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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 21:42:51 GMT
sometimes i mire myself in an uncomfortable comfort zone , because i haven’t known anything else. it’s easy to stay stagnant. i am pushing past that and raising the bar for myself mows i have told myself i am not cut out for relationships but i believe that is a lie. i get it, i know why i doubt. but the friendliest thing i can imagine doing for myself is to keep putting myself out there to find what i believe i deserve. something fulfilling where i can be my best me. i hope you don’t give up. Thank you - I am happy to be open to whatever happens relationship wise but as I've got older, living in a small community (Island) and with a full life to children work and activities I very rarely come into contact with anyone who'd fit the bill - and even less so fit the bill and be single and looking! On the positive side - I wasn't tempted to jump back into old patterns. Maybe I am over analysing this and need to just get on with life and let it roll. i see it that way- just let it roll. things take time. i feel most stuck when i am thinking instead of just living. |
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Post by ocarina on Feb 17, 2018 21:46:14 GMT
And theres a psychological reason why we feel so safe and home with these men. Let's get to the bottom of that. Do they remind us of ourselves? Our parents? Does their brokenness make us feel familiar? Does their constant intermittent reinforcement and love that is there but not fully expressed remind us of how we first learned to love? My ex reminds me of my father - somewhere between The Buddha and Jesus(!) - he was my best friend growing up, we were very similar and he was one of the few people I felt really at home with. My mother was a highly strung emotionally manipulative person and both my father and I walked on eggshells around her. So - he reminds me of myself - and my father. That brokenness is safe for me - love as a child was my fathers constant silent presence. I am severely avoidant with my mother - she was and remains too emotionally dangerous, unpredictable and highly strung to be safe to be around too much. With my father I was able to be myself and that's what this last relationship gave me. Strangely enough I never felt unloved by my father - although he was kind of distant, it was a constant distance as opposed to a coming and going. When I felt unloved by my ex partner, it was often when the rest of life was difficult and my insecurities were being triggered in all dirrections - almost as though his behaviour laid open my hidden wounds - at which point I ran. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 17, 2018 21:47:46 GMT
I really think that is the key. I think it's a journey to not being scared anymore. Having a buddy who feels the same is a weight off. I've always deep down just felt like I wasn't cut out for it but I also think that can't be true. I'm great at loving friends and family so this must be just the attachment BS. Let's deal with this crap one step at a time and try and live life without stacking up regrets OK - I am up for the challenge - honestly sometimes I feel emotionally disabled, as though everything is inside but that there's some kind of wall preventing me from really expressing it. That wall, I am pretty sure is fear. Funny - with the ex, without the pressure of relationship, it feels easier, better, nothing to lose. I am starting to sound like one of the FA partners we here APs talking about and struggling with. No pressure, to attachment to outcome means no fear and less anxiety. But it also means no intimacy - and I know now after my last relationship that I can do intimacy - and that I want to do it too! I feel the EXACT same way. That relief of not having to worry anymore. As we have such similar styles we can hopefully bounce of each other. I'm taking the advice I got to set myself a 30 day dating period with this new man in my life during which i can't dump or reject him. Small strategies like this might help. I'm not sure about you but I find rules comforting. All the uncertainty of dating is stressful on me. I feel like I don't want to waste time dating someone who's not right for me but surely it's more of a waste of time to not dare anyone st all!! I went 6 years once (age 27 to 32) without any sex dating and i was actually pretty happy but looking back i think i just emotionally hybernate |
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Post by ocarina on Feb 17, 2018 21:50:07 GMT
And theres a psychological reason why we feel so safe and home with these men. Let's get to the bottom of that. Do they remind us of ourselves? Our parents? Does their brokenness make us feel familiar? Does their constant intermittent reinforcement and love that is there but not fully expressed remind us of how we first learned to love? How about you Yasmin? Is there any sense that vulnerability is scary - you mentioned feeling that if you were really seen you may not be loveable - are these broken partners safe because there's not much risk of being seen - they don't open up and neither do we and whilst it feels "off" it also feels safe..... |
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Post by ocarina on Feb 17, 2018 21:53:36 GMT
OK Yasmin - I will hold you to the 30 day challenge - and look forward to hearing the charting of the process.
For me, I am going to be here for myself, living and being present and taking things as they come, letting the feelings appear and noting them rather than distracting myself, telling myself stories or whatever. This will be uncomfortable for sure.
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Post by yasmin on Feb 17, 2018 21:54:11 GMT
And theres a psychological reason why we feel so safe and home with these men. Let's get to the bottom of that. Do they remind us of ourselves? Our parents? Does their brokenness make us feel familiar? Does their constant intermittent reinforcement and love that is there but not fully expressed remind us of how we first learned to love? My ex reminds me of my father - somewhere between The Buddha and Jesus(!) - he was my best friend growing up, we were very similar and he was one of the few people I felt really at home with. My mother was a highly strung emotionally manipulative person and both my father and I walked on eggshells around her. So - he reminds me of myself - and my father. That brokenness is safe for me - love as a child was my fathers constant silent presence. I am severely avoidant with my mother - she was and remains too emotionally dangerous, unpredictable and highly strung to be safe to be around too much. With my father I was able to be myself and that's what this last relationship gave me. Strangely enough I never felt unloved by my father - although he was kind of distant, it was a constant distance as opposed to a coming and going. When I felt unloved by my ex partner, it was often when the rest of life was difficult and my insecurities were being triggered in all dirrections - almost as though his behaviour laid open my hidden wounds - at which point I ran. Very very very similar here. We should talk more about this. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 17, 2018 21:57:19 GMT
And theres a psychological reason why we feel so safe and home with these men. Let's get to the bottom of that. Do they remind us of ourselves? Our parents? Does their brokenness make us feel familiar? Does their constant intermittent reinforcement and love that is there but not fully expressed remind us of how we first learned to love? How about you Yasmin? Is there any sense that vulnerability is scary - you mentioned feeling that if you were really seen you may not be loveable - are these broken partners safe because there's not much risk of being seen - they don't open up and neither do we and whilst it feels "off" it also feels safe..... I really don't know Ocarina. It's going to take some thinking. I loved being with him because as you say it was authentic and undraining. He understood me easily. I think I also projected onto him. Trying to heal him felt like it would also heal me. He reminded me a lot of my father in some ways. I liked that he made me work for it instead of being easy to manipulate like everyone else. It felt very powerful and very genuine. I knew he loved me for ME in a way in think no one else ever has. They loved the illusion and he loved the woman. It's so darn complex |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 17, 2018 21:57:58 GMT
OK Yasmin - I will hold you to the 30 day challenge - and look forward to hearing the charting of the process. For me, I am going to be here for myself, living and being present and taking things as they come, letting the feelings appear and noting them rather than distracting myself, telling myself stories or whatever. This will be uncomfortable for sure. Healing ALL fears means being uncomfortable. |
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Post by ocarina on Feb 17, 2018 22:16:03 GMT
I wonder sometimes if these men feel right for us and let us be ourselves because in many ways they are risk free. Unlikely to turn around and declare undying love and ask us to marry them.
There's such a dichotomy between the intimacy we crave and the anxiety that it brings with it once we get it!
I grew alot within my last relationship - and it's made more complex by the fact that he's still here, still wanting me - and that he wasn't a baddy - wasn't abusive. However like your ex - he is still unable (I assume) to offer me the most basic of stable, predictable and loving relationships that we all _ or almost all - require.
I love that you described love as a choice in another thread - that's exactly how I feel. If we are to love, we need to make the choice to do so without listening to the voice that's saying we should feel this or that. My ex also had that choice and regardless of whatever he feels - he chose repeatedly not to act in a loving way. In many ways I have been him, over and over again and this relationship and finding this site have opened my eyes to it.
Lots of food for thought here.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 17, 2018 22:24:05 GMT
I really think that is the key. I think it's a journey to not being scared anymore. Having a buddy who feels the same is a weight off. I've always deep down just felt like I wasn't cut out for it but I also think that can't be true. I'm great at loving friends and family so this must be just the attachment BS. Let's deal with this crap one step at a time and try and live life without stacking up regrets OK - I am up for the challenge - honestly sometimes I feel emotionally disabled, as though everything is inside but that there's some kind of wall preventing me from really expressing it.That wall, I am pretty sure is fear. Funny - with the ex, without the pressure of relationship, it feels easier, better, nothing to lose. I am starting to sound like one of the FA partners we here APs talking about and struggling with. No pressure, to attachment to outcome means no fear and less anxiety. But it also means no intimacy - and I know now after my last relationship that I can do intimacy - and that I want to do it too! I know that wall well. I never saw it until I became more aware. Being aware is a blessing and a curse. Now I have come to the point where I want the intimacy, just don't know how to do it. I feel you on this big time. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 17, 2018 22:29:59 GMT
I wonder sometimes if these men feel right for us and let us be ourselves because in many ways they are risk free. Unlikely to turn around and declare undying love and ask us to marry them. There's such a dichotomy between the intimacy we crave and the anxiety that it brings with it once we get it! I grew alot within my last relationship - and it's made more complex by the fact that he's still here, still wanting me - and that he wasn't a baddy - wasn't abusive. However like your ex - he is still unable (I assume) to offer me the most basic of stable, predictable and loving relationships that we all _ or almost all - require. I love that you described love as a choice in another thread - that's exactly how I feel. If we are to love, we need to make the choice to do so without listening to the voice that's saying we should feel this or that. My ex also had that choice and regardless of whatever he feels - he chose repeatedly not to act in a loving way. In many ways I have been him, over and over again and this relationship and finding this site have opened my eyes to it. Lots of food for thought here. I'm certain his unavailability was a huge factor for me. I knew he loved me but that I'd never have him. Not completely. It let me feel safe to love him. Very much like a long distance relationship...But the distance is emotional. I didn't have to be afraid of losing him because I never fully had him I don't think any of this means the love wasn't real. But it's a big factor in me choosing to love him. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2018 0:56:28 GMT
My ex reminds me of my father - somewhere between The Buddha and Jesus(!) - he was my best friend growing up, we were very similar and he was one of the few people I felt really at home with. My mother was a highly strung emotionally manipulative person and both my father and I walked on eggshells around her. So - he reminds me of myself - and my father. That brokenness is safe for me - love as a child was my fathers constant silent presence. I am severely avoidant with my mother - she was and remains too emotionally dangerous, unpredictable and highly strung to be safe to be around too much. With my father I was able to be myself and that's what this last relationship gave me. Strangely enough I never felt unloved by my father - although he was kind of distant, it was a constant distance as opposed to a coming and going. When I felt unloved by my ex partner, it was often when the rest of life was difficult and my insecurities were being triggered in all dirrections - almost as though his behaviour laid open my hidden wounds - at which point I ran. Very very very similar here. We should talk more about this. When I felt unloved by my ex partner, it was often when the rest of life was difficult and my insecurities were being triggered in all dirrections - almost as though his behaviour laid open my hidden wounds - at which point I ran. >>>> me too!! And I’m AP. Whenever he triggers me, it always went beyond him, and really surfaces my issues with my parents. Then that triggers me and I would try to fix my relationship, probably in some form of trying to heal. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 18, 2018 1:00:39 GMT
I wonder sometimes if these men feel right for us and let us be ourselves because in many ways they are risk free. Unlikely to turn around and declare undying love and ask us to marry them. There's such a dichotomy between the intimacy we crave and the anxiety that it brings with it once we get it! I grew alot within my last relationship - and it's made more complex by the fact that he's still here, still wanting me - and that he wasn't a baddy - wasn't abusive. However like your ex - he is still unable (I assume) to offer me the most basic of stable, predictable and loving relationships that we all _ or almost all - require. I love that you described love as a choice in another thread - that's exactly how I feel. If we are to love, we need to make the choice to do so without listening to the voice that's saying we should feel this or that. My ex also had that choice and regardless of whatever he feels - he chose repeatedly not to act in a loving way. In many ways I have been him, over and over again and this relationship and finding this site have opened my eyes to it. Lots of food for thought here. I'm certain his unavailability was a huge factor for me. I knew he loved me but that I'd never have him. Not completely. It let me feel safe to love him. Very much like a long distance relationship...But the distance is emotional. I didn't have to be afraid of losing him because I never fully had him I don't think any of this means the love wasn't real. But it's a big factor in me choosing to love him. I feel exactly the same!! I had a thought today. When my DA told me that his divorce had gone through, my immediate reaction wasn’t one of happiness. It was of fear and shock, then happiness. actuallt I think the rship went downhill from there. Lol. I wonder how much of my current anxiety is out of being triggered by his distancing behavior two months ago, and how much of it is out of being faced with doing the actual work of being with him. |
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Post by ocarina on Feb 18, 2018 12:20:02 GMT
It seems a common thread for everyone who's posted here that the desire for intimacy is there, but when it really appears - warts and all and we have to be brave about it, fear surfaces.
I mentioned a little before about the concept of loving someone and the reality that love is a choice, a decision to be made time and time again even when we don't feel like it.
Applying this to self love - or lack of it, this has been enlightening - we mentioned that lack of self love or of a love for all parts of the self, being a big issues for FAs - perhaps for everyone regardless of attachment style. My thirty day challenge was to be here for myself through whatever, to ride the good and bad and not to avoid in subtle ways what comes up. I am now adding to that - as well as the presence, I am going to try to choose love, again and again for myself even when I am not feeling great in at attempt to allow the not feeling great.
I am not sure if this is an FA trait but feeling anything other than great is not allowed in my world and it feels very much as though this is an extension of avoidance that doesn't serve me well. Either I am pretending everything is fine when it isn't, avoiding conflict, persuading myself that all is great. So - mission of the moment is to really be there and choose love whatever happens.
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Post by mrob on Feb 18, 2018 13:18:00 GMT
It's such an awful paradox. Today, the ex "not really a relationship", posted a picture on FB showing her enjoying the company of someone new. There were aspects that I missed, especially after talking about things here. I don't think I've been so intimate with another human being. Letting the man stuff down and snuggling into her shoulder. Being the little spoon for a bit. Scared as hell, but for that second, being able to relax and be whoever this is... So, you were right all along, Yasmin!
When I saw that picture tonight, I think of the good people I've serially pushed out of my life when they've got close, and how she, like them all, deserves to be happy. How I perceive happiness to not be with me. How this rotten attachment has damaged people around me. How it has kept me an island, no matter how much I've tried to do things differently. Eventually, all the same stuff comes back. I'm really angry with myself because none of this is new to me. How often do I have to learn the same lesson?
Thanks for being here, folks. I appreciate it more than I think I let on.
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