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Post by bedlam71 on Feb 2, 2018 23:05:51 GMT
I do think my ex is selfish, but out of fear, not out of cruelty. I think she wants a relationship but cannot handle my emotions (which she has said and she has tried to) and is a commitment phobe. She could be mean as hell, but this article sounds like the person is playing games. I think this person in the article is on the extreme end of avoidant.
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 2, 2018 23:06:18 GMT
This sounds more narcissistic. maybe even sociopathic. I agree it's bordering on that. But I think the real situation is that the guy is simply messed up, not capable of a real relationship and trying to get admiration and validation and love in a very selfish way. If they were healthy they'd just move on to a girl they wanted a real relationship with. They're wasting our lives But also their own... Kristy plesse dont take it personally. You didn't misread anything. He's a confused and messed up guy with a narcissistic streak and an FA attachment style and no capable skills or desires for acting in ways to create a long term relationship. Thank you Yasmin. I'm trying to stop thinking so negatively about myself and how I've handled this whole thing. I did my best, and the more I learn about myself and his behavior, the more I think I can continue to move forward. I have been so emotionally, its easy to forget that this is who HE is, and that there is nothing I could have done to have gotten a different outcome. |
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Post by bedlam71 on Feb 2, 2018 23:10:03 GMT
Bedlam, I think for me, my ex may not consciously think these things, but he does act this way- so while I do not want to think the worst, I do think its good for me to try and face some facts. But, yes, it sounds pretty narcissistic. :-( The bottom line is is this is not the relationship you want. We desperately keep hoping they will come to the table and it be more balanced, but it's just not going to happen. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2018 23:13:19 GMT
I don't think so, but I don't know any other DAs, other than from this forum. Unfortunately, I would say I am very oblivious. So Mary if you're dating someone new fir example and communication is quiet after a second date you don't have a response emotionally? I am curious. For FA that kind if thing creates massive massive massive anxiety No, I don't. What you describe as the attraction phase is pretty much me until I get to the long term. It's easy to see why APs are the only ones that usually make it anywhere with me, because they persevere. Everything for me is very "reluctant". Ever try to pull a child away from a candy machine. It's kind of like that lol. I will reluctantly commit, then I will get somewhat comfortable, where I will have secure periods and periods of pulling away and needing space. I would say I am more consistent, but still exasperating for a lot of people. But I do think there are some DAs that swing more on the anxious side. When I did the test, I was on the far left. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 2, 2018 23:28:03 GMT
So Mary if you're dating someone new fir example and communication is quiet after a second date you don't have a response emotionally? I am curious. For FA that kind if thing creates massive massive massive anxiety No, I don't. What you describe as the attraction phase is pretty much me until I get to the long term. It's easy to see why APs are the only ones that usually make it anywhere with me, because they persevere. Everything for me is very "reluctant". Ever try to pull a child away from a candy machine. It's kind of like that lol. I will reluctantly commit, then I will get somewhat comfortable, where I will have secure periods and periods of pulling away and needing space. I would say I am more consistent, but still exasperating for a lot of people. But I do think there are some DAs that swing more on the anxious side. When I did the test, I was on the far left. That is just so enlightening!!!! Its so interesting to hear it from that perspective. So they basically get you to commit by insistence? |
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Post by kristyrose on Feb 2, 2018 23:33:07 GMT
This is very interesting!
I actually had to tell my ex at one point that we were a couple because of how we interacted and that we r bf/gf- he said, oh, ok. and that was it. However later down the road we were arguing and he said that I called us out in being in a relationship, so he "went along with it" and decided to "come towards me"- interesting choice of words.
Then in our most recent argument he said he thought i was "slowly maneuvering us back to a relationship"
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Post by bedlam71 on Feb 2, 2018 23:33:17 GMT
Do you even want the relationships or do you just commit to them because they are persistent?
Also, that article sounds like a lot of game playing. Is that what happens in your relationships? I don't want you but I don't want you to go anywhere?
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Post by yasmin on Feb 2, 2018 23:37:46 GMT
I think Kristy it's a sliding scale with these things and each person's makeup is different as well as other factors in their lives like past relationships or current situation or recent breakups etc.
I am probably 20% avoidant and 30% anxious. My ex is more like 80% avoidant and 30% anxious. So his predominance is much more avoidant so he is much harder to drag into a relationship, which is evident in him being 47 and only having had one despite desperately desiring one.
His pattern is totally different to mine..
Perpetual search for "the one" without ever finding it.
Step 1: Enjoys the chases / excitement at the beginning and thinks virtually every person is promising.
Step 2: Then after 3 - 4 weeks finds fault in the woman and either converts her to a FWB or behaves in sabotaging ways to destruct the relationship before it begins, almost always by avoidant behaviors such as pulling away, diverting attention to exes or new women, making it hard to see him etc.
Step 3: When the woman then pulls away he wants her again and this dance will continue for as long as she allows it to.
Never actually getting into a relationship at all with anyone. And the one time he did, he was so deeply attached to it that he couldn't leave, even when very unhappy. So to me this is a much more severe / pronounced FA situation with a dominance of avoidance and a complete inability to have normal functioning relationships.
@mary would you say this was more close to an avoidant pattern generally?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2018 23:41:47 GMT
No, I don't. What you describe as the attraction phase is pretty much me until I get to the long term. It's easy to see why APs are the only ones that usually make it anywhere with me, because they persevere. Everything for me is very "reluctant". Ever try to pull a child away from a candy machine. It's kind of like that lol. I will reluctantly commit, then I will get somewhat comfortable, where I will have secure periods and periods of pulling away and needing space. I would say I am more consistent, but still exasperating for a lot of people. But I do think there are some DAs that swing more on the anxious side. When I did the test, I was on the far left. That is just so enlightening!!!! Its so interesting to hear it from that perspective. So they basically get you to commit by insistence? I wouldn't say by insistence, but by enough time where I can get to a place of trust. If they are too insistent, (pushy) I will back away more and probably just leave. Don't get me wrong, it's not like I don't ever initiate anything. I can initiate getting together and things like that, but I don't have that anxiety and I'm definitely not trying to push the relationship to progress. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 2, 2018 23:45:31 GMT
Do you even want the relationships or do you just commit to them because they are persistent? Also, that article sounds like a lot of game playing. Is that what happens in your relationships? I don't want you but I don't want you to go anywhere? In my conscious mind, I do not want a relationship, but I do want companionship. I don't commit because of persistence. I commit because they have given me enough time to decide if I like/love/trust them enough to commit. It's more like I want you, but I don't know if I want/can have a relationship with you. |
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Post by bedlam71 on Feb 2, 2018 23:55:16 GMT
Do you even want the relationships or do you just commit to them because they are persistent? Also, that article sounds like a lot of game playing. Is that what happens in your relationships? I don't want you but I don't want you to go anywhere? In my conscious mind, I do not want a relationship, but I do want companionship. I don't commit because of persistence. I commit because they have given me enough time to decide if I like/love/trust them enough to commit. It's more like I want you, but I don't know if I want/can have a relationship with you. Ok..that makes sense. In my mind, and probably my insecurities with my ex, not wanting a relationship translates into not loving me. It can be both. I love you And I can't deal with the obligation of a relationship. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2018 0:02:20 GMT
I think Kristy it's a sliding scale with these things and each person's makeup is different as well as other factors in their lives like past relationships or current situation or recent breakups etc. I am probably 20% avoidant and 30% anxious. My ex is more like 80% avoidant and 30% anxious. So his predominance is much more avoidant so he is much harder to drag into a relationship, which is evident in him being 47 and only having had one despite desperately desiring one. His pattern is totally different to mine.. Perpetual search for "the one" without ever finding it. Step 1: Enjoys the chases / excitement at the beginning and thinks virtually every person is promising. Step 2: Then after 3 - 4 weeks finds fault in the woman and either converts her to a FWB or behaves in sabotaging ways to destruct the relationship before it begins, almost always by avoidant behaviors such as pulling away, diverting attention to exes or new women, making it hard to see him etc. Step 3: When the woman then pulls away he wants her again and this dance will continue for as long as she allows it to. Never actually getting into a relationship at all with anyone. And the one time he did, he was so deeply attached to it that he couldn't leave, even when very unhappy. So to me this is a much more severe / pronounced FA situation with a dominance of avoidance and a complete inability to have normal functioning relationships. @mary would you say this was more close to an avoidant pattern generally? Totally true! Everyone's makeup is different which makes it so damn confusing. I don't really know what the avoidant pattern is, but mine would be different. I think most people are not promising. It will take me a long time to even be interested or think they are promising. I would say I am probably 90% avoidant and 10% secure. If I do get deeply attached though, yes, it's extremely difficult to leave. What you describe above looks to me like anxious, avoidant, anxious, like he's alternating between the two. But overall it's an avoidant pattern if he never really gets into a relationship. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 3, 2018 0:05:45 GMT
In my conscious mind, I do not want a relationship, but I do want companionship. I don't commit because of persistence. I commit because they have given me enough time to decide if I like/love/trust them enough to commit. It's more like I want you, but I don't know if I want/can have a relationship with you. Ok..that makes sense. In my mind, and probably my insecurities with my ex, not wanting a relationship translates into not loving me. It can be both. I love you And I can't deal with the obligation of a relationship. I think most people see it that way, which is why partners wonder if they care or love them. It's wierd to say it's not about the person, it's about the relationship, but for me it's true. I separate them and I need to intertwine them. |
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Post by yasmin on Feb 3, 2018 0:12:14 GMT
Such an interesting conversation. I think maybe one of the big keys to healing is seeing your own pattern and keeping yourself in check over those times.
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Post by bedlam71 on Feb 3, 2018 1:17:41 GMT
Definitely keep working on self-awareness. Sadly, I had some major changes in my life over past 2 years and I looked to my ex avoidant to be a support system, which to me is what a relationship is about, and she offered zero emotional support. I lost myself in all of that on top of my personal issues. This hasn't been fun but it's also been a blessing because I'm starting to find me again.
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