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Post by jeffrey on Mar 24, 2020 4:53:23 GMT
Hello all. I'm a first time poster. But I am familiar with the boards. I stumbled across them a few years ago. This will be long winded.
I'll tell you of my current situation with my girlfriend.
I first met her years ago. And I gotta say, I was attracted to her at first glance. She is absolutely beautiful, inside and out. I struck up a conversation with her and got her number. However, after trying several times to get her on a date, she would never agree to plans. I chalked it up to non interest, and moved on.
Fast forward 3 years, and we run into each other again. And this time she was more engaged to my surprise. She had just gotten out of a relationship with her children's father and we kinda fell into an fwb kinda thing. And this "relationship" lasted only 2 months. In that time we went out on actual dates, I met her children, and we mingled in our social circles. And I gotta say, for me, I did start to have feelings. I did notice that some things were kinda "off". She never came to my place, and if I stayed at hers she usually wanted me to sleep in the other room. She cried a few times over wrongly perceived rejection I guess you could call it, over my not wanting to do some activities she wanted to do. Towards the end of the 2 months, she invited me over and she was very drunk. She told me to stay away from her because she was toxic. I remember thinking to myself that that was my decision. Anyhow, she started distancing herself after that. With limited communication after that, I became anxious. And by the following weekend it was over. Afterwards I remember I had a feeling of WTF actually just happened? And that's when I found these boards.
This brings me to now. It's been a few years since we've seen each other. And last fall she reached out to me on Facebook. She told me she missed me and I reciprocated that remark. It took a few more weeks but we eventually got together and have been together since. It progressed quickly. She actually came to my place where I made dinner we cuddled and had sex and spent the day together. In early December she asked me to be her boyfriend and I said yes. The next few months were rather nice. Getting to know each other, taking her children out for fun times, and generally just enjoying each others company.
I should say she is in school for a degree at this time and her time is precious. I would let her know how much I appreciate her making time for me. She even remarked how she does it because she wants to. But her schooling is very stressful, and given our highly charged sexual nature, we made a big mistake and got pregnant. We discussed that now is not the time to raise a baby and agreed to have an abortion. We did discuss how we would like to try for a baby in the future when the time is better. I was more worried about her physical and emotional being through this process more than anything else. We went through with it and I was there to support her every step of the way. In the few weeks after the abortion my fears dissipated as I felt that the process had actually brought us closer together. Well...
Along came coronavirus.
The problem I'm having basically came along last weekend. We usually spend Saturday evening together after shes done working. She never showed up. So I reached out and she said she was tired and not feeling well. I wished her well and tried to let it go. But the thing that got me was that she didn't have the consideration to tell me she wasnt coming. So the next day, sunday, I asked her how she felt, and what she was up to. She said she misses me but shes spending time with her children while social distancing. The next day I conveyed to her in a non aggressive manner how I felt about her not telling me she wasn't coming Saturday. She said "I'm sorry". I said ok and the conversation went on to normal things.
So basically since then our communication has nearly died. I understand our individual attachment dynamics and I AM NOT bombarding her with messages or calls. In fact shes reached out a few times but the conversation dies on the vine after a few messages. Shes reached out first, said hello and never said another word after that. Or sometimes replies hours later. I'm trying not to take it personally but it hurts. I want to reach out but I know I shouldn't if I'm in a triggered emotional state.
So I guess what I'm looking for is opinions. She hasn't vocally stated that she wants space. She has however implied that she will not be seeing me while this virus is around. She even went as far as saying "shes enjoying the pandemic" because she's spent time with the kids and herself because she "needed it"
I'm thinking she wanted space and didn't know how to tell me for fear of my reaction. What say you guys and gals? And also for any DA out there, while in a relationship and you used distancing how long before you felt calm enough to go back to your partner?
I know this was very long, but it actually helped me even just typing this out. Goodnight to you all, and be safe out there
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Post by jeffrey on Mar 24, 2020 5:03:02 GMT
There was so much to type I forgot a few things. At the beginning of this last school semester she moved back in with her parents to save money. Shes told me a few times how they were emotionally unavailable to her as a child. And I could see it because the times I've been over her parents house they seem nice on the surface but I could tell there was no real depth there.
And lastly about the virus, she is taking her precautions very seriously and not even leaving her parents house. This is a very serious and anxious time for a lot of us. And I am taking my own precautions too. However my business is still open at this time and I gotta pay bills lol
Anyhow thanks again for reading. And please any input is welcome
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Post by serenity on Mar 24, 2020 21:19:01 GMT
Hi Jeffrey,
It sounds like she's deactivating somewhat because the `honeymoon' phase has started to ease off, and she's likely triggered from general overwhelm (the abortion/living with cold parents) and concern for her kids welfare as well.
Deactivation really sucks and feels like you lost your partner, but in my own experiences, they come through it eventually if you're still on good terms and in a relationship. Keep your communication loving and positive during this time, reach out enough to feel steady but not too much to make you anxious, is what I'd advise. I don't think there's anything much else you can do, except take good care of yourself and try to stay focused on things that make you happy. Noone can really tell you the future, but deactivation is very normal for avoidants and they do usually come back when they've had some space. Try to stay positive and calm?
I hope you will stay safe and your business does okay during the lockdown too. You're right, its a very anxious time for a lot of people.
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Post by jeffrey on Mar 24, 2020 22:48:58 GMT
Hi Serenity.
Thank you for your reply. It helps put things in perspective. I just feel so powerless. I guess I just wanted to know it if were something I'd done to cause her to do this in this situation. We hadn't fought or anything like that. In fact have only had maybe 2 disagreements since we've been together. When I do reach out, like I've done earlier, it is with compassion and calmness. I'm just missing our connection and conversations right now. We'd usually share with each other how our days went. So this is an adjustment:(
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Post by serenity on Mar 24, 2020 23:22:11 GMT
I know hon  It feels awful, and the distance between you and a loved one during these difficult times is a lot to deal with. I wish I knew of something you could do, but I've never come across anything useful, They have to come out of deactivation themselves. She might feel guilty, and unsure why she did it, and become negative about the relationship during this time. You can only continue to be upbeat and welcoming, showing her she's safe to return when she's ready. No you didn't do anything wrong. Her attachment system wasn't caused by you, its a deep rooted thing. Try to stay confident? If she wanted to break up she would have, and she won't be looking for anyone else during this crisis. |
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Post by jeffrey on Mar 24, 2020 23:43:26 GMT
Thank you for your kind words Serenity. While I'm trying to stay out of my head, it's hard. I'm trying to look back on our relationship for warning signs. A few days before the abortion I was nervous and worried. Worried about losing her. Because I was reading about abortions and how they affect couples. I spoke with her about this. And she said she didn't know how she'd react since she'd never gone through this but "most likely I'll withdraw for a little bit but I'll come back around. I just get lost in my thoughts"
Looking back, that was huge
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Post by jeffrey on Apr 2, 2020 0:48:23 GMT
I guess what I'm really wondering here is if an avoidant comes back after deactivating, do things kinda return to normal? What I'm saying is she called me the other day and totally acted like nothing ever happened. We pretty much played catch up the whole time so the discussion wasnt very deep. We exchanged a few texts in the ensuing days but it's still the same. Nothing of substance. Does anyone have any feedback?
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Post by kittygirl on Apr 2, 2020 18:14:46 GMT
No-they will never, ever return to normal. Read posts in the FA section. This will now be a pattern you'll have to deal with over and over until you decide to make it stop. EVEN IF you decide to simply be friends. It will still happen (I know because I am in this situation now with someone who's only a friend).
I wish I had more optimistic news for you, but this is the hard truth.
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Post by Dualcitizen on Apr 6, 2020 1:41:47 GMT
I guess what I'm really wondering here is if an avoidant comes back after deactivating, do things kinda return to normal? What I'm saying is she called me the other day and totally acted like nothing ever happened. We pretty much played catch up the whole time so the discussion wasnt very deep. We exchanged a few texts in the ensuing days but it's still the same. Nothing of substance. Does anyone have any feedback? Just popped back in after a month. Thought I would put my 2 cents worth in. I posted earlier, but removed it. I'll shorten things. This commentary is from my experience personally with a suspected Fearful-Avoidant attached lady over the past 2 years or so. We dated for 3 months, 5-6 month push-pull after. They can and do come back, mine wanted me to hang around and definitively said she wanted to revisit the relationship, after calling it off unexpectedly. I set strong boundaries around the relationship at the time, as I took her behaviour as "game playing", first time I've ever seen anything like it in my life and I was 41-42. In reality she was withholding information. A narcissist tendency ex. hubby and parent as well in the background causing her grief, plus 2 kids and dealing with life's other pressures. So in answer to your question. You may not be aware of what is truly going on in her life behind the scenes and who is attached to her, and potentially causing her grief, on top of childhood traumas, and daily dramas. This can and will push a F-A into potentially a hyper arousal or hypo arousal state and they dissociate and freeze potentially. Never take it to heart, it's how they cope with everything. This on top of the fact F-As are hypervigilant generally speaking, on high alert for threat queues in any capacity. And you can and will feel like you are "walking on eggshells" in numerous ways. Whether it be withdrawal after you think you may have offended them with a misplaced text, or they exploding at you for no apparent reason over something you said that had no negative connotation. Bare that in mind always. So in this case, my advice if you wish to take it is, stay chilled, if you love her, love is freedom, and so be constantly thinking of what she may be going through behind the scenes, because there could be stuff you have no idea about, nothing to do with you. It's good you are giving her distance, and I think it's pertinent to make her feel safe, and ask if you can help with anything if she needs you anytime, you'll be happy to listen and be there. That is all you can do, but definitely do not get attached to an outcome, i'm telling you from experience. You will do your head in, with the intermittent reinforcement, literally. And this is coming from a secure attached individual, who felt literal anxiety for the first time in a relationship. I will be blunt and honest though, no sugar coating, I never fully got back with my ex. she was never the same from the initial whirlwind passionate start, and when I set boundaries, seemingly became even more depressed and ill. This is why I say, never get attached to outcome, as that alone will increase your anxiety, on top of the fact, if she is F-A attachment style, it's very difficult for them to trust and attach to anyone for long periods. She truly needs to become aware and work on herself. She definitely sounds low self esteem, and has avoidance when it comes to emotions, so...yeah. |
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Post by jeffrey on Apr 10, 2020 14:38:35 GMT
I guess what I'm really wondering here is if an avoidant comes back after deactivating, do things kinda return to normal? What I'm saying is she called me the other day and totally acted like nothing ever happened. We pretty much played catch up the whole time so the discussion wasnt very deep. We exchanged a few texts in the ensuing days but it's still the same. Nothing of substance. Does anyone have any feedback? Just popped back in after a month. Thought I would put my 2 cents worth in. I posted earlier, but removed it. I'll shorten things. This commentary is from my experience personally with a suspected Fearful-Avoidant attached lady over the past 2 years or so. We dated for 3 months, 5-6 month push-pull after. They can and do come back, mine wanted me to hang around and definitively said she wanted to revisit the relationship, after calling it off unexpectedly. I set strong boundaries around the relationship at the time, as I took her behaviour as "game playing", first time I've ever seen anything like it in my life and I was 41-42. In reality she was withholding information. A narcissist tendency ex. hubby and parent as well in the background causing her grief, plus 2 kids and dealing with life's other pressures. So in answer to your question. You may not be aware of what is truly going on in her life behind the scenes and who is attached to her, and potentially causing her grief, on top of childhood traumas, and daily dramas. This can and will push a F-A into potentially a hyper arousal or hypo arousal state and they dissociate and freeze potentially. Never take it to heart, it's how they cope with everything. This on top of the fact F-As are hypervigilant generally speaking, on high alert for threat queues in any capacity. And you can and will feel like you are "walking on eggshells" in numerous ways. Whether it be withdrawal after you think you may have offended them with a misplaced text, or they exploding at you for no apparent reason over something you said that had no negative connotation. Bare that in mind always. So in this case, my advice if you wish to take it is, stay chilled, if you love her, love is freedom, and so be constantly thinking of what she may be going through behind the scenes, because there could be stuff you have no idea about, nothing to do with you. It's good you are giving her distance, and I think it's pertinent to make her feel safe, and ask if you can help with anything if she needs you anytime, you'll be happy to listen and be there. That is all you can do, but definitely do not get attached to an outcome, i'm telling you from experience. You will do your head in, with the intermittent reinforcement, literally. And this is coming from a secure attached individual, who felt literal anxiety for the first time in a relationship. I will be blunt and honest though, no sugar coating, I never fully got back with my ex. she was never the same from the initial whirlwind passionate start, and when I set boundaries, seemingly became even more depressed and ill. This is why I say, never get attached to outcome, as that alone will increase your anxiety, on top of the fact, if she is F-A attachment style, it's very difficult for them to trust and attach to anyone for long periods. She truly needs to become aware and work on herself. She definitely sounds low self esteem, and has avoidance when it comes to emotions, so...yeah. Hi dualcitizen Thanks for your thoughts. I've been taking this time, especially the quarantine time, to work on myself. And while I can't afford personal therapy I do feel I'm making strides. I'm trying to sit and feel and process my emotions as they arise. Sometimes it feels good, sometimes it feels unbearable. But the thought of abandoning myself for someone else feels ludicrous now. I realize I have treated myself in a toxic manner. Having said that. I don't know how much more I can stand pat. I do love my girlfriend but I just can't help but to feel ignored. I really do feel that our relationship is a chance at healing even if we don't stay together. But the sporadic communication isn't working for me. Is it possible for someone to dissociate and compartmentalize and still maintain some level of communication? |
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Post by Dualcitizen on Apr 10, 2020 22:58:32 GMT
Just popped back in after a month. Thought I would put my 2 cents worth in. I posted earlier, but removed it. I'll shorten things. This commentary is from my experience personally with a suspected Fearful-Avoidant attached lady over the past 2 years or so. We dated for 3 months, 5-6 month push-pull after. They can and do come back, mine wanted me to hang around and definitively said she wanted to revisit the relationship, after calling it off unexpectedly. I set strong boundaries around the relationship at the time, as I took her behaviour as "game playing", first time I've ever seen anything like it in my life and I was 41-42. In reality she was withholding information. A narcissist tendency ex. hubby and parent as well in the background causing her grief, plus 2 kids and dealing with life's other pressures. So in answer to your question. You may not be aware of what is truly going on in her life behind the scenes and who is attached to her, and potentially causing her grief, on top of childhood traumas, and daily dramas. This can and will push a F-A into potentially a hyper arousal or hypo arousal state and they dissociate and freeze potentially. Never take it to heart, it's how they cope with everything. This on top of the fact F-As are hypervigilant generally speaking, on high alert for threat queues in any capacity. And you can and will feel like you are "walking on eggshells" in numerous ways. Whether it be withdrawal after you think you may have offended them with a misplaced text, or they exploding at you for no apparent reason over something you said that had no negative connotation. Bare that in mind always. So in this case, my advice if you wish to take it is, stay chilled, if you love her, love is freedom, and so be constantly thinking of what she may be going through behind the scenes, because there could be stuff you have no idea about, nothing to do with you. It's good you are giving her distance, and I think it's pertinent to make her feel safe, and ask if you can help with anything if she needs you anytime, you'll be happy to listen and be there. That is all you can do, but definitely do not get attached to an outcome, i'm telling you from experience. You will do your head in, with the intermittent reinforcement, literally. And this is coming from a secure attached individual, who felt literal anxiety for the first time in a relationship. I will be blunt and honest though, no sugar coating, I never fully got back with my ex. she was never the same from the initial whirlwind passionate start, and when I set boundaries, seemingly became even more depressed and ill. This is why I say, never get attached to outcome, as that alone will increase your anxiety, on top of the fact, if she is F-A attachment style, it's very difficult for them to trust and attach to anyone for long periods. She truly needs to become aware and work on herself. She definitely sounds low self esteem, and has avoidance when it comes to emotions, so...yeah. Hi dualcitizen Thanks for your thoughts. I've been taking this time, especially the quarantine time, to work on myself. And while I can't afford personal therapy I do feel I'm making strides. I'm trying to sit and feel and process my emotions as they arise. Sometimes it feels good, sometimes it feels unbearable. But the thought of abandoning myself for someone else feels ludicrous now. I realize I have treated myself in a toxic manner. Having said that. I don't know how much more I can stand pat. I do love my girlfriend but I just can't help but to feel ignored. I really do feel that our relationship is a chance at healing even if we don't stay together. But the sporadic communication isn't working for me. Is it possible for someone to dissociate and compartmentalize and still maintain some level of communication? Check this chart out, it is the cycling of the nervous system during stress/trauma: catherinehale.co.uk/understanding-our-trauma/ (top red zone is wrong, it's a typo, should be "Hypo Arousal" Freeze state). This is linked to Complex PTSD and childhood trauma. From my experiences, with my ex. When she was seemingly moving from a hyper aroused state to a hypo aroused state, the communication dropped for sure, but was still there. And you're right to identify the "intermittent reinforcement", the sporadic communication merely points to the lack of coping mechanisms that person has. A secure attachment will talk about things and resolve issues, in largely a centred peaceful way. Not blow up or withdraw. Glad to hear you're awake and improving yourself, fantastic. |
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Post by jeffrey on Apr 11, 2020 0:26:59 GMT
Hi dualcitizen Thanks for your thoughts. I've been taking this time, especially the quarantine time, to work on myself. And while I can't afford personal therapy I do feel I'm making strides. I'm trying to sit and feel and process my emotions as they arise. Sometimes it feels good, sometimes it feels unbearable. But the thought of abandoning myself for someone else feels ludicrous now. I realize I have treated myself in a toxic manner. Having said that. I don't know how much more I can stand pat. I do love my girlfriend but I just can't help but to feel ignored. I really do feel that our relationship is a chance at healing even if we don't stay together. But the sporadic communication isn't working for me. Is it possible for someone to dissociate and compartmentalize and still maintain some level of communication? Check this chart out, it is the cycling of the nervous system during stress/trauma: catherinehale.co.uk/understanding-our-trauma/ (top red zone is wrong, it's a typo, should be "Hypo Arousal" Freeze state). This is linked to Complex PTSD and childhood trauma. From my experiences, with my ex. When she was seemingly moving from a hyper aroused state to a hypo aroused state, the communication dropped for sure, but was still there. And you're right to identify the "intermittent reinforcement", the sporadic communication merely points to the lack of coping mechanisms that person has. A secure attachment will talk about things and resolve issues, in largely a centred peaceful way. Not blow up or withdraw. Glad to hear you're awake and improving yourself, fantastic. Thank you for the info. I'm reading it now. I'm just having one of those days |
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Post by serenity on Apr 12, 2020 6:12:35 GMT
Hi jeffrey,
I agree with dual citizen and kitty girl, you don't get the "honeymoon" back. And if you start to see intermittent ignoring of communication, its a really bad idea to put up with it. Its better to say to her "its not okay" and get rejected, than to spend months or years enduring it, because it will hurt you more than you can imagine. Its a huge sign of disrespect and actually causes you psychological harm.
Usually how this starts is the avoidant partner feels a " little bit uncomfortable" with communicating. Then they start to feel a other feelings about having not communicated. And they avoid more. But when you weigh up their "little bit of discomfort" against your "high distress", you can see how selfish the behavior is really. You shouldn't develop a tolerance for it, and there's no benefit to you.
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Post by jeffrey on Apr 12, 2020 17:53:28 GMT
Hi jeffrey, I agree with dual citizen and kitty girl, you don't get the "honeymoon" back. And if you start to see intermittent ignoring of communication, its a really bad idea to put up with it. Its better to say to her "its not okay" and get rejected, than to spend months or years enduring it, because it will hurt you more than you can imagine. Its a huge sign of disrespect and actually causes you psychological harm. Usually how this starts is the avoidant partner feels a " little bit uncomfortable" with communicating. Then they start to feel a other feelings about having not communicated. And they avoid more. But when you weigh up their "little bit of discomfort" against your "high distress", you can see how selfish the behavior is really. You shouldn't develop a tolerance for it, and there's no benefit to you. Thanks for the input serenity. I guess my next question would be is it possible to give too much space? I've fallen back big time on reaching out as to not "poke the bear." But this is something I'm wondering now. Obviously given what we've been through im not 100% all in on walking away. But I will protect myself if triggered. If there's a possibility we could actually talk about this stuff I'd like to |
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Post by jeffrey on Apr 12, 2020 20:41:08 GMT
Hi jeffrey, I agree with dual citizen and kitty girl, you don't get the "honeymoon" back. And if you start to see intermittent ignoring of communication, its a really bad idea to put up with it. Its better to say to her "its not okay" and get rejected, than to spend months or years enduring it, because it will hurt you more than you can imagine. Its a huge sign of disrespect and actually causes you psychological harm. Usually how this starts is the avoidant partner feels a " little bit uncomfortable" with communicating. Then they start to feel a other feelings about having not communicated. And they avoid more. But when you weigh up their "little bit of discomfort" against your "high distress", you can see how selfish the behavior is really. You shouldn't develop a tolerance for it, and there's no benefit to you. Thanks for the input serenity. I guess my next question would be is it possible to give too much space? I've fallen back big time on reaching out as to not "poke the bear." But this is something I'm wondering now. Obviously given what we've been through im not 100% all in on walking away. But I will protect myself if triggered. If there's a possibility we could actually talk about this stuff I'd like to And its especially tough since she keeps telling me she misses me. As she did today. Obviously there's no action though |
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It feels awful, and the distance between you and a loved one during these difficult times is a lot to deal with. I wish I knew of something you could do, but I've never come across anything useful, They have to come out of deactivation themselves. She might feel guilty, and unsure why she did it, and become negative about the relationship during this time. You can only continue to be upbeat and welcoming, showing her she's safe to return when she's ready.