For avoidants to speak to please

I'm not sure where to start on this one,but I'm going to write a few things and then mull it over.
My whole childhood, I was extremely unhappy and depressed to the point of attempted suicide. The depression was a result of the abuse and I couldn't see the light at the end of the tunnel. My only out was to die.
Somehow, I made it to 18 and I was free. I moved out and didn't look back. I was elated, happy, but damaged.
I despised myself and lived a risky lifestyle, because no one cared about me, no one would even would know if I was dead or alive, I had no attachments. But like you tgat, I was street smart and had no bruises to show despite the risks I took.

My environment had changed, so I was happy, but had to turn off my feelings to forget the past, move on and do what I had to do to survive.
As I made money, got an education, survived, made friends, I built up my self esteem. My parents didn't give me the tools I needed, but I figured it out and made it and it built me up more.

But I remained disconnected from myself and detached. I had something to work with, but feared my own memories.

I think I have spent my life trying to heal and reconnect with myself. It's a slow ongoing process and I don't think I will ever get "there" wherever there is. But I get better and more aware and more connected each day. I think the moments though of "do I like eggs?" will always occur, maybe just less often.

But to the question of happiness. It's the one emotion I knew. I always knew if I was happy or unhappy. The other emotions are harder to determine. I wouldn't say unawareness is happier, it's just more confusing.

Whew, that was a tough one. I'm going to mull this over some more and see if I have further things to write.

Thank you both for this.
I lived a childhood in fear - where I wasn't allowed to express myself and I became a kind of non person - not allowed to have feelings and thoughts and instead acutely attuned to those of my caregivers - a kind of chameleon in order to stay away from conflict and trouble.
As an adult I remember feeling I could pretty much deal with anything - by numbing out, total avoidance of feelings, emotions, as a way of being in control. Time life and hard work have taught me bit by bit to reverse the process - life now is infinitely more alive, more joyful and sometimes more painful.

Wow...my life trajectory is almost verbatim with mary's. I am also realizing that I might have avoidant tendancies as well after visiting this forum. I always thought I am a Secure because I wanted more from my Avoidant partners.

So that skewed my judgment about my attachment style, though I still feel that I am at the lower spectrum of FA/DA style. I am also a Highly Sensitive Person, HSP, and somewhat more introvert.

My current dilemma is that I have grown up with a NPD stepmother (overt), married and divorced a NPD (overt), and had just been befriended by 3 NPDs (2 overt and 1 covert) within 2 years! It is very puzzling for me, as I thought to myself perhaps I'm the one with the issues because it cannot be that there are so many NPDs around??!

I also confused the covert NPD friend as an AP. She displayed all the signs of an Anxious chasing an Avoidant, but I have come to realize that she is actually stalking her crush, who has made it clear he isn't into her, and has posted on his FB hints of feeling harassed by her constant outpouring of her daily tribulations, her uninvited visits to his home, yet he enjoys the attention she lavishes on him and gives her crumbs.

I guess my only "evidence" of the friends being NPD is that the relationship is one-way, and they take alot but don't give back attention, time, efforts, etc. I am just ears for her unsuccessful attempts at "catching" her crush, her troubles with her director and colleagues at work, her health problems, etc...

Again this triggers an internal crisis...maybe I'm too selfish myself and not giving enough??!

On reflection, I have a few close friends for whom the friendship is reciprocal, kind and very close. It is not true for at least 2 of the NPD friends I know, they didn't have long-term friends, they approached and targeted me for love-bombing and then the mask dropped when there is disagreement or when I seek their attention for my issues.

I do think that finding myself being surrounded by many NPDs (add to the toxic mix one confirmed ex boss who gave everyone hell...) makes me more avoidant and paranoid. I am truly afraid of being drained by such people, and I find them draining. I am often the recipient of the drama stories they constantly encounter in their lives.

I am really confused, because it cannot be that there are so many NPDs around, right?

I find myself extremely shy about people now that I've been burned too often by NPDs and Avoidant ex DA.

The good thing is that I have started texting a couple of potential dates from out of town, and that helps so much in getting over exDA. One is visiting my city this Saturday and I look forward to the date very much.

So I highly advise that course to get over a partner - become open and available, feeling a little hopeful again is the best remedy to forget.

I'm very curious as there is a very similar life trajectory, NPD parent, NPD partner....I do wonder if those are at the root of my fears. Yet I still end up with NPDs in my life no matter how fearful! Looking forward to see how the thread develops with insight into my own issues.

I realize I'm able to tolerate extreme Avoidance in a partner (exNPD spouse and exDA) because I'm slightly Avoidant myself, so that's great to find out!

I realize also that I'm not good at "reading" people, so that increases my fears.

Cheers to all, and may you gain insight as you embark on your journey.

curious, I had similar thoughts regarding NPD. My mother was/is extremely anxious NPD who was physically and mentally abusive. My brother is also NPD. My ex also was extremely anxious and NPD. I have a friend who is not full blown NPD, but on the spectrum. I wondered too how I am surrounded by them, when statistically, they are a small number. With the exception of my brother, I CHOSE them to be in my life. The common denominator is me. I ended up in therapy due to my NPD ex and figured out I was attracted to/befriended people like my mother, because it was familiar and was trying subconsciously to resolve that relationship.

Thank goodness, through therapy, I was able to resolve my liking for NPDs. I have not quite resolved the other parts and still have toxic relationships, just not on that level. I actually asked my therapist if I was NPD! It was all so confusing. Thank goodness, she said no, but that I have a problem with trust. Without trust, relationships are very hard to sustain.

I found that sustaining any kind of relationship with an NPD takes a whole lot of giving and not receiving, so I don't know if the issue of you being not giving or selfish is an issue for you?

Thank you to all who post on this thread. This has been a tough one for me, but much needed.

tgat, I'd love to hear how you become more open and trusting, and working your way to Secure. Can you give some empirical examples?

It didn't occur to me that I could be Avoidant until yasmin mentioned she might be one based on an ideal living arrangement I described, of a couple living as neighbors in order to offer both individual privacy as well as connection. Perhaps we need to draw up our own laundry list of acceptable co-existence with our future partners so they can gradually merge their lives with ours.

mary, I used to be too giving. I gave a lot to exNPD spouse, until I was completely depleted. I paid for rent, food, kids expenses, gifts for him, etc., because I had more in my bank account and he came from a poor family. He lied that his family was wealthy when we first met, but I forgave his lies and tried to let him keep more for himself. Of course he never thanked me and started to really abuse me. I had no idea what NPD was until I started googling gaslighting, projection, etc. and sort of tumbled down the rabbit hole and finally recognized the same disorder in my stepmother. I used to think she was just cruel, grandiose, horrible, crazy, quick to anger, a bully, etc...but didn't know it was a disorder.

I became paranoid that I might be a co-dependent, etc. Professionally, I projected a strong image, and no one would guess that I'm emotionally blue and black all over from exNPD spouse.

You didn't choose your mother or brother though, and perhaps your NPD friends chose you too. The 3 I described did, they actually chased me and love-bombed me as if they genuinely liked me - one through a Meetup site and the covert through the book club I'd joined. The other overt NPD is the mother of my son's friend.

Yours is a good question...I need to find the answer asap. How did they "spot" you or me? Or do they chase many people but only those who got "marked" by their childhood stayed longer than the others who could sense the danger earlier on?

Although it is easier to sort of fade off the friendship than a romantic liaison, I must say it didn't happen without casting shadows into my inner being.

Among the men I have tried dating, there was at least one I was sure is also NPD, and one I am exchanging texts with whom I suspect to be one. Some red flags - they really showed off their wealth and "pedigree", fabulous apartment, signet rings, etc., and they used to be very handsome in their youth (now grey-haired middle aged guys) and they sent me pictures of their younger selves in their 20s, as did the exDA...weird right? The NPD also criticized everyone he saw around us, their clothes, behavior, everything, as if he were a perfectionist. Perfectionism is a big red flag.

The one NPD friend who threw me off is the covert NPD - she is depressed, vulnerable, sensitive, likes to praise and adore others who have admirable qualities, etc., which is so different from the usual NPDs I've encountered. A few red flags started to appear recently. She has an unrequited crush, and it gradually becomes alarming to me how she ignores his boundaries, but he does things that lead her on too, eg. "liking" her comment on his FB page. Like the overt NPD friend, whenever we went out together, she wouldn't do a little thing like drop me off at my place in her car, which is only a 5 minute detour from her place. So I always had to walk 20 minutes in the cold, dark winter night home from her place. For the 1 year I've known her, whenever we went somewhere in her car, she has never picked me up or dropped me off - I had to walk to her place and then home, even when I was lugging heavy stuff in the snow. My more normal friends and even mere acquaintances who offered me a lift had no problems dropping me off at or near my place in the city center, even when they live farther away. It isn't a big deal, but it was a puzzle for me, until I started to wake up to a pattern of a clearly one-sided friendship that "rhymes" with the one with the overt NPD. There are many self-centered, exploitative details that mirror overt NPD except she comes across as needy, diffident, anxious and vulnerable. This made me confuse covert NPD and AP!

Ops, perhaps I should post this in the "red flags" thread. I'm wondering if something about me gives off "fuel" which attracts pwNPD, as HG Tudor (a self-confessed malignant narcissist) described on his blog.

narcsite.com/2018/01/29/the-empathic-supernova-6/comment-page-1/#comment-170446

mary, Bingo. You really grasped it - it was fine and I lived with it for 1-2 years, though slightly weird for me, the inability to make a 5 minute detour when she would go out of her way for other people, seemingly unable to imagine the 20 minutes walk in the dark freezing night (once with my son in tow) and then many many other incongruities started adding up before clarity struck me. This was identical behavior from 2 different N friends who drove. And 2 N friends also opined that the fish I rescued from the ice counter was subject to great cruelty from me. It doesn't repeat but it rhymes.

I feel weird that I have become hypervigilant about Ns, becoming afraid of people who chase us, as friends or romantic partners, but fortunately this is an anon site and I can live with the embarrassing confessions.

I think we tolerated a lot of boundary-busting behavior from the wrong (toxic) people and we became hyper-sensitive and withdrawn. Burnt victims secretly yearning for hugs. I'm introverted, so I don't talk as much, and became the sympathetic listener to the litany of wrongs and dramas from others.

Most normal persons might "get" it, apologize for talking too much, back off or want to listen to your story too....except for the NPDs who need an audience and a mirror to reflect back to them, endlessly.

www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-introverts-corner/201007/the-perils-listening-well

NPDs will not let go until the devaluation and discard, and by then we feel drained and we might shy away from the right type of partners, the Secures who chase us? And then we feel "comfortable" with DAs more avoidant than we are.

The danger is that I have become a HSP, which is detrimental to my growth.

I have not learned the techniques of being less tolerant, if you have come across any resources, I would love to read about them. Again it is confusing....is being less tolerant = more avoidant?