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Post by standintheheart on Oct 29, 2018 1:18:44 GMT
Hi everyone. Again, very new to this stuff, and over the past few weeks I've sent some texts to the woman who's brought all this Anxious stuff out on me. We'd confessed an attraction toward one another, but she was in a relationship then. Now she's out. I obsess all the time. After a few hours on the phone where she talked about her sadness about her recent breakup and love for her ex, I told her I needed distance because I still wanted to be with her. It was one of my hallmark fumbling, trying to say every single one of my feelings, sorts of talks. That was 2 1/2 weeks ago. The next day, I tried to concisely put it in writing to her. The text read: - Me: Just so I'm sure I'm clear. I think all of this is a little less dramatic than I presented in my flustered state. So... it's tough to maintain a casual friendship with you right now, because underneath that there's a longing for something more. Something more = you and me in the same place, showing you my world, the people and places that inspire me, going about our separate days, having you to "come home" to, growing together. Plus kisses and cuddles. For both our sakes, I don't want to come at you with that energy, especially while you're heartbroken. So, I'm shifting to focusing on other parts of my life, moving that energy through, nudging it gently to move on. I'll probably contact you less. But will certainly check in sometimes. I'll add that if you ever think I can help you and you reach out with specific requests/questions I am here for you. It feels really good for me to support and care for you, if I can. It's just the casual in-between that's tricky for me right now. If, inside you, this wondering about me feels strong enough and right enough to pursue, reach out. We can co-create a plan that feels right.
- Her: All of that makes sense. Thanks for clarifying, and for not just cutting me out entirely. Any time you want to reach out, reach out. Hope it's okay if I text you every once in awhile too. All the best. May we heal our sad hearts.
About a week later, I saw she posted something online that made me suspect she'd met someone new. Just creating all KINDS of stories in my brain, feeling insane. I couldn't sleep. I thought, if only I could talk to her and ask her casually, then at least I'd know if that was true, so I reached out. She said "But I thought you were taking a break?" I tried to be casual, saying I felt better and it would be fine, but realized that was bullshit and texted her the next day: - Me: I'm so so sorry, but you're absolutely right. Talking tomorrow is not a good idea. I heard a song in a coffee shop and started crying, I think I would not be the jokey relief you're looking for. I'm not over it. I'm not over you. The thoughts, ideas, dreams of spending time together are very much alive. There are questions burning in me that I fear you don't have answers to, but knowing me, I'd want to ask anyway. That's not fair to either of us to drag you into those murky thoughts. So. I'll let go. Again. I have nothing but the deepest love for you, and I know you'll be okay. If you need me, I'm here. I'm here. Thank you for enduring this back-and-forth in me. Love always, dear one.
- Her: No worries at all. Thank you for looking out for yourself and me, truly. You sound like me, crying in coffee shops! I'm so sorry. Let me know whenever you're up for a call. I'm here too. All will be well <3
I guess I'd just like to know if, in your opinions, I was clear enough. What's your analysis of the way I handled this? My anxiety was through the roof, and my solution was distance. Good call?
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 29, 2018 1:54:12 GMT
I believe you were clear...but now you have to honor that request by no longer torturing yourself with looking at her social media etc. You also have to protect yourself and your heart by doing whatever you need to do to gain distance...that may mean cutting all ties for a bit...but that will be up to you and what you are comfortable with.
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Post by faithopelove on Oct 29, 2018 2:03:52 GMT
Hi everyone. Again, very new to this stuff, and over the past few weeks I've sent some texts to the woman who's brought all this Anxious stuff out on me. We'd confessed an attraction toward one another, but she was in a relationship then. Now she's out. I obsess all the time. After a few hours on the phone where she talked about her sadness about her recent breakup and love for her ex, I told her I needed distance because I still wanted to be with her. It was one of my hallmark fumbling, trying to say every single one of my feelings, sorts of talks. That was 2 1/2 weeks ago. The next day, I tried to concisely put it in writing to her. The text read: - Me: Just so I'm sure I'm clear. I think all of this is a little less dramatic than I presented in my flustered state. So... it's tough to maintain a casual friendship with you right now, because underneath that there's a longing for something more. Something more = you and me in the same place, showing you my world, the people and places that inspire me, going about our separate days, having you to "come home" to, growing together. Plus kisses and cuddles. For both our sakes, I don't want to come at you with that energy, especially while you're heartbroken. So, I'm shifting to focusing on other parts of my life, moving that energy through, nudging it gently to move on. I'll probably contact you less. But will certainly check in sometimes. I'll add that if you ever think I can help you and you reach out with specific requests/questions I am here for you. It feels really good for me to support and care for you, if I can. It's just the casual in-between that's tricky for me right now. If, inside you, this wondering about me feels strong enough and right enough to pursue, reach out. We can co-create a plan that feels right.
- Her: All of that makes sense. Thanks for clarifying, and for not just cutting me out entirely. Any time you want to reach out, reach out. Hope it's okay if I text you every once in awhile too. All the best. May we heal our sad hearts.
About a week later, I saw she posted something online that made me suspect she'd met someone new. Just creating all KINDS of stories in my brain, feeling insane. I couldn't sleep. I thought, if only I could talk to her and ask her casually, then at least I'd know if that was true, so I reached out. She said "But I thought you were taking a break?" I tried to be casual, saying I felt better and it would be fine, but realized that was bullshit and texted her the next day: - Me: I'm so so sorry, but you're absolutely right. Talking tomorrow is not a good idea. I heard a song in a coffee shop and started crying, I think I would not be the jokey relief you're looking for. I'm not over it. I'm not over you. The thoughts, ideas, dreams of spending time together are very much alive. There are questions burning in me that I fear you don't have answers to, but knowing me, I'd want to ask anyway. That's not fair to either of us to drag you into those murky thoughts. So. I'll let go. Again. I have nothing but the deepest love for you, and I know you'll be okay. If you need me, I'm here. I'm here. Thank you for enduring this back-and-forth in me. Love always, dear one.
- Her: No worries at all. Thank you for looking out for yourself and me, truly. You sound like me, crying in coffee shops! I'm so sorry. Let me know whenever you're up for a call. I'm here too. All will be well <3
I guess I'd just like to know if, in your opinions, I was clear enough. What's your analysis of the way I handled this? My anxiety was through the roof, and my solution was distance. Good call?
I can see your anxiety was high and eventually you were clear- although she may not think you’ll stick with it. Did the two of you ever date? I’m thinking that you didn’t but the nature of your texts sound like you did. I’m AP and reading your texts helps me see how AP’s wear their hearts on their sleeves and likely overwhelm their partner or ex with our feelings and sharing of our emotions. Most of what you said was fine and it seemed like she received it well, but I think your message was a bit emotional and too heartfelt/dramatic for a lot of people to comfortably accept without being scared off. Really eye opening to see when someone else does it. As part of my emotional self-control, I make an effort to keep my texts concise and to the point...if you reread those texts or others in your phone, do you see a trend? |
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 29, 2018 2:13:57 GMT
Agreed faithopelove....very eye opening for me as well. I think there is a bit of trying to self sooth by being 100% honest and I also think trying to make sure that nothing is misunderstood to avoid confusion, but inadvertently causing pressure to or smothering the other person. |
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Post by standintheheart on Oct 29, 2018 2:40:38 GMT
Yikes, smothering. Here I thought I WAS being concise. Owning all my feelings, letting her know I'm here if she wants to pursue this.
The longing I feel is compounded I think by the fact that we have not dated. Never even kissed. But over the course of the last 4 months, I fell very hard for her and she said she reciprocated the feelings. She was launched into her own confusion because at the time she was in a long-term, long-distance relationship. But she's very inexperienced. That was her first committed relationship. And it appeared that my feelings for her seemed more intense than hers. Discovering this attachment stuff, she seems quite Avoidant. She's not comfortable talking about her feelings. Literally avoids anyone she has feelings for. So that made me distrust her admission that she had feelings for me, because mine seemed way more intense. Presumably made to feel more intense because I couldn't get the closeness I craved.
When I told her during our conversation I needed space, she said "so you're kind of breaking up with me?" And that's what it feels like.
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liz
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Post by liz on Oct 29, 2018 2:50:41 GMT
Hi standintheheart, I'm a secure and I find your texts clear and quite touching. If I have feelings for you, I would be delighted to receive such texts, they sound sincere, caring and loving. I would be touched that you found the courage to be vulnerable and open up to me. If I like you back, I'd take them as the cue to deepen our relationship. However, I don't know how a DA would feel about them. I get the feeling that with her short and ambiguous reply, she isn't in the same space as you. She doesn't sound very sympathetic. Therefore I'd advise that you pull back and start to protect yourself and your emotions. To the right partner, what you wrote would sound wonderful and authentic.
I didn't feel that it was fair when she said "So you're kinda breaking up with me?" as you were never together. She didn't start anything officially with you. This sounds like she would like to hang onto your crush for her and not letting you pull away to heal or find someone else. I feel that you should force her to make a choice of either bringing this to the next level into a real relationship or to cut the ambiguity to free both of you to move on to more committed relationships and partners.
To add to my post, I once had a really great guy who liked me a lot but I was unsure about my feelings for him. He was good looking but playful, with a bit of a reputation, so I was a little skeptical even though he sounded sincere. There were also other aspects to him that I didn't find attractive. I wasn't sure at all if I really liked him, as there were aspects that I liked and sides that I didn't. Her replies reminded me of how I talked to this guy whom I cared for a lot as a friend, but who wasn't a clear potential lover. I couldn't give a direct "Yes".
He remained as a good friend, and is married to a wonderful woman. I'm always happy for him, and wish nothing but the very best for his life.
It is much kinder when one party is truly unsure to stop the other party hanging on.
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Post by tnr9 on Oct 29, 2018 2:56:40 GMT
Yikes, smothering. Here I thought I WAS being concise. Owning all my feelings, letting her know I'm here if she wants to pursue this. The longing I feel is compounded I think by the fact that we have not dated. Never even kissed. But over the course of the last 4 months, I fell very hard for her and she said she reciprocated the feelings. She was launched into her own confusion because at the time she was in a long-term, long-distance relationship. But she's very inexperienced. That was her first committed relationship. And it appeared that my feelings for her seemed more intense than hers. Discovering this attachment stuff, she seems quite Avoidant. She's not comfortable talking about her feelings. Literally avoids anyone she has feelings for. So that made me distrust her admission that she had feelings for me, because mine seemed way more intense. Presumably made to feel more intense because I couldn't get the closeness I craved. When I told her during our conversation I needed space, she said "so you're kind of breaking up with me?" And that's what it feels like. Concise would be...I need to take a bit of a break and focus on my stuff. I still care for you and I wish you well. That is ok...I do exactly what you have in text when I am in person with B. I have a hard time boiling down what I want to say and not putting a lot of emotion into it. He knows this and we have joked about it. I think text is not the best medium when you have important things to share...because there is no way to determine how the other person has received your message and as APs, we get caught up in wanting to get it all out. I am sure to you, you boiled your text down as there was likely a lot more going on in your head...but the question I have to ask myself and the one that I think you may want to ask is...why am I feeling the need to share this much with someone who is not my partner and not my best friend? Is there a secret motive behind the sharing that I am not being honest with myself about? Am I secretly hoping that the other person will respond in a manner that shows interest? Believe me..I am also working on this as well. Good luck. |
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Post by cris88 on Oct 29, 2018 3:28:23 GMT
Just a question that I had to ask myself: Why do we lust so much after someone who has clearly stated they don't want us back or at all? They don't want the cuddles, kisses and the life sharing. Why bother so much if it's not in our hands? I understand the heartbreak and pain in silence until healing but why keep denigrating oneself in hopes on getting a different answer?
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Post by mrob on Oct 29, 2018 3:50:11 GMT
See, I think she was clear, too. You made other priorities. That’s taking a break. What she does is her business.
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Post by faithopelove on Oct 29, 2018 5:30:07 GMT
Agreed faithopelove....very eye opening for me as well. I think there is a bit of trying to self sooth by being 100% honest and I also think trying to make sure that nothing is misunderstood to avoid confusion, but inadvertently causing pressure to or smothering the other person. Hey, tnr9...Yes, it comes across as dramatic and unstable...esp to an avoidant who already has difficulty opening up and expressing and receiving emotion. When reading objectively, without trying to defend, coerce, persuade etc I can see how in the avoidant’s eyes (or secure) the message can be off putting at best or feel like manipulation or instability at worse. Neither is good for the AP as a partner. |
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Post by faithopelove on Oct 29, 2018 5:47:37 GMT
Yikes, smothering. Here I thought I WAS being concise. Owning all my feelings, letting her know I'm here if she wants to pursue this. The longing I feel is compounded I think by the fact that we have not dated. Never even kissed. But over the course of the last 4 months, I fell very hard for her and she said she reciprocated the feelings. She was launched into her own confusion because at the time she was in a long-term, long-distance relationship. But she's very inexperienced. That was her first committed relationship. And it appeared that my feelings for her seemed more intense than hers. Discovering this attachment stuff, she seems quite Avoidant. She's not comfortable talking about her feelings. Literally avoids anyone she has feelings for. So that made me distrust her admission that she had feelings for me, because mine seemed way more intense. Presumably made to feel more intense because I couldn't get the closeness I craved. When I told her during our conversation I needed space, she said "so you're kind of breaking up with me?" And that's what it feels like. Yes, if I was not yet ready to move things forward bc I was in the space of trying to get over an old relationship or just not ready to reciprocate feelings for a guy- these declarations of feelings would scare me away...and I’m an AP so I’m generally open and have a desire to express myself and have a partner who does so. I think I would be leery here bc it’s not someone I’m in a relationship with sharing their deep, personal feelings for me. It would make me think the person is flying forward, too fast and too soon, and that would cause me to mistrust those feelings. To me, it would be overwhelming and a red flag. As an AP I get the desire to communicate your feelings and be understood, but I would try to keep the texting to a minimum- I now keep to what would fit in one text bubble on my screen, and save heavier conversations for phone calls or face to face...and again, the heavy conversations would be understandable if it’s your partner. If she is avoidant, as you expect, be especially careful not to overwhelm with too much emotion. That’s my take on it as an AP with an avoidant ex, plus what I’ve learned about trying to balance emotional self-control with expression. |
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Post by faithopelove on Oct 29, 2018 5:55:47 GMT
Concise would be...I need to take a bit of a break and focus on my stuff. I still care for you and I wish you well.
That is ok...I do exactly what you have in text when I am in person with B. I have a hard time boiling down what I want to say and not putting a lot of emotion into it. He knows this and we have joked about it.
Yes, my ex used to joke about my over texting emotionally too- until losing self-control combined with texting led to our break. We don’t joke about it anymore. I drove him away and caused him to distrust me with my texts. I’m now very much aware of what and how I text him. Maybe that’s why this poster’s texts sent off alarm bells in me. I’ve had other guys open up and share things like this before a first date and it killed my attraction and made me leery...seemed clingy and scared me away. And I’m AP...
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Post by lilyg on Oct 29, 2018 8:47:11 GMT
Welcome to the forums  Something like this happened to me, but I was the girl. I had recenlty broke up with my ex and I was grieving a lot. I met an amazing guy but I sadly couldn't give him what he needed to be happy, as I was nowhere near to be able to make an intimate connection with anybody. So we decided to let it rest for a while, as I had a lot of thinking and healing to do. This very kind guy emailed me a couple of times and I answered as best as I could, but he kept messanging me and pushing to see me and I just couldn't deal with it anymore. While I was thinking that maybe we could see each other after I put some order in my thoughts and feelings he made me feel like he wasn't really listening or hearing me. She's stating she understands as her heart is broken too. She's being clear too: she's grieving and she hopes it'll pass for both of you. You're not dating each other. Let her have space and have some space for you. Right now you're very anxious and we make not very good decisions while activated, as we are blind to reality. If you keep writing her about this you're pushing for an answer that you'll not be getting and that, my friend, it's protest behaviour. Come here if you're feeling anxious instead of writing her. We're here. |
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liz
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Post by liz on Oct 29, 2018 12:06:59 GMT
I see that your question is to ask about the clarity of your communication.
Let me paraphrase this - you have been talking to her for a while now, as she processes her break up. A red flag for me is that you might become the Rebound Guy, offering her essential support during a difficult time for her while holding hopes that this might form a strong enough connection to lead to something more further down.
You are open to co-create any "plans" of hers, i.e. if she were to say she needs more time before she decides if it is possible for both of you to start a real relationship as bf/gf, you're fine. You need to know if a "plan" is possibly in the works on her side?
However, it is difficult for you at the moment because your feelings are running ahead and you are looking into holding back from this constant contact in an unsure state to protect yourself. So you rightfully want some clarity. Her reply doesn't sound like she wants to talk about a possible plan for a future. It is something akin to "Let's stay in touch."
You have left the door opened for her with no ambiguity, kudos to you for that. I like how you are inviting her to share your world if she were to be ready. It's good that you are not rushing things as she recovers, especially not pressuring her into a sexual relationship, but how dating would look like with you.
It is possible that it is still too early and she needs time before she can decide, but that's not what she's saying in her reply. She isn't cautiously putting a foot in (eg. "let me think it over and get back to you...") but remains neutrally standing outside as you held the door open. Her short reply is also quite clear to me - if you read more into her words, then you're weaving your own narrative around it. Your AP side is the one wondering if you had worded it another way would the outcome had been different, etc. You are conscious enough to know that you could be doing this dance for a long time as an AP, and seeks clarity to protect yourself, so more kudos to you. It is very hard to overcome the primordial attraction - like a wise man once said, it takes a minute to get into a crush, a day to fall in love, and a lifetime to forget someone. So make sure you are able to pace your love for her, or start making the efforts to extricate yourself.
I'd say that both of you have been very clear in your communication, but you're finding it hard to accept her reply, hence your dilemma.
If you can continue to be her shoulder to cry on without getting more involved emotionally, by all means. However, if you will fall harder the longer you spend time with her in this limbo state, and could possibly hurt yourself when what you invest in is ultimately unreciprocated, then you really should protect yourself and pull away.
On my part, I've erased all possible contact with my DA crush to force myself to look elsewhere, since I know it will simply burn up my time and gets me nowhere. I've started talking to men I don't feel attracted to but who sound secure, and will meet two of them this week. I still don't feel the same attraction for them, but I want to find out what being with a secure feels like, and who knows maybe I will like one of them in person more than their photos. I open my door to let others in because I'm not holding out for the one who is unavailable to me.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2018 12:18:43 GMT
I feel that you wearing your heart on your sleeve was healthy... whether your communication styles are compatible is a totally different matter. What matters more is whether your communication style feels congruent and like a true expression of who you are, what you want, and what you need. There's a lot of pain in being AP, and sometimes we don't get who we want for the sake of getting what we actually want from a source we can actually get it
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