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Post by mehere on May 6, 2020 17:23:48 GMT
Hi all. I identify as a DA, one that's done a lot of inner work and has been on a path of spiritual awakening and self development for about 15 years. I know how to feel my feelings to trust and allow and move through without clinging. Which has created a sort of paradox. I see how im DA because of my childhood but i also study meditation and Buddhist philosophy such as nonattachment and clinging being the root of suffering. So much so that I can't attach to anyone romantically.
Im overly picky and when i date someone its under the pretext I don't want anything serious just fun therefore I settle for people who don't check the boxes Id even need to consider them for anything serious (such as they aren't spiritual when i know i have to have that in a real partner, or they have some addiction issues when that's a Deal breaker for me). Im rarely physically attracted or impressed with anyone but people who are pretty cool I'll date otherwise I'd never date.
I have tried a couple of times to do real relationships (post divorce 5 years ago from a horrible 12 year marriage). I then run when they start acting "crazy" even the ones I'm casually with which I realize is me triggering them.
I seem to have sudden repulsion syndrome which I'm wondering if its a subconscious deactivating strategy but not sure how to tackle working on that.
Also i keep hearing DAs are "afraid" and "fear vulnerability and intimacy" and such but i legit dont feel afraid I feel disinterested annoyed and turned off. I know what fear feels like and I do truly connect and open up to people I'm considering dating and spending time getting to know. Im an open book. it's just that I don't cling or get attached. Is there some way to tap into this supposed fear?
Also the aspect of i cannot relate to people who crave relationships and love so badly I am so independent and such a loner it repulses me when i smell loneliness on a man. I feel this is a lot of people like nobody really relates to me who feels relationships are not worth the time and effort it's just drama and work for very little payoff.
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Post by dhali on May 6, 2020 23:05:32 GMT
I’d like to challenge you on how spiritual you believe you are. A lot of spirituality is about leaving your ego behind and practicing empathy. A lot of it is about leaving judgement behind. There’s a lot of judgement here from what I’ve read. I’m not saying that in a shaming way. It’s somatic from what you’re saying, but it’s the antithesis of spiritual. And real spirituality also leads you to a deeper understanding of your own faults and realizing how much of an ass you really are. Which leads to understanding and tolerance of others faults.
As for the spiritual truth of all you have is yourself.. sure. But that doesn’t make intimacy a bad thing. No one lives a completely stoic life, not even Seneca. I’d claim true spirituality is awareness of how others are showing up. At all times, and seeing how you can best be present in all situations. I don’t hear any of that in this post. None of that is clinging. I read a lot of critiques of people you date. Before you date. Except for the seeming cool part. One could say that everyone you date is already losing before they’ve begun. It’s hard to see yourself, but there’s a lot in your post that it seems like you already know, just haven’t visited yet.
Your revulsion, if I had to gander, is because of a lack of esteem for others. Spirituality should help here.
I applaud you for doing the work. It’s hard shit.
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Post by annieb on May 6, 2020 23:16:18 GMT
Hi all. I identify as a DA, one that's done a lot of inner work and has been on a path of spiritual awakening and self development for about 15 years. I know how to feel my feelings to trust and allow and move through without clinging. Which has created a sort of paradox. I see how im DA because of my childhood but i also study meditation and Buddhist philosophy such as nonattachment and clinging being the root of suffering. So much so that I can't attach to anyone romantically. Im overly picky and when i date someone its under the pretext I don't want anything serious just fun therefore I settle for people who don't check the boxes Id even need to consider them for anything serious (such as they aren't spiritual when i know i have to have that in a real partner, or they have some addiction issues when that's a Deal breaker for me). Im rarely physically attracted or impressed with anyone but people who are pretty cool I'll date otherwise I'd never date. I have tried a couple of times to do real relationships (post divorce 5 years ago from a horrible 12 year marriage). I then run when they start acting "crazy" even the ones I'm casually with which I realize is me triggering them. I seem to have sudden repulsion syndrome which I'm wondering if its a subconscious deactivating strategy but not sure how to tackle working on that. Also i keep hearing DAs are "afraid" and "fear vulnerability and intimacy" and such but i legit dont feel afraid I feel disinterested annoyed and turned off. I know what fear feels like and I do truly connect and open up to people I'm considering dating and spending time getting to know. Im an open book. it's just that I don't cling or get attached. Is there some way to tap into this supposed fear? Also the aspect of i cannot relate to people who crave relationships and love so badly I am so independent and such a loner it repulses me when i smell loneliness on a man. I feel this is a lot of people like nobody really relates to me who feels relationships are not worth the time and effort it's just drama and work for very little payoff. I would think that if you’re already settling from the get go (pick partners that you don’t see a long term potential with) that you will eventually get repulsed by them. Have you tried dating men that tick all your boxes? And see what develops? |
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Post by serenity on May 7, 2020 6:45:56 GMT
H I seem to have sudden repulsion syndrome which I'm wondering if its a subconscious deactivating strategy but not sure how to tackle working on that. The sudden repulsion thing is likely "splitting"..where you feel triggered when you get close to a person, and then paint the person black. Painting a person black is where you only see faults in the other person, rather than holding onto a balanced view. You only really know you're doing it when you examine your thoughts, and realize you are not seeing or considering both the positive and negative about that person, nor considering all your positive interactions leading up to that point. Another common sign of splitting is when you have some distance, your thoughts about the person you were repulsed by become balanced again. You might remember the positive side, the happy memories, and even miss them. Splitting is a sign of PTSD, which is something you can get help with. You were likely hurt a lot as a kid, and you have symptoms of trauma now. What Dhali said is true, this "painting people black" mindset may have become a habit for you, that makes you feel comfortable. Are you feeling lonely though? Do you want anything to change? |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 13:31:22 GMT
I just feel very turned off but can still act with compassion and recognize their good qualities but just not as a match for me. It usually happens after theyre behaving in ways I think are emotionally unstable or unhealthy for at least weeks. H I seem to have sudden repulsion syndrome which I'm wondering if its a subconscious deactivating strategy but not sure how to tackle working on that. The sudden repulsion thing is likely "splitting"..where you feel triggered when you get close to a person, and then paint the person black. Painting a person black is where you only see faults in the other person, rather than holding onto a balanced view. You only really know you're doing it when you examine your thoughts, and realize you are not seeing or considering both the positive and negative about that person, nor considering all your positive interactions leading up to that point. Another common sign of splitting is when you have some distance, your thoughts about the person you were repulsed by become balanced again. You might remember the positive side, the happy memories, and even miss them. Splitting is a sign of PTSD, which is something you can get help with. You were likely hurt a lot as a kid, and you have symptoms of trauma now. What Dhali said is true, this "painting people black" mindset may have become a habit for you, that makes you feel comfortable. Are you feeling lonely though? Do you want anything to change? |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 13:32:34 GMT
I rarely feel lonely. I am constantly working on myself and I'm taking a course for attachment style reprogramming now although it says I'm secure with DA. I just feel very turned off but can still act with compassion and recognize their good qualities but just not as a match for me. It usually happens after theyre behaving in ways I think are emotionally unstable or unhealthy for at least weeks. The sudden repulsion thing is likely "splitting"..where you feel triggered when you get close to a person, and then paint the person black. Painting a person black is where you only see faults in the other person, rather than holding onto a balanced view. You only really know you're doing it when you examine your thoughts, and realize you are not seeing or considering both the positive and negative about that person, nor considering all your positive interactions leading up to that point. Another common sign of splitting is when you have some distance, your thoughts about the person you were repulsed by become balanced again. You might remember the positive side, the happy memories, and even miss them. Splitting is a sign of PTSD, which is something you can get help with. You were likely hurt a lot as a kid, and you have symptoms of trauma now. What Dhali said is true, this "painting people black" mindset may have become a habit for you, that makes you feel comfortable. Are you feeling lonely though? Do you want anything to change? |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 13:40:07 GMT
Yes i have tried that. One was slowly developing CTE disorder but wasnt ready to accept it yet. He began staring off into space for minutes at a time, keeping dirty dishes in his kitchen cabinets, having panic attacks for things at work that seemed trivial and other disturbing cognitive symptoms. At the time I had a crazy amount of things on my plate and shoulders and wasnt prepared to be in a relationship with someone suffering brain injury reprucussions so I became very turned off and ended it. The last time I felt some months in we had hit a wall. He was very in love and i just wasn't. I hired a life/relationship coach to figure out am i incapable of falling in love or why am I not feeling the same way back. She had me journal every time i felt like running away. She linked dots to him having a source fracture wound from his childhood and times i felt like running were when he was exhibiting unhealthy behaviors. Her and I determined more specifically what i want and need in a man and unfortunately he wasn't it. He began acting very triggered and then got childish and mean and i ended it. That was a year ago and i still feel burnt out on relationships due to how high maintenance and needy he was i have yet to want to even try a real relationship again. Hi all. I identify as a DA, one that's done a lot of inner work and has been on a path of spiritual awakening and self development for about 15 years. I know how to feel my feelings to trust and allow and move through without clinging. Which has created a sort of paradox. I see how im DA because of my childhood but i also study meditation and Buddhist philosophy such as nonattachment and clinging being the root of suffering. So much so that I can't attach to anyone romantically. Im overly picky and when i date someone its under the pretext I don't want anything serious just fun therefore I settle for people who don't check the boxes Id even need to consider them for anything serious (such as they aren't spiritual when i know i have to have that in a real partner, or they have some addiction issues when that's a Deal breaker for me). Im rarely physically attracted or impressed with anyone but people who are pretty cool I'll date otherwise I'd never date. I have tried a couple of times to do real relationships (post divorce 5 years ago from a horrible 12 year marriage). I then run when they start acting "crazy" even the ones I'm casually with which I realize is me triggering them. I seem to have sudden repulsion syndrome which I'm wondering if its a subconscious deactivating strategy but not sure how to tackle working on that. Also i keep hearing DAs are "afraid" and "fear vulnerability and intimacy" and such but i legit dont feel afraid I feel disinterested annoyed and turned off. I know what fear feels like and I do truly connect and open up to people I'm considering dating and spending time getting to know. Im an open book. it's just that I don't cling or get attached. Is there some way to tap into this supposed fear? Also the aspect of i cannot relate to people who crave relationships and love so badly I am so independent and such a loner it repulses me when i smell loneliness on a man. I feel this is a lot of people like nobody really relates to me who feels relationships are not worth the time and effort it's just drama and work for very little payoff. I would think that if you’re already settling from the get go (pick partners that you don’t see a long term potential with) that you will eventually get repulsed by them. Have you tried dating men that tick all your boxes? And see what develops? |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 13:48:48 GMT
So really these challenges are only with romantic relationships. I have friendships where i can meet them where they are with total compassion and acceptance but for romantic partners I put it on a whole other level for some reason. Theres a lot of "dealbreakers". I can "feel" empathetically and psychically what people are feeling and things about them even complete strangers. I've done quite a bit of shadow and ego work but with men its a challenge for me i do tend to feel judgy. But thats what im dealing with right now. Im not enlightened. I cant just pair up with someone with a great heart and we trot off into the sunset happily ever after. Trying to do relationships I feel does take me out of my spiritual peaceful place. When im not trying i feel the most balanced and highest vibration but isn't the point to push to work thru it even tho it feels like steps backwards at times? I can care about someone deeply and see their good qualities but be very turned off by their behavior, not want to be their romantic partner and also end things with great kindness. But i will meditate on and think about "theyre losing before they've begun". I do want to fall in love with someone eventually ...with all of them. Thank you. I’d like to challenge you on how spiritual you believe you are. A lot of spirituality is about leaving your ego behind and practicing empathy. A lot of it is about leaving judgement behind. There’s a lot of judgement here from what I’ve read. I’m not saying that in a shaming way. It’s somatic from what you’re saying, but it’s the antithesis of spiritual. And real spirituality also leads you to a deeper understanding of your own faults and realizing how much of an ass you really are. Which leads to understanding and tolerance of others faults. As for the spiritual truth of all you have is yourself.. sure. But that doesn’t make intimacy a bad thing. No one lives a completely stoic life, not even Seneca. I’d claim true spirituality is awareness of how others are showing up. At all times, and seeing how you can best be present in all situations. I don’t hear any of that in this post. None of that is clinging. I read a lot of critiques of people you date. Before you date. Except for the seeming cool part. One could say that everyone you date is already losing before they’ve begun. It’s hard to see yourself, but there’s a lot in your post that it seems like you already know, just haven’t visited yet. Your revulsion, if I had to gander, is because of a lack of esteem for others. Spirituality should help here. I applaud you for doing the work. It’s hard shit. |
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Post by dhali on May 7, 2020 14:14:39 GMT
Their clingy ness isn’t happening in a vacuum. With avoidants I find it’s usually because you’re having internal dialog that isn’t being shared. And it’s based on judging the situation, to which your romantic interest picks up on. Have you tried communicating your struggles just to be an open book? I’m not saying it’ll fix things, but I think when you have trouble forming relationships, it’s mostly because needs aren’t communicated effectively and on time. Or respected.
As for the dirty dishes guy, I wouldn’t analyze that too much. Sometimes other people just aren’t a match. It would be overwhelming for anyone at the start of a relationship to have to deal with mental health issues. It’s a lot to ask, and there is no shame in bailing out of that.
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Post by annieb on May 7, 2020 14:21:21 GMT
Yes i have tried that. One was slowly developing CTE disorder but wasnt ready to accept it yet. He began staring off into space for minutes at a time, keeping dirty dishes in his kitchen cabinets, having panic attacks for things at work that seemed trivial and other disturbing cognitive symptoms. At the time I had a crazy amount of things on my plate and shoulders and wasnt prepared to be in a relationship with someone suffering brain injury reprucussions so I became very turned off and ended it. The last time I felt some months in we had hit a wall. He was very in love and i just wasn't. I hired a life/relationship coach to figure out am i incapable of falling in love or why am I not feeling the same way back. She had me journal every time i felt like running away. She linked dots to him having a source fracture wound from his childhood and times i felt like running were when he was exhibiting unhealthy behaviors. Her and I determined more specifically what i want and need in a man and unfortunately he wasn't it. He began acting very triggered and then got childish and mean and i ended it. That was a year ago and i still feel burnt out on relationships due to how high maintenance and needy he was i have yet to want to even try a real relationship again. I would think that if you’re already settling from the get go (pick partners that you don’t see a long term potential with) that you will eventually get repulsed by them. Have you tried dating men that tick all your boxes? And see what develops? Thank you for writing and I’m very sorry to hear about what you went through. I can relate somewhat as FA (hopefully former FA soon) especially to the kind of sadness that comes with not being able to reciprocate love. I had two DA exes and they both had trouble with object constancy with a partner (me). I was goody two shoes with both of them and they projected negative qualities on me so that they could break up with me. They negatively interpreted my actions and devalued me. I believe one of them was also a full blown narcissist. I was able to talk to my last ex (he was still chasing me after the breakup and calling), who was DA and I told him about this and that he lacked this object constancy and that he projected onto me and he literally cried. He was so very sorry and I believed him. Because I think at that point despite his devaluation of new his feelings for me really had grown. I think the breakup was very difficult for him because I think he was starting to be aware of his narcissism. And yet a few smarts later he would start with devaluation again. I used to have an anxiety (unrelatedly to these guys) and I would have a really negative thought loop about myself going on in my head. This had gone on for years. Say I would be late for work and all of a sudden the thoughts would come in: I’m a loser, always late, why can’t I get it right, etc. etc. I had been in therapy at that point maybe three months after my last breakup. At around three months mark in therapy I sat down in my room one evening and I almost spoke out loud - I love me. This was a first for me in my life (I’m 40). So a few days later I’m rushing off to work and I feel the familiar negative thoughts creeping in and lo and behold I actually caught myself thinking this negative loop. And in that moment I was able to stop it, I said, none of these things are true, you (me) are lovely, you do a great job at work and you’ll get there 5 minutes late, which is your grace period anyway, it’s all good, mama! So here I am wondering if a DA would be able to achieve a cognitive intervention with their negative thought loop/ projections/ devaluation of the other person? Can you become aware of this thought pattern and stop yourself? Because you know that if you lose this great person you will be in pain anyway. So why not interrupt the devaluation and splitting. I know this is easier said than done. If you had to ask me what technique to use, I wouldn’t know. The only thing that had actually changed in my life at the point that I was able to cognitively change my thought pattern was that I valued myself and thought of myself with kindness. |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 14:32:43 GMT
Thank you so much for sharing all of that. Would you mind explaining "object constancy"? I'm not familiar. Something ive done which helps in the short term at least is making list of the man's positive qualities and focusing on those. Its a tug of war tho as my mind just wants to keep going with reasons we aren't compatible or why its not working and won't work. I'll likely need to seek coaching next time im "in it" with someone but hoping to do as much work while single as i can. I honestly never regret ending it a single time tho. I feel relieved and happy and never miss them or try to get them back. I feel sad and disappointed but ready to move on. I end it with eyes wide open not out of lashing out or over reacting or feeling triggered. I really think of them as lovely but for someone else. So I'm not sure. Yes i have tried that. One was slowly developing CTE disorder but wasnt ready to accept it yet. He began staring off into space for minutes at a time, keeping dirty dishes in his kitchen cabinets, having panic attacks for things at work that seemed trivial and other disturbing cognitive symptoms. At the time I had a crazy amount of things on my plate and shoulders and wasnt prepared to be in a relationship with someone suffering brain injury reprucussions so I became very turned off and ended it. The last time I felt some months in we had hit a wall. He was very in love and i just wasn't. I hired a life/relationship coach to figure out am i incapable of falling in love or why am I not feeling the same way back. She had me journal every time i felt like running away. She linked dots to him having a source fracture wound from his childhood and times i felt like running were when he was exhibiting unhealthy behaviors. Her and I determined more specifically what i want and need in a man and unfortunately he wasn't it. He began acting very triggered and then got childish and mean and i ended it. That was a year ago and i still feel burnt out on relationships due to how high maintenance and needy he was i have yet to want to even try a real relationship again. Thank you for writing and I’m very sorry to hear about what you went through. I can relate somewhat as FA (hopefully former FA soon) especially to the kind of sadness that comes with not being able to reciprocate love. I had two DA exes and they both had trouble with object constancy with a partner (me). I was goody two shoes with both of them and they projected negative qualities on me so that they could break up with me. They negatively interpreted my actions and devalued me. I believe one of them was also a full blown narcissist. I was able to talk to my last ex (he was still chasing me after the breakup and calling), who was DA and I told him about this and that he lacked this object constancy and that he projected onto me and he literally cried. He was so very sorry and I believed him. Because I think at that point despite his devaluation of new his feelings for me really had grown. I think the breakup was very difficult for him because I think he was starting to be aware of his narcissism. And yet a few smarts later he would start with devaluation again. I used to have an anxiety (unrelatedly to these guys) and I would have a really negative thought loop about myself going on in my head. This had gone on for years. Say I would be late for work and all of a sudden the thoughts would come in: I’m a loser, always late, why can’t I get it right, etc. etc. I had been in therapy at that point maybe three months after my last breakup. At around three months mark in therapy I sat down in my room one evening and I almost spoke out loud - I love me. This was a first for me in my life (I’m 40). So a few days later I’m rushing off to work and I feel the familiar negative thoughts creeping in and lo and behold I actually caught myself thinking this negative loop. And in that moment I was able to stop it, I said, none of these things are true, you (me) are lovely, you do a great job at work and you’ll get there 5 minutes late, which is your grace period anyway, it’s all good, mama! So here I am wondering if a DA would be able to achieve a cognitive intervention with their negative thought loop/ projections/ devaluation of the other person? Can you become aware of this thought pattern and stop yourself? Because you know that if you lose this great person you will be in pain anyway. So why not interrupt the devaluation and splitting. I know this is easier said than done. If you had to ask me what technique to use, I wouldn’t know. The only thing that had actually changed in my life at the point that I was able to cognitively change my thought pattern was that I valued myself and thought of myself with kindness. |
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Post by dhali on May 7, 2020 14:33:49 GMT
I might also try dating someone in more of a friendship manner. See if something develops over time. But really with the intent of friendship.
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 14:38:48 GMT
Ha I just came to that conclusion literally about a week ago! Probably should have asked you guys earlier as I'm a little slow at this sometimes 😆 I might also try dating someone in more of a friendship manner. See if something develops over time. But really with the intent of friendship. |
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Post by mehere on May 7, 2020 15:01:46 GMT
The internal dialogue thing is very real yes. I struggle to analyze what my inner dialogue is and articulate it also without being too brutally honest, so tactfully. I think I've learned to do ok with it. With my last relationship the source wound guy..i was very open about not feeling the same as him. He was insecure to begin with tho so this really did a number on him. I was open about look I'm working on figuring out is this because of my issues, or is it that we arent compatible, can we work thru this or what. He got very defensive when i shared with him what the coach and i talked about. Im starting to wonder if anyone is my match or did i come into this lifetime with other goals, romantic love not being meant for me this time 🤔 My bar is set very high and I'm picky and its not great i sometimes wish i could be as easily pleased as so many other people seem to be. One big thing is that the coach helped me realize i need someone who is also on the personal development/ awakening path who is also growing and learning otherwise I've already outgrown them since im so driven in that way. Their clingy ness isn’t happening in a vacuum. With avoidants I find it’s usually because you’re having internal dialog that isn’t being shared. And it’s based on judging the situation, to which your romantic interest picks up on. Have you tried communicating your struggles just to be an open book? I’m not saying it’ll fix things, but I think when you have trouble forming relationships, it’s mostly because needs aren’t communicated effectively and on time. Or respected. As for the dirty dishes guy, I wouldn’t analyze that too much. Sometimes other people just aren’t a match. It would be overwhelming for anyone at the start of a relationship to have to deal with mental health issues. It’s a lot to ask, and there is no shame in bailing out of that. |
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Post by annieb on May 7, 2020 15:26:40 GMT
The internal dialogue thing is very real yes. I struggle to analyze what my inner dialogue is and articulate it also without being too brutally honest, so tactfully. I think I've learned to do ok with it. With my last relationship the source wound guy..i was very open about not feeling the same as him. He was insecure to begin with tho so this really did a number on him. I was open about look I'm working on figuring out is this because of my issues, or is it that we arent compatible, can we work thru this or what. He got very defensive when i shared with him what the coach and i talked about. Im starting to wonder if anyone is my match or did i come into this lifetime with other goals, romantic love not being meant for me this time 🤔 My bar is set very high and I'm picky and its not great i sometimes wish i could be as easily pleased as so many other people seem to be. One big thing is that the coach helped me realize i need someone who is also on the personal development/ awakening path who is also growing and learning otherwise I've already outgrown them since im so driven in that way. Their clingy ness isn’t happening in a vacuum. With avoidants I find it’s usually because you’re having internal dialog that isn’t being shared. And it’s based on judging the situation, to which your romantic interest picks up on. Have you tried communicating your struggles just to be an open book? I’m not saying it’ll fix things, but I think when you have trouble forming relationships, it’s mostly because needs aren’t communicated effectively and on time. Or respected. As for the dirty dishes guy, I wouldn’t analyze that too much. Sometimes other people just aren’t a match. It would be overwhelming for anyone at the start of a relationship to have to deal with mental health issues. It’s a lot to ask, and there is no shame in bailing out of that. Don’t quote me on this, but because you shared the inner dialogue (which is kudos to you for sharing) and the other person became defensive was because perhaps the negatives that were part of your dialogue were not really who he was or what he was doing, but that they were projections? That’s the only thing I can think of that could go wrong with “communicating” this inner dialogue. |
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