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Post by nyc718 on Jan 2, 2020 3:29:38 GMT
I sound like a broken record. Avoidants don’t operate in a vacuum. It takes two to be involved in this dance. This man has deactivated and this part of the cycle. Strangely enough, I’ve experienced both sides of this recently, and know what it’s like to be all consumed and ruminating. It’s an awful place. With one, I had to hold my breath and block her after she’d call me in the middle of the night with a few drinks under her belt, and I’d asked her not to. I was entranced, but incredibly conflicted. With the help of here, I held my nose and blocked her, and it got better. I’ve never rejected someone unless deactivated before. Thanks for reiterating this, it is helpful. But it wasn't helpful for me before I knew what avoidant attachment was. I just thought this guy is massively confused and really being a complete jerk, especially after he had been consistent for months. and now he was canceling on me, making these vague plans only to ghost out on me, then getting all apologetic, and then throwing crumbs at me. I had no idea I was part of any "dance". I thought I was being patient with a man who was going through some stuff. It's amazing how connected the mind/body/emotions are both with and without our control or input. Amazing, and also frustrating. |
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Post by amber on Jan 2, 2020 3:30:55 GMT
We had some contact last night with plans to meet and discuss his incongruencies prior to breaking up. So I think I’m massively triggered by this.in his texts it came across (I am probably reading too much into this) like he is over it and has moved on. There’s a part of me that wishes he would still be pining for me and be in pain like I am or realising what he has lost! Did he initiate this or did you? Would you consider NOT meeting with him and having this conversation until you've done some healing on your end so you are not so triggered by the whole encounter? You may come out feeling worse after the fact. I sent him a long text right after we broke up expressing my feelings. He said he wanted to respond in person (he’s not a big writer or texter)...I agreed but said it would need to wait.i waited a month and felt I wanted to talk so I could get it over with and have closure as it feels like like it’s lingering and not allowing me to move on. I am having conversations with him in my head a lot lol. He texted me today and said he would like to meet sooner rather than later,I asked why and he said it would be nice to see me and that talking was overdue. So I feel I need to bite the bullet and do it. Probably will get activated but the anticipation of having the convo is killing me and I just want it done |
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Post by amber on Jan 2, 2020 3:32:09 GMT
Yeah I actually feel dizzy and nauseous over this. By far and away the most triggered I’ve ever felt in r/ship, and I’ve had two long term ones, one that went for almost seven years.i am NOT blaming him for the triggers either,I get they are old wounds, and that I was attracted to him for a reason. But omg can’t believe how much this person pushes my attachment buttons! I've said this countless times, but hypnotherapy helped me immensely to get to that place where my head and my subconscious could agree, so that the pain from my most recent breakup hasn't been as difficult as it could be. The body is sensing danger and it's hard for it to not connect it directly to your current situation. Please give it a shot! And I hope it's as helpful as it was for me. I was very motivated too, so I know that had a lot to do with how well it worked for me. [ Thankyou I will look into this for sure!! |
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Post by mrob on Jan 2, 2020 3:48:49 GMT
I sound like a broken record. Avoidants don’t operate in a vacuum. It takes two to be involved in this dance. This man has deactivated and this part of the cycle. Strangely enough, I’ve experienced both sides of this recently, and know what it’s like to be all consumed and ruminating. It’s an awful place. With one, I had to hold my breath and block her after she’d call me in the middle of the night with a few drinks under her belt, and I’d asked her not to. I was entranced, but incredibly conflicted. With the help of here, I held my nose and blocked her, and it got better. I’ve never rejected someone unless deactivated before. Thanks for reiterating this, it is helpful. But it wasn't helpful for me before I knew what avoidant attachment was. I just thought this guy is massively confused and really being a complete jerk, especially after he had been consistent for months. and now he was canceling on me, making these vague plans only to ghost out on me, then getting all apologetic, and then throwing crumbs at me. I had no idea I was part of any "dance". I thought I was being patient with a man who was going through some stuff. It's amazing how connected the mind/body/emotions are both with and without our control or input. Amazing, and also frustrating. I think you might have misunderstood. This wasn’t a ghosting. This was a “I cannot talk to you in the middle of the night when you’re loaded. If you keep doing that, I can’t speak to you anymore”. It was my first reasonable handling of someone who I really liked but had a dealbreaker. It was actually progress. It was painful. |
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 2, 2020 4:18:54 GMT
Thanks for reiterating this, it is helpful. But it wasn't helpful for me before I knew what avoidant attachment was. I just thought this guy is massively confused and really being a complete jerk, especially after he had been consistent for months. and now he was canceling on me, making these vague plans only to ghost out on me, then getting all apologetic, and then throwing crumbs at me. I had no idea I was part of any "dance". I thought I was being patient with a man who was going through some stuff. It's amazing how connected the mind/body/emotions are both with and without our control or input. Amazing, and also frustrating. I think you might have misunderstood. This wasn’t a ghosting. This was a “I cannot talk to you in the middle of the night when you’re loaded. If you keep doing that, I can’t speak to you anymore”. It was my first reasonable handling of someone who I really liked but had a dealbreaker. It was actually progress. It was painful. No, I wasn't saying YOU were ghosting, I know why you were cutting her off. What I was referencing was when my ex would make vague plans, then not follow up at all on those plans, thus ghosting me on those vague plans. |
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Post by mrob on Jan 2, 2020 4:57:01 GMT
Gotcha. I see. Yes, I’ve done that too.
This attachment stuff is amazing. I haven’t been surprised yet. A couple of red flags and the behaviour just follows. It’s just the timeframe. Honestly, it’s frightening how accurate this is.
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Post by serenity on Jan 2, 2020 4:58:22 GMT
Did he initiate this or did you? Would you consider NOT meeting with him and having this conversation until you've done some healing on your end so you are not so triggered by the whole encounter? You may come out feeling worse after the fact. I sent him a long text right after we broke up expressing my feelings. He said he wanted to respond in person (he’s not a big writer or texter)...I agreed but said it would need to wait.i waited a month and felt I wanted to talk so I could get it over with and have closure as it feels like like it’s lingering and not allowing me to move on. I am having conversations with him in my head a lot lol. He texted me today and said he would like to meet sooner rather than later,I asked why and he said it would be nice to see me and that talking was overdue. So I feel I need to bite the bullet and do it. Probably will get activated but the anticipation of having the convo is killing me and I just want it done Amber, good luck. I know that feeling of wanting to know you explored every option, and how hard it is to let go if you think there's still a chance of reconciliation. We got your back <3 Be careful not to start a `friendship' if your feelings for him are not platonic yet. This video is really good for figuring out how to honor yourself in these situations : youtu.be/p0jGCnZ5yUc |
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jules
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Post by jules on Jan 2, 2020 10:22:58 GMT
So, this new guy is not FA or avoidant at all. I dont think. Lol.
I texted with him a bit yesterday and it really just is his having to get his life inline. Hes open to a relationship in the future. I left it at that and reiterated no contact.
I think I'm done with dating for a bit.
And I'm ok with that. I am happiest alone to be honest. No vulnerability, no hurt.
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 2, 2020 15:06:54 GMT
So, this new guy is not FA or avoidant at all. I dont think. Lol. I texted with him a bit yesterday and it really just is his having to get his life inline. Hes open to a relationship in the future. I left it at that and reiterated no contact. I think I'm done with dating for a bit. And I'm ok with that. I am happiest alone to be honest. No vulnerability, no hurt. I'm not totally sure about that..I think saying needing to get their life in line is actually a common excuse used to be avoidant, you know? Either way, he's not available and that's all you need to know. Don't give up on dating, just keep your eyes and heart wide open to the red flags. Seems you are very well aware that this one isn't the right one for you. |
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 2, 2020 15:52:14 GMT
I hate to be a downer but I agree with nyc718...I think the "I need to get my life in order and work out a plan" is a very common avoidant line of thinking, especially when there is no other real "issue" in the relationship for them to latch on to in order to explain away that cringe/dread/anxious feeling they are having. My ex said this exact thing to me when I called him out about ignoring my needs a month ago. I have no doubt it's what he believes and is probably true to some degree, but if he was capable of being in a relationship with me he just would, period. For what it's worth, I am also taking a break from dating as I want to be able to (and I bring this up only as a different way to think about being single from how you framed it) be selfish for a bit-do my own thing, relearn how to value myself without the validation of a partner in my life, as well as to really allow myself to both grieve and honor the relationship I had with my FA ex. I would tell him often how I had a truly amazing connection with him and I wasn't just bullshitting so I think to me, giving the ending of the relationship the reverence it deserves is part of not dating right away (or even for awhile). Not that anyone has to agree with my line of thinking but that's how I'm approaching being single-as something I am CHOOSING as opposed to something that is being hoisted upon me by shitty circumstances. Here's to TwentyTwenty as we all forge our own paths in this crazy shit world, and hell, if we can say we ended the year better than we started it then I say that's a success! We got dis ladies and gents. <3 |
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Post by nyc718 on Jan 2, 2020 16:08:23 GMT
I hate to be a downer but I agree with nyc718 ...I think the "I need to get my life in order and work out a plan" is a very common avoidant line of thinking, especially when there is no other real "issue" in the relationship for them to latch on to in order to explain away that cringe/dread/anxious feeling they are having. My ex said this exact thing to me when I called him out about ignoring my needs a month ago. I have no doubt it's what he believes and is probably true to some degree, but if he was capable of being in a relationship with me he just would, period. Yes, that ex FA had told me he was "slammed with work" when he started distancing, but the previous six months before, we had had a pattern of being in touch every day, as well as seeing each other on a regular basis, and now he was slammed with work where he couldn't even respond to my text for days? It didn't make sense, especially not knowing a thing about avoidants. I truly thought I was losing my mind, and then thankfully, I realized it was him who was losing his mind, not me. |
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jules
Full Member
Posts: 142
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Post by jules on Jan 2, 2020 16:29:10 GMT
May very well be.
But I shall be over here doing my own thing. Too much rejection in short amount of time. I need a break. And I'm good with that. Looking forward to it.
We shall see how long that lasts. Lol
Thank you!!
xx
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Post by kittygirl on Jan 2, 2020 19:02:15 GMT
I sound like a broken record. Avoidants don’t operate in a vacuum. It takes two to be involved in this dance. This man has deactivated and this part of the cycle. mrob I see you say this a lot, but I guess I am a bit confused by what you mean. Please know that I may be totally misunderstanding what you are saying...so don't take offense as I can be really obtuse so I may be missing your point entirely! But here's my issue....I can't imagine that any of us would think it reasonable to say that being with a secure person "fixed" an FA individual (we would all agree that is due to a lot of hard work on the part of the FA), so it seems just as unfair to in any way "blame" an AP partner when considering the AP/FA dynamic and role that each person plays in that? At the end of the day, a person can only be responsible for their own behavior.
As I see it, the only real difference between being secure and being AP in these relationships is the length of time it goes on and how volatile the relationship becomes. But I am secure, and ultimately that had no effect on my ex's erratic behavior (he used to say things to me like "I'm having obsessive thoughts about you" and "all day I just wonder what you are doing, I'm extremely jealous of you"-so totally AP triggered, to ultimately treating me like a distant coworker with one word text replies for the last month of our relationship) despite my behavior remaining the same. I know that alexandra has spoken about how her earning secure made no difference in the deactivation behavior with her ex compared to when she was AP, and if I recall correctly, you have talked about deactivating from the woman who brought you to these forums despite her being secure.
I don't mean to be an asshole but I do want to learn from others (particularly from you since you have been so willing to be open with your struggles here)...so I guess I am wondering what you mean by this. Are you only referring to accepting someone back after they deactivate? Or the push/pull stuff in general? Just curious.
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Post by serenity on Jan 2, 2020 20:53:03 GMT
I sound like a broken record. Avoidants don’t operate in a vacuum. It takes two to be involved in this dance. This man has deactivated and this part of the cycle. mrob I see you say this a lot, but I guess I am a bit confused by what you mean. Please know that I may be totally misunderstanding what you are saying...so don't take offense as I can be really obtuse so I may be missing your point entirely! But here's my issue....I can't imagine that any of us would think it reasonable to say that being with a secure person "fixed" an FA individual (we would all agree that is due to a lot of hard work on the part of the FA), so it seems just as unfair to in any way "blame" an AP partner when considering the AP/FA dynamic and role that each person plays in that? At the end of the day, a person can only be responsible for their own behavior.
As I see it, the only real difference between being secure and being AP in these relationships is the length of time it goes on and how volatile the relationship becomes. But I am secure, and ultimately that had no effect on my ex's erratic behavior (he used to say things to me like "I'm having obsessive thoughts about you" and "all day I just wonder what you are doing, I'm extremely jealous of you"-so totally AP triggered, to ultimately treating me like a distant coworker with one word text replies for the last month of our relationship) despite my behavior remaining the same. I know that alexandra has spoken about how her earning secure made no difference in the deactivation behavior with her ex compared to when she was AP, and if I recall correctly, you have talked about deactivating from the woman who brought you to these forums despite her being secure.
I don't mean to be an asshole but I do want to learn from others (particularly from you since you have been so willing to be open with your struggles here)...so I guess I am wondering what you mean by this. Are you only referring to accepting someone back after they deactivate? Or the push/pull stuff in general? Just curious.
This resonates with me as well. As a partner of an avoidant, you can be responsible for things like choosing an unavailable, unaware partner (if they have not lied or misled you...many avoidants misrepresent themselves, act consistently `in love' for months, or talk a good game), you can be responsible for not acting out anxiously or manipulatively (even though intermittent reinforcement causes a great deal of anxiety), and you can choose to to end the relationship when patterns of avoidance become clear. In my experiences, the avoidance occurs because of closeness initiated by them, or conflict caused by their cycles of negativity. You might never even hear about the conflict. Acting out anxiously makes it worse, but doesn't `cause' the avoidant behaviour. You can't win. You can only forfeit your needs and boundaries to keep the relationship going. Seems like all you're really left with is striving to evaluate people properly from the beginning of your interactions, since reciprocal, heart-connected relationships with unaware avoidants can't work. That takes experience, meanwhile people get hurt  |
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Post by alexandra on Jan 2, 2020 20:55:59 GMT
kittygirl serenity, I always take what mrob is saying with this to be, you know the deal (even if you aren't familiar with attachment theory, you can see the partner isn't fully emotionally available) and are choosing to try to stay and make it work anyway. Even though you're kind of banging your head against the wall or over functioning in the relationship. So look at yourself to figure out what's driving you to do that instead of cutting it off? It makes it worse if you're acting out of a triggered AP space, because then maybe you are being overwhelming to someone who has less capacity than the average person to handle it. Or, your protest behavior is unfair to the other person and making things worse. But overall, you can act completely secure and the FA won't step up, in which case why do you choose to believe it's a relationship that can be changed if the FA isn't going through their own process to heal their FA issues?
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