use attachment theory to excuse every little thing, and shouldn't use it to put up with and normalize behavior you find unacceptable. My LTR FA ex, overall, would (rarely) get all out triggered and freeze and then flee from a certain type of serious conflict (only when it involved major changes in our level of intimacy, getting too close for him or having a break-up level discussion), would not-consciously deactivate --> nitpick when he began to get overwhelmed by our closeness, and was terrible about communicating and would often get passive aggressive when unable to state his needs. This was all FA stuff. But he'd also told me that when he was younger, he was the flakiest person going and would constantly bail on plans, stand people up, whatever. He's not that way with me, but I asked him why he'd do it, and he basically said something along the lines of it being because he was immature but that it was also fun (I suspect he meant it gave him a level of perceived control and also he'd bail if a more fun offer came along). That maybe had some FA roots, but overall it was just him being a jerk, and him even being aware he was being a jerk and choosing it anyway. It's important to have empathy but not treat someone like a child just because they're knee-deep in whichever insecure attachment style they have. |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 10, 2020 22:28:46 GMT
"Basically like the person doesn't want to react via fight or flight because maybe they don't know if they're correct in their assumption — so they just freeze?" I think this talk explains it very well: youtu.be/br8-qebjIgsHe compares it to traffic lights: Green is normal state Yellow is fight or flight Red is freeze. Like animals can behave, when they are scared, but can't attack or run away, they play dead. I have heard this and it makes sense. But to clarify, though I know the phrase is colloquial, they don’t play dead. It just happens. It’s not a choice. It’s a survival instinct. I’m going to keep saying this as I parse it out in myself. Not all actions that look like all the things we are discussing are due to the subconscious. Some are very clear choices made by a person and their preferences, and they may blame some other reason, not be honest with you about it or just not communicate. mrob has discussed cohabitation being a deal breaker. I definitely need time and space (especially space) to myself. This has nothing to do with attachment theory. I’m not dissociating or deactivating or distancing. It’s just what I know I want and need. Agree generally that attachment theory does not explain all actions. However in relation to cohabitation and LDR, I know for as fact, my ex. with her LDR guy of 15 months, when he postulated moving in together, game over, he pulled the pin, as she was unwilling after 15 months. What that potentially shows is two things. 1. It was potentially a fantasy bond to her (she still has pics of him up to this day and idolizes even though he's totally moved on) because it suited her avoidance of intimacy, and from afar it literally does inspire the classical fantasizing instead of proper intimate interactions? 2. Poor communication, which she has, I would talk about such things between the 1-3 month mark approximately, early to ascertain the persons requirements, interests and boundaries. So, it literally could be tieing into Mrobs attachment style, but is subconscious. Just some thoughts to consider |
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 10, 2020 22:29:22 GMT
But to clarify, though I know the phrase is colloquial, they don’t play dead. It just happens. It’s not a choice. It’s a survival instinct. I’m going to keep saying this as I parse it out in myself. Not all actions that look like all the things we are discussing are due to the subconscious. Some are very clear choices made by a person and their preferences, and they may blame some other reason, not be honest with you about it or just not communicate. mrob has discussed cohabitation being a deal breaker. I definitely need time and space (especially space) to myself. This has nothing to do with attachment theory. I’m not dissociating or deactivating or distancing. It’s just what I know I want and need. Totally agree. You can't use attachment theory to excuse every little thing, and shouldn't use it to put up with and normalize behavior you find unacceptable. My LTR FA ex, overall, would (rarely) get all out triggered and freeze and then flee from a certain type of serious conflict (only when it involved major changes in our level of intimacy, getting too close for him or having a break-up level discussion), would not-consciously deactivate --> nitpick when he began to get overwhelmed by our closeness, and was terrible about communicating and would often get passive aggressive when unable to state his needs. This was all FA stuff. But he'd also told me that when he was younger, he was the flakiest person going and would constantly bail on plans, stand people up, whatever. He's not that way with me, but I asked him why he'd do it, and he basically said something along the lines of it being because he was immature but that it was also fun (I suspect he meant it gave him a level of perceived control and also he'd bail if a more fun offer came along). That maybe had some FA roots, but overall it was just him being a jerk, and him even being aware he was being a jerk and choosing it anyway. It's important to have empathy but not treat someone like a child just because they're knee-deep in whichever insecure attachment style they have. So if they're being a jerk and know that, do they care that they look like a jerk to others? Or is the perceived control more important than how others view them, even if in a negative light? |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2020 23:19:23 GMT
nyc718 caro, I think it's an issue of ask forgiveness not permission. He wanted to be a jerk because he wanted to get away with being selfish, but he also wants everyone to like him and not think he's a jerk because FA have low self esteem and need external validation. And it's possible they aren't aware they're making decisions like that due to some underlying basis of social anxiety or not wanting to own up to massive disorganization or something... but in that specific example, he chose to stop acting that way several years ago and has certainly not healed his FA, so I think it is more related to selfishness vs. making a decision to try to be a better person by choosing to treat others better in an area that isn't a pre-programmed nervous system reflex. Come to think of it, a suspected FA I dated many many years ago, who I had a horribly toxic yet highly charged physical relationship with, once told me he knew he was a jerk in general and that I could see he was treating me badly (and felt guilty yet also wouldn't change his behavior)... but he really hoped I wouldn't tell my best friends, his work colleagues, that he was actually not a good person. Because he didn't want anyone at work to know that about him... he seemed to think he had a very affable career-persona going on. Smh.
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Post by alexandra on Jan 10, 2020 23:25:51 GMT
caro, I also think your situation is different because your guy suffers from depression.
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Post by Helsbells on Jan 11, 2020 12:48:22 GMT
caro, I also think your situation is different because your guy suffers from depression. Well now I’m going to sound like the jerk. But having depression, knowing you have depression, and doing nothing about it while letting your actions affect others isn’t really an excuse either. I feel bad for the person but I can’t take on their depression. My FA was on meds and faced emotional (possibly physical) abuse as a child and also had a trauma in the past year. But he had a reason for not trying every suggestion I made. And I only made them when he came to me telling me he was so sad and had abandonment issues etc. Of course I listened and empathized and said genuinely nice things that I felt about him and often nothing else. But it started to become the same violin playing over and over so I’d ask if he considered therapy etc so he didn’t feel so bad. I suspect he enjoyed the control. That I admitted to really caring for him and he could maintain control by being cold. And it’s absolutely rooted in insecurity but I saw no signs of dissociation or deactivation. It wasn’t his nervous system (though I did see the anxiety a couple of times). He felt good having that control. Meanwhile the emotions he dumped on me and his pulling away made me depressed. He wanted me to feel bad for him. Emphasis: He wanted me to feel bad. He cut me off when I stopped this process. This isn’t the first time he’s done this. After awhile, you notice your pattern. He apologized. But only when he was triggered and felt alone and needed my empathy. When he felt good, he had room to not be considerate of me. Again rooted in insecurity but he was definitely making choices. Very in the moment choices. As anyone with unstable emotions tends fo do. My guy was a jerk. I know not every person with insecure attachment is, but it’s hard to tell under the emotions (both parties). But I learned a lesson not to excuse this behavior. I’ve known people with depression who love me and others. They screw up a lot. But I can tell they keep trying. I think when you’re not *hoping* is when you have a better understanding. If you’re hoping he or she is not a jerk, they probably are. I got a lot out of this @janedoe I think mine has jerked alot of women around in his time. He told me has slept with hundreds off women sometimes up to 3 in one day in his younger days, nice. But he has truly been broken by the few hes really loved, " they appeared to be flirty and more toxic and triggered him anxious". My experience with him ticks almost every FA box with a bit of selfish jerk thrown in for good measure. Meeting him was very bad timing for me and I understand why I attracted him into my life. There is no blame here, I am saddened as I really care for him but like what your serenity prayers says "courage to change the things I can". ME. |
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Post by addict on Jan 13, 2020 20:58:29 GMT
mrob , I really don't get it. Maybe the problem is several professionals don't truly get attachment theory either? I once told someone about it because they were wildly confused by a very serious LTR ex (just in retrospect / baggage, never looking to rekindle with her, and she'd cycled and tried and he rejected), and I was like oh... do you know what FA is? He said wow, that all sounds really accurate about my ex and explains so much, I want to look more into this, I'm going to ask my sibling who is a psychologist (more on the research side than treating people side). Well, that sibling basically told him ehhh attachment theory, we don't really pay much attention to that because it's not proved out as well and may as well be Meyers-Briggs (the 16 types of personalities model which is widely considered about as professional as a horoscope). I think that really erased his confidence in it. Comparing attachment theory to Meyers-Briggs was, to me, deeply disturbing! Myers Briggs is not a horoscope!! Anyone who has ever said that to me does not know very much about it. Horoscopes tell you who you are and predict your future based on when you were born and the stars. Myers Briggs assesses your pattens and categorizes you as a type essentially saying, this type tends to have those same patterns. It’s taking who you already are and labeling it. It’s ONE system. That’s all it is. I would say you can compare it because you note the patterns of behaviors associated with certain types of trauma usually as a child. If you do xyz, that pattern fits X attachment style. I’d say the difference is that one is merely personality, in general as a healthy person (though if you know your personality, it helps you understand when and why you are in an unhealthy place), and one is actually accounting for dysfunctional behavior. Isn’t attachment theory more recent? In the last 20 years? I had thought maybe that’s why it isn’t as well known. Psychology is soft science anyway. It’s harder to measure. How spooky, I was reading an article about Meyers Briggs personality types yesterday! As soon as I read them I knew I was an IFNJ... It was me to a T... Interesting stuff 😊 |
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 21, 2020 19:19:33 GMT
I’ve been pretty busy lately, but wanted to write a quick update: Things are going pretty well. After the initial holiday meet ups, I was feeling pretty anxious - as you all saw. I was afraid he was going to run, and I could feel him pull back after those two super intimate times. Although he was always responding, and it seemed like he was pushing through. During those 1.5 - 2 weeks of what I thought was pull back, I did text some, ask him to hang, but I didn’t push. I put my open schedule days and an invite out there, but wasn’t going to put pressure in my mind or outwardly. It was at that point, and through a ton of AP work (see my posts on auto regulation if you’re interested) those couple of days that I felt a shift happen (with me and seems with him). It took me a couple of days after realizing the auto regulation thing (then followed by a podcast in belonging that set me into a tailspin) to really process the pain and settle back down. But during or after (I can’t totally tell cause I was so up in arms on my own stuff), that’s when the shift happened. I haven’t fully processed it yet in the terms of understanding it, but overall I feel much calmer about the relationship. For the past week and a half (+) I’ve “let him” (I hate this wording but I don’t know how else to describe it) lead, and he’s reached out basically every day. Even scheduling dates (“proper” ones even lol), asking preferences, etc. Once whatever shift happened (before he started reaching out unprompted), I didn’t feel this overwhelming anxiety of “I have to do something about this!” It’s not “holding back” or not getting my needs met, my needs are met and I also feel good that I’ve been turning inward a lot and working on me. Now we’ve been talking more normally, taking it slow, but gentle I guess is a good word to describe it. At the end of last week on the day of a date with him, some crap happened in other areas of my life and set me into a tailspin hours before the date (which you can also read about in the auto regulation post). That sucked, but I fought through it (with the help of everyone here!) and went to meet him anyways. I was “off” like 100% off... I wasn’t crying or anything, but I just couldn’t really form conversation well and I do a lot of the leading of that usually. He noticed, was sweet about it in mostly non-verbal ways like hugs, squeezing my hand, holding me, etc (I wasn’t needing to talk about it or anything dramatic etc just off), and we just relaxed. When I was triggered earlier that day for those couple of hours, I was so worried he’d see me “off” and “not like me” but at the end of it all, I felt good just being comfortable enough all around to even show up like that and be real, and still accepted. It was a good lesson for me I guess. (And I was fine the next day) So, I’m still being cautious, going slow, and hoping he’ll keep being consistent and work on himself just as I’m planning to keep up my work and have been better about things like exercise (which totally helps my anxiety) and stuff. I haven’t had any more conversations on depression, us, etc because I haven’t really felt the huge need yet and there’s been no appropriate opportunity where it’d need to come in. I guess what I find the best part of this is I don’t feel this rushed need anymore. I feel truly comfortable taking it slow. For me, with him, this and how aware I’ve become of how AP rocks my entire boat (not just romantically) so annoyingly at times, feels like progress for now. I know I’ll get triggered many times again - it’s not like I took some magic pill to cure me, but I figured I’d write on the non-triggered side while that side has been being more present. So much thanks to everyone here, you all have been so amazing and I’m thankful to have you all. I am so happy for you that out of all the challenges you have faced with this relationship that you have found some growth in yourself. That's huge! I personally haven't done a lot of growth while in a relationship, but when they have ended and I am not in them, I have had the mental clarity and focus to see a lot from a distance. I continue to wish you the best for this and in the other areas of your life that you are applying your new wisdom to :-) |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 30, 2020 0:15:26 GMT
Well I might be overreacting, but I'm feeling like he's going to go MIA again. In preparation, I'm trying to wrap my head around the whole him asking me to be his girlfriend, two great big holidays, weeks of him reaching out first etc, then him shutting down. I'm guessing he was triggered because I invited him to my friend's party if he wanted to stop by with me — but I only put it out there, I didn't even care if he went, etc. No question even just a general here's what's up. That was Saturday. I didn't follow up or anything, I figured if he wanted to meet up, he would, if not, he wouldn't, no big deal. A couple of hours ago I sent something super light, causal — but if I don't hear back, I'm guessing this is him deactivating for good. Maybe I'm just paranoid. I was planning to have a calm, better, totally sober conversation next time we hung out. It's frustrating because I don't even need to hang out all the time or talk all the time, but it feels weird to go 4 days without talking to someone who ask to be your boyfriend. I think I've been way more secure this time around — which yay process — no eggshells, no pushing, etc. I don't know. Just realise, that you in effect are "walking on eggshells", not directly around statements which can also happen as an F-A adversely reacts with the hypervigilance, but you are trying to anticipate and normalise patterns of his every movement based on he being F-A attachment and you fitting into that pattern. And I'll just say, you can't do that, reason being, it's called "disorganised attachment" for a reason. And reactions and timing is all over the shop basically, regardless of what you do. He could be dealing with something totally outside you emotionally recently, which upsets and overwhelms, on top of the old trauma, and you trying to project your feelings/emotions. It's great you are taking/trying to take responsibility for how you are showing up, fantastic, and maybe you can view it positively and say to yourself "well maybe it's why I was meant to meet him, to grow myself from the whole experience", which you are doing, so take comfort and solace in that, because that, is worth more than anything. Being A-P, or being anxious generally around an F-A, will trigger moreso, no doubts about it, that wont be helping the cause, and it's difficult because of the perceived rejection from the F-A and their demeanour/movements/actions. |
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Post by iz42 on Jan 30, 2020 1:14:26 GMT
I guess it's the vaporizing when I tried to escalate thing mrob mentioned earlier. Which was really just me keeping it going but I see how meeting the friends so soon would've been too much even in a normal situation, I just didn't even think about it. It's stupid because like I said, I didn't even care if he went. What makes you think it would be too soon for him to meet your friends under normal circumstances? If he's your boyfriend, that seems like a fairly normal thing to do (especially in casual way like briefly stopping by a party). I don't think you did anything wrong by asking him! |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Jan 30, 2020 2:11:51 GMT
Just realise, that you in effect are "walking on eggshells", not directly around statements which can also happen as an F-A adversely reacts with the hypervigilance, but you are trying to anticipate and normalise patterns of his every movement based on he being F-A attachment and you fitting into that pattern. And I'll just say, you can't do that, reason being, it's called "disorganised attachment" for a reason. And reactions and timing is all over the shop basically, regardless of what you do. He could be dealing with something totally outside you emotionally recently, which upsets and overwhelms, on top of the old trauma, and you trying to project your feelings/emotions. It's great you are taking/trying to take responsibility for how you are showing up, fantastic, and maybe you can view it positively and say to yourself "well maybe it's why I was meant to meet him, to grow myself from the whole experience", which you are doing, so take comfort and solace in that, because that, is worth more than anything. Being A-P, or being anxious generally around an F-A, will trigger moreso, no doubts about it, that wont be helping the cause, and it's difficult because of the perceived rejection from the F-A and their demeanour/movements/actions. Ok I’m thinking more about this - and clearly I’m in a triggered state - UGH I’m sorry - but I think I see what you mean - basically I was walking on eggshells by giving space because I sensed space because he didn’t response - but I was assuming this cause I think he’s FA - so I didn’t text for days? But if someone needs space isn’t it ok to give it to them? Or is the problem is I was assuming not asking directly? If so, I get this. But this is where the AP / eggshells line and just being normal / secure gets me - no idea what the secure things is to do here. Just trying to understand so I don’t walk on eggshells! So he probably picked up on that because he’s hyper vigilant (which he’s admitted he is) and that made me more pull away? Little confused by “ that you in effect are "walking on eggshells", not directly around statements which can also happen as an F-A adversely reacts with the hypervigilance“ It's ok Caroline, no need to apologise, I know it's tough on all parties (including your boyfriend and maybe what he's going through). And I know you love him and see potential, I did too. You're "walking on eggshells" by overanalysing/worrying excessively that anything you say may be enough to just push him over the linein anyway and ruin the relationship/what your boyfriend maybe doing to try and get a certain result at the end. You're literally bending over backwards to accommodate him at your cost. You would really have liked to spend time with him at a party this coming weekend (which isn't too much to ask at all, considering you have really watched what you have said, you've known him a longer time from the previous relationship, and seemingly have not text spammed him in between your last meeting, you've really kept yourself at bay, on top of your natural A-P leanings from what you have said. So kudos to you for the effort). That is the "walking on eggshells" part. You're making massive effort for a result, he's seemingly withdrawn and making no effort (but in reality, he MAY be struggling, highly likely if he is truly F-A attachment style, but not 100% guaranteed like anything in life). Bottom line is you are not getting what you want from the relationship, and you are putting in a massive amount of extra effort behind the scenes he doesnt even know about, it's draining, you must feel drained surely? I know I did, doing something remotely similar for a time, and not knowing anything about F-A attachment, I genuinely believed my ex. when she blamed her health issue/s. I'm telling you, I was triggered anxious from my ex. She went really hypervigilant on everything I said in her push-pull cycle, and I was literally concerned something I said would trigger her. As an example I made a joke about one of the great nights we spent together and had a few too many drinks, she had laughed about that before, and continually links and/or partakes in drinking wine memes with our mutual friends, but triggered on that statement, which was interesting to say the least. One of quite a few hypervigilant statements she brought up, as a rough example. |
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Post by dhali on Jan 30, 2020 6:10:17 GMT
Caroline- I’m sorry you’re going through this. This sounds emotionally draining and painful. I understand and hear your question of- what would a secure person do? I do think the answer is easier to come to than you think, it’s just not the answer you want to hear, or are potentially not ready to hear. I know that had been me in the past.
A secure person would ask for the need (go to the party). Understanding the answer is no, and never consider it again. That is, unless it’s a pattern of behavior. In which case, the secure would initiate a conversation expressing disappointment and how the relationship needs to change. If things don’t change, they then walk away. Self respect is shown. I know it’s scary to have self respect..: I’ve been there.
This is a place where fake it till you make it works. Talk to yourself- you’re a high value person. Everyone likes you. You’re fun to be around. Walk with a, I’m the best, strut. Smile at everyone. Make your interactions with service people, their best interactions of the day. Drop compliments liberally. Notice 5 people’s eye color every day.
Keep that up, and this guy won’t recognize you. In a very good way. Because you won’t be dealing with his crap. Very non-ap
Bonus:
-make eye contact with 3 people. Don’t be the first to break it.
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Post by kranichangel on Jan 30, 2020 7:26:01 GMT
To me, what a secure would / might do (or what I personally would do) is this:
I would really look within myself, focus on myself and my needs and ask myself these questions:
- is this enough for me? (enough communication, enough contact, enough security etc.)
- does this feel healthy, good and fulfilling to me (versus draining, unstable and shaky for example)
- will this be fulfilling and enough for me if this is all this (our connection) is ever going to be? Or am I holding on hoping the other person might still change and "come around"?
- Am I feeling mostly secure, stable and happy in this connection, OR is it some happy, love-filled moments and get-togethers every now and then but my baseline feelings are insecure, jumpy, not truly getting my needs and wants met by this connection but I hold on because some moments of bliss feel better than nothing at all from and with this person? Perhaps I fear that some moments of joy are all its ever gonna be for me, so I settle out of fear that I would otherwise end up empty handed and alone... a spinster ;-)
To me, the main thing was to become fully and shamelessly aware of my wants and needs for a relationship - not with any specific person in mind, because that would make me subconsciously tweak my expectations and needs to try and fit with how the specific person shows up for me. Also to realise that owning and honouring my expectations and needs for a romantic connection does not mean I don't love a certain person any longer because he or she may not be able and /or willing to fulfil those - I can still love them and at the same time be truthful about the fact that what they offer, just doesn't fit with what I want and need. Perhaps for someone else, it would fit - but not for me. I don't need to make neither them, nor me the "bad guy" for that simple fact. That way, I also don't need to work so hard on either trying to change myself to fit in with their (perceived) needs, nor do I feel the need to hope they will change - I see them as they are, I can love them as they are and recognise that they are not relationship-material for me (or / and I for them).
This is what i have realised and worked on the past two years and honestly, it feels so good and freeing to feel "me" more, and become aware of my true wants and needs which I think I have suppressed for a long time out of a fear of letting go. And I needed to let go to start to find myself again and FEEL myself again. I used to wonder what my true wants and needs were, and I was so focussed on a specific person that I just did not even have the capacity to truly FEEL those needs and be aware of them. It was kind of a mix of some of my wants and needs, mixed with what I THOUGHT the other person's wants and needs were, plus a whole lot of over compensating and being always understanding and calm (on the outside) to try and keep a harmony.
Hope this is in some ways helpful or offers some ideas :-) all the best to you
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 30, 2020 14:19:09 GMT
It was not my intent to call you out. I wanted to help you by offering you another perspective. I think when anyone is unhealthy and unhealed and emotionally or mentally injured, the first thing we do is assume it is us, when many times it isn't. So thinking it is him running from you... Also, re: eggshells. If you're certain of that, I won't question you on it. That is my impression by how much you're concerned about what he thinks, what you do, how your actions may affect him. Of course, you have a safe place on here to discuss and rant, etc. but that still won't help, really, in the long run, if you aren't able to change your perspective and heal. Your thoughts and perspectives on his actions will just wound you over and over. And if you're focused on him, you're not focused on healing yourself. What a great thing it would be, if you could take his time of space and just do some things for yourself without thinking about him. I mean call out in a good way  like it’s actually helpful! The other perspective is helpful as I was in an AP state, and it helped calm me down! With the eggshells thing, I might have to a small extent by texting some casual vs. why haven’t I heard from you? But I didn’t feel the need to do the latter. I’m sure it’s hard for you guys to believe, but I’m super direct with him in person and then and otherwise I don’t exhibit typical AP behavior - my problem is that it’s often internal, but never showing. I’ve worked hard to be direct with him and much better than last year, but I do still have trouble with what’s secure and what’s not. For example, if someone doesn’t text a secure for 4 days then ignores a light basic text... what does a secure do? I’m very much trying to not think about him, trust me if it were just as easy as not thinking about him I would’ve already done it. I’ve spent more time at the gym, enrolled in career advancement activities, etc etc over the past month. I’m trying very hard to work on myself and learn how to be secure. I think that even if you are being direct with him in person and aren't otherwise exhibiting typical AP behavior, he is still responding in a FA manner. So even though you are 'acting' secure, you're allowing him to respond in a way that a secure person wouldn't allow. So there's a lot that's unsaid but very much still being communicated. A secure person would say, this just isn't working for me. My needs aren't being met. Things need to change because we can't go any further because the lack of connection isn't allowing us to grow as a couple. This relationship dynamic isn't going to ever change if it's forever going to be enabled. If you are worried about what to text him after not hearing from him for days, it's definitely walking on eggshells. To me it's just inconsiderate to not respond to someone you are in a relationship with. If you aren't responding for days when you know that your partner desires normal connection, then you shouldn't be in a relationship. You shouldn't get the benefits of a relationship if you can't offer it back. These are all things I had to think about with ending my relationship with me ex. It simply wasn't enough for me. If I can't tell someone that I love them any time I want to, and I can't have them tell me freely that they love me, backed up with actions, then that's all I need to know that it's not the relationship for me. I tell my son every day that I love him and I make sure to have some kind of physical touch, whether it's rubbing his back or just lightly touching his head (he's a teen now, so the all out hugs and cuddles aren't as common as they used to be) but I also need this in a relationship and I won't ever settle for less again. It was soul crushing to me, even though I know he loved me. His inability to not verbalize it to me is something that I could no longer tolerate. He needs to work on it for himself. No amount of space, patience, anything on my part could, or should change that. It has to come from within himself, just as my personal growth is something that is motivated by me, for me. I'm not doing all this work for any person in my life except for me and the people already in my life who I want to show up better for as a mother, sister, friend, cousin, co-worker. Any relationship I have in the future will just be better because I will be better. |
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like it’s actually helpful! The other perspective is helpful as I was in an AP state, and it helped calm me down!