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Post by dhali on Oct 29, 2019 19:51:26 GMT
And as I write this, my FA is reaching out to me. Sometimes we know our FAs better than anyone else. I am going to take some time before I reply, and we'll go from there... It's your situation, but after what you've been through, what are looking to get out of an interaction? Get back together? Is that wise? I get that you think knowing the situation makes it manageable, but this is your life. Do you really want it with someone who has one foot out the door? An apology? OK, but does it really matter? I guess it lets you sleep better every night to know someone didn't purposely do you harm, and owned that they did do you harm. But that's not a need. And you're opening up a whole can of pain/interaction/push/pull. Do you ever get tired of it all? There are people out there who will love you for who you are and not make you jump around all the time. My suggestion is to take time for YOU. Don't answer the text. Ever. Maybe in 2-3 months, but only if you've picked up a new hobby and 5 new friends. This is self care. We are all looking for someone to make us feel better. Make yourself feel better, and you'll never go back to this nightmare again. And that's what this has turned into for you. A nightmare. You're spending your free time on an attachment forum discussing all the ways your ex has triggered you, after her getting triggered. Get out of the house and experience the world in new ways. This person will drag you down, and you won't end up with her in the end. You might even waste a few more years of your life |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 19:56:13 GMT
My SE therapist trained by Diane Poole Heller explains that in anxious activation or avoidant deactivation, cognitive thought is off line and I can largely attest to that- However I know I have to pick up my children from school, answer important messages (yess even if ao don't want to) and generally adult as per usual. Am I numb? Yep. Exhausted? Yes. I barely eat or drink. I don't feel attached really. But do I stop paying rent, or going to work? No. And, I don't ignore people I am accountable to. I consider an intimate partner someone I am rightfully accountable to.
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Post by dhali on Oct 29, 2019 20:00:10 GMT
Yes, your prefrontal cortex can go off-line. That happens when I'm mad too. I used to throw things as a kid. Does that mean I can't control that now? Surely I can, and I do. I don't even yell anymore. I take space, and deal with my emotions and then plug back in. Why? Because I'm responsible for how I show up. There are NO excuses for that, and handicapping someone on this is doing them a disservice.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 20:10:49 GMT
Yes, your prefrontal cortex can go off-line. That happens when I'm mad too. I used to throw things as a kid. Does that mean I can't control that now? Surely I can, and I do. I don't even yell anymore. I take space, and deal with my emotions and then plug back in. Why? Because I'm responsible for how I show up. There are NO excuses for that, and handicapping someone on this is doing them a disservice. Absolutely agree!!! We don't turn into mindless zombies with no control. I don't live in the same state as my therapist, we work over facetime- but when he and I discussed this he literally high fived his computer at me for not being a ghoster. It would have been the first thing he had to call me out on I'm sure but we skipped it. Because yeah. I don't lose my conscience and capacity to be decent. I withdraw. I don't disappear and just ignore. It irks me to see that minimized but each of us is allowed to be irked. It happens. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 20:19:00 GMT
When we talk about survival, it's important to know these are background processes. They can be intense. But it's not like having a delusion that you're in a burning building and you're actually having to just jump out the window. Panic, ok, but when an AP panics and gets mad also do they go kill someone? Only if they are mentally ill also. Do they know that they are not dying? Like, do they go to the hospital and check into the emergency room because they gave NO concept of normal; and they don't know that they are not actually perishing from these intense feelings? I don't think so, but I don't know as an expert: I also don't know inside an FA mind but I don't see people in general going full on incapacitated unless there is something going on. I mean, if a pizza guy shows up with a pizza they don't run for cover right? It's attachment not full on PTSD, unless it is full on PTSD and then we are talking about some thing else (which the ghoster and a therapist should be included on, that convo...)
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Post by anne12 on Oct 29, 2019 20:37:28 GMT
Be carefull not to confuse the desorganised reactions with the typical AP reactions or the typical DA reactions.
For some triggered into FA state - depending on the situation and the trigger - it can actually feel like its about life or death on the instinktive level.
I am not saying whether or not it is healthy to be in a relationship with somebody with some desorganized attatchment style.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 20:38:50 GMT
I can see dissociation and freeze but seriously if it's going on for days and weeks and months, that person is not in a place to be in a relationship with another person who has needs:
Especially of the trigger is a text, I just don't see it. I'm not a genius but this seems over the top to me; and serious intervention is needed before a relationship can happen.
That's what I meant by saying, thwre is a level of health that facilitates a relationship and one that doesn't. If a person is ghosting and panicking for days and weeks and months that's not something a partner will be able to help with much- that's for the trained professionals in my opinion!
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Post by Dualcitizen on Oct 29, 2019 21:04:06 GMT
When we talk about survival, it's important to know these are background processes. They can be intense. But it's not like having a delusion that you're in a burning building and you're actually having to just jump out the window. Panic, ok, but when an AP panics and gets mad also do they go kill someone? Only if they are mentally ill also. Do they know that they are not dying? Like, do they go to the hospital and check into the emergency room because they gave NO concept of normal; and they don't know that they are not actually perishing from these intense feelings? I don't think so, but I don't know as an expert: I also don't know inside an FA mind but I don't see people in general going full on incapacitated unless there is something going on. I mean, if a pizza guy shows up with a pizza they don't run for cover right? It's attachment not full on PTSD, unless it is full on PTSD and then we are talking about some thing else (which the ghoster and a therapist should be included on, that convo...) As far as I've read, Disorganised attachment is directly linked to C-PTSD and trauma. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 21:09:29 GMT
When we talk about survival, it's important to know these are background processes. They can be intense. But it's not like having a delusion that you're in a burning building and you're actually having to just jump out the window. Panic, ok, but when an AP panics and gets mad also do they go kill someone? Only if they are mentally ill also. Do they know that they are not dying? Like, do they go to the hospital and check into the emergency room because they gave NO concept of normal; and they don't know that they are not actually perishing from these intense feelings? I don't think so, but I don't know as an expert: I also don't know inside an FA mind but I don't see people in general going full on incapacitated unless there is something going on. I mean, if a pizza guy shows up with a pizza they don't run for cover right? It's attachment not full on PTSD, unless it is full on PTSD and then we are talking about some thing else (which the ghoster and a therapist should be included on, that convo...) As far as I've read, Disorganised attachment is directly linked to C-PTSD and trauma. Yes, but if the trauma is so impactful that they go off line for periods of time and cannot be accountable to a partner, they aren't healthy enough for a partner (especially if not even professionally addressing it specifically). And it seems that accounts bear that out. That's what it looks like to me, just from the stories here and the research? fA is on a spectrum also, so if it's that serious that disappearance is happening, that's not couple stuff, it's individual therapy stuff IMHO. |
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Post by dhali on Oct 29, 2019 21:14:17 GMT
It’s a great deal if you can get it. Let’s be a couple, but I’m not ever accountable for any of my actions because none of it is malicious. Even the non desire to work on things
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Post by stu on Oct 29, 2019 21:15:28 GMT
I can't quote the research like others might be able to, so not even going to try  but what I've read from a lot of people who have researched it on the forum and past FAs is that it is often an unaware and unconscious state. They're sometimes (not always of course) acting out of a freeze state which they retreat to for survival. Or maybe they know but can't control it or at the time think that the other person is going to cause harm to them — that whole making someone out as a bad person thing. I'd think that most people haven't "allowed" them to do it, that's why they typically have very few close relationships, and why you'll hear countless stories of rocky relationships as those FAs who have kindly and vulnerably shared their personal experiences here. Just some thoughts based on all that I've read, but I'm not FA or a therapist, so I can't speak with 100% certainty. I think the awareness discussed is related to why they feel certain ways. Not that they think their actions are acceptable forms of human behavior. Unless we are talking about mental impairment... From my understanding a lot of times with an FA is the need to escape and protect oneself so ghosting as a means of severe avoidance because of the underlying panic and need to get away, but once that initial inpulse settles because it doesn't nexessirely last week's or months. There is the low self esteem factor and the dread about re connecting because of the consequences of their behavior. Someone who thinks poorly of themselves doing something incredibly hurtful and knowing it. And then being afraid to deal with the situation properly. It doesn't make it right and that's still on them to address as adults. But it does give you a sense of context behind things. Albiet it's very immature and not cool to do to anyone. |
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Post by stu on Oct 29, 2019 21:18:56 GMT
I can see dissociation and freeze but seriously if it's going on for days and weeks and months, that person is not in a place to be in a relationship with another person who has needs: Especially of the trigger is a text, I just don't see it. I'm not a genius but this seems over the top to me; and serious intervention is needed before a relationship can happen. That's what I meant by saying, thwre is a level of health that facilitates a relationship and one that doesn't. If a person is ghosting and panicking for days and weeks and months that's not something a partner will be able to help with much- that's for the trained professionals in my opinion! Agreed I don't think there's anyone here that feels someone who ghosts for weeks and months is healthy to be with. They are just trying to understand what's going on and what it would take for the other person to be healthier. To see if there was anything they could do to help out or resolve the situation besides leaving. The whole being in love with someone part is tough. Even though they have these issues, there is also the connection and relationship that goes beyond all of that . And that can be very difficult for anyone to let go of. |
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Post by serenity on Oct 29, 2019 21:28:58 GMT
And as I write this, my FA is reaching out to me. Sometimes we know our FAs better than anyone else. I am going to take some time before I reply, and we'll go from there... This is good NYC. In my own experiences, the `slow response' game is something my ex was much better at than me. His pattern would be if I didn't respond for a few days, then responded, he'd text a bit then ghost again, leaving me feeling anxious all over again. If I may make a suggestion, you're going to feel a lot less anxious and get a lot more respect from him in the long run if you don't reply at all for weeks, and preferably for a full month. It makes a huge difference when its on your terms, which it will be. He more than deserves it.. he ghosted you for 2 months, then recently for a week, and now he's got flakey again. Its unacceptable behaviour, he knows it. If you can, make your stand now. It works out much better in the long run. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 21:35:53 GMT
I think the awareness discussed is related to why they feel certain ways. Not that they think their actions are acceptable forms of human behavior. Unless we are talking about mental impairment... From my understanding a lot of times with an FA is the need to escape and protect oneself so ghosting as a means of severe avoidance because of the underlying panic and need to get away, but once that initial inpulse settles because it doesn't nexessirely last week's or months. There is the low self esteem factor and the dread about re connecting because of the consequences of their behavior. Someone who thinks poorly of themselves doing something incredibly hurtful and knowing it. And then being afraid to deal with the situation properly. It doesn't make it right and that's still on them to address as adults. But it does give you a sense of context behind things. Albiet it's very immature and not cool to do to anyone. Agreed; and also it ought to be recalled that sometimes disappearance is to engage a new love interest. Sometimes affairs create distance. The whole thing of making assumptions and hoping for the best, is dicey, at best. |
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Post by Deleted on Oct 29, 2019 21:37:59 GMT
It’s a great deal if you can get it. Let’s be a couple, but I’m not ever accountable for any of my actions because none of it is malicious. Even the non desire to work on things And,yes, be there for me- we know this is a super serious problem, I feel like I am dying sometimes... and no, I'm not looking into it. No therapy for me. I'll see ya when I see ya. (?) |
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