katy
Sticky Post Powers
Posts: 147 
|
Post by katy on Nov 25, 2016 1:06:44 GMT
That's a tough place to be. Do you think he's trying to come back as your boyfriend or is he just trying to keep some level of contact as "friends"? Now that you understand his limitations and have very few expectations, is it possible and good for you to maintain intermittent contact? Would it be better to help you process moving away from him or would it just delay your being able move on to a life that's better for you?
Good luck.
Katy
|
|
|
|
Post by azgirl on Nov 25, 2016 1:19:53 GMT
Lily - I think in many cases - including yours and mine - that avoidants feel that they can handle this - they can respond without getting into the possible emotion of any of it - and just go on with their lives. They will admit some involvement - mine says they think about me all the time - but then no interaction until the next induced interaction and business as usual. WTF? I am a logical person with no logical explanation!
|
|
lily
New Member
Posts: 9
|
Post by lily on Nov 25, 2016 1:57:35 GMT
Thanks everyone! Still can't bring myself to read it - though I will when I'm ready.
Gaynanxious - you are right - it's all just words - and as a DA he has so many of them that never reflect his actual behavior- I think this is partly because he actually wants these things but can't follow through and partly because of his pathological need to people please.
Katy - my suspicion is he's contacting me to continue our underlying friendship. He always did reset like this after a serious discussion - reverted to our easy friendship banter. I know him well enough to know he is comfortable in that space and would be happy to come to me for that friendship on his terms - ie when he needs me - and leave our relationship status undefined. You can imagine the toll this would take on me. Which is why I want to smack myself for feeling the same old conflict. I guess it's because we do have a strong and easy friendship under everything else that went down. I suspected very strongly that he would do this but I thought it would come next week once he didn't have the distraction of the holiday and family.
azgirl - yes WTH!? No logic here. He's likely responding to an amusing anecdote I sent him BEFORE we had 'the discussion'. Why now? He didn't feel the need to respond to it before... What prompted him to suddenly respond today of all days? And at 5am. On thanksgiving. Like really - I can't help but wonder why - the irony of this is that he probably doesn't really know why either....
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 5:34:07 GMT
Sorry Lilly. I'm sure it's tough to think about on a holiday.
It kind of makes sense that he would reach out on a holiday. I think people think about others that they are connected to on these days.
|
|
|
|
Post by gay anxious on Nov 25, 2016 6:01:09 GMT
Sorry Lilly. I'm sure it's tough to think about on a holiday. It kind of makes sense that he would reach out on a holiday. I think people think about others that they are connected to on these days. That's a good point, I myself have caught up with a few people today I haven't spoken to in years. Avoidants may behave in ways we find strange but they are still human beings. He probably does have feelings toward you. It just doesn't necessarily mean anything about what those feelings are or that those feelings would change anything. Stay strong. Do what you need to. I like to keep all the connections I can in my life but sometimes those connections can't exist without more harm than good. You have to decide yourself if that's the case. |
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 6:17:00 GMT
I can't speak to the specific dynamic between the two of you, but in my experience, I would be surprised to see a DA play games. In my experience they are either unaware of their own needs or unable to articulate them/tell people they are close to what they need. I would guess that may have been the situation here. Perhaps he didn't understand that he wanted you there, or couldn't bring him to tell you at the time? I agree. My experience as a child is that people don't come when you need them, so what's the use in asking? Avoidants were taught that they can only rely on themselves. Asking for help or asking someone to be there is a struggle for me and I rarely do it even though it's something I try to work on. I will say, no I'm fine, you don't need to do anything, even if I would like them to. It's not a game, I just can't say the words. I think I don't want to get my hopes up that someone would be there for me only to be disappointed later, however, I say "I'm fine" and I'm still disappointed that they didn't come. In the end, there's really no good outcome. |
|
|
|
Post by gaynxious on Nov 25, 2016 6:50:46 GMT
I can't speak to the specific dynamic between the two of you, but in my experience, I would be surprised to see a DA play games. In my experience they are either unaware of their own needs or unable to articulate them/tell people they are close to what they need. I would guess that may have been the situation here. Perhaps he didn't understand that he wanted you there, or couldn't bring him to tell you at the time? I agree. My experience as a child is that people don't come when you need them, so what's the use in asking? Avoidants were taught that they can only rely on themselves. Asking for help or asking someone to be there is a struggle for me and I rarely do it even though it's something I try to work on. I will say, no I'm fine, you don't need to do anything, even if I would like them to. It's not a game, I just can't say the words. I think I don't want to get my hopes up that someone would be there for me only to be disappointed later, however, I say "I'm fine" and I'm still disappointed that they didn't come. In the end, there's really no good outcome. I definitely agree with the no good outcome. I really think that he relationship was over by then but he didn't know it at a consious level. I didn't want to go because I figured I would be in the way and he would be annoyed if I went after asking and him saying I didn't need to. Now maybe going would have been the less bad option. Maybe the only way to win was to go and text that I was there in the waiting room untill he needed me. But I can't play these three dimensional chess games 24/7. I need to be with someone that can communicate. |
|
|
|
Post by trixie5179 on Nov 25, 2016 17:38:49 GMT
Gaynxious,
Yes, try not to beat yourself up about 'maybe something I could've done differently.' I've struggled with this same thing-- Thinking maybe I shouldn't have asked my ex to get together as often, maybe I shouldn't have texted him as often (even though he did the same things, and I had no idea he was unhappy)...maybe by not doing these things our relationship would've worked out. When I find myself trying to put all the blame on me by telling myself these things, I have to make myself stop-- because really, would the relationship still have worked? Maybe it would've gone on for months, or maybe years longer, but no...ultimately it wouldn't have-- especially with the inability to communicate. I do miss my ex and wish things would not have ended, but I am starting to accept that he is emotionally unavailable-- and just cannot see himself where our relationship was headed. Maybe your ex is in the same situation, also.
I think this kind of 'self blame' we do to ourselves also has to do with control issues. Like we try to make ourselves think that the relationship was in our control alone (not true) and we blew it...but maybe since it was in our control then, it still is-- and we could fix it. I am totally guilty of these thoughts and I know, deep down, that it isn't all my fault, nor all in my control...It's tough.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Nov 25, 2016 18:23:38 GMT
I agree. My experience as a child is that people don't come when you need them, so what's the use in asking? Avoidants were taught that they can only rely on themselves. Asking for help or asking someone to be there is a struggle for me and I rarely do it even though it's something I try to work on. I will say, no I'm fine, you don't need to do anything, even if I would like them to. It's not a game, I just can't say the words. I think I don't want to get my hopes up that someone would be there for me only to be disappointed later, however, I say "I'm fine" and I'm still disappointed that they didn't come. In the end, there's really no good outcome. I definitely agree with the no good outcome. I really think that he relationship was over by then but he didn't know it at a consious level. I didn't want to go because I figured I would be in the way and he would be annoyed if I went after asking and him saying I didn't need to. Now maybe going would have been the less bad option. Maybe the only way to win was to go and text that I was there in the waiting room untill he needed me. But I can't play these three dimensional chess games 24/7. I need to be with someone that can communicate. I definitely understand and in those situations, there is no "winning". |
|
|
|
Post by gaynxious on Nov 25, 2016 18:25:26 GMT
Gaynxious, Yes, try not to beat yourself up about 'maybe something I could've done differently.' I've struggled with this same thing-- Thinking maybe I shouldn't have asked my ex to get together as often, maybe I shouldn't have texted him as often (even though he did the same things, and I had no idea he was unhappy)...maybe by not doing these things our relationship would've worked out. When I find myself trying to put all the blame on me by telling myself these things, I have to make myself stop-- because really, would the relationship still have worked? Maybe it would've gone on for months, or maybe years longer, but no...ultimately it wouldn't have-- especially with the inability to communicate. I do miss my ex and wish things would not have ended, but I am starting to accept that he is emotionally unavailable-- and just cannot see himself where our relationship was headed. Maybe your ex is in the same situation, also. I think this kind of 'self blame' we do to ourselves also has to do with control issues. Like we try to make ourselves think that the relationship was in our control alone (not true) and we blew it...but maybe since it was in our control then, it still is-- and we could fix it. I am totally guilty of these thoughts and I know, deep down, that it isn't all my fault, nor all in my control...It's tough. I agree trixie, I know that while I did make a few mistakes, not saying the hospital was one of them, I know that if I could go back and do things differently he would have manufactured some other complaint. I could never win. And he couldn't communicate either or handle any conflict. We could disagree, talk calmly with no raised voices and reach a compromise and still he would be stressed from the experience and the relationship suffered. That's what keeps me from trying to get him back and makes me resolved to not go back should he want to try again. A relationship cannot work without communication. It just can't. And we had so many problems that talking about them only twice a week, that was all he could handle, wouldn't have been enough. |
|
|
|
Post by Broken Dude on Mar 29, 2017 5:03:53 GMT
Katy! Oh my god! This article was amazing! Thank you!!! This was exactly me. I couldn't understand why I was acting like a crazy person!! I tried so hard to deal with this by turning to my friends - but they didn't understand at all. I'd tell them stories of things that he'd do or say and they couldn't see how the pattern of behavior added up to me being a crazy person. One asked me - how many times a week would he have to contact you so that you would be happy - she didn't understand it wasn't the length of time - it was so much more subtle than that. i don't think anyone can understand unless they've been through it. Everything in me was telling me to run for my life, but then I'd be like Pavlov's dogs - going back for a pat on the head and thanking him for it! Ugh. Even now I feel the pull of him. I both loathe the next girl to fall into his web (because I want the promise of who he is back) and I ache for her (because I know that promise is a lie). The only thing the article doesn't explain is how to jolt the reward circuit because right now I'm only out of this relationship through sheer will and self respect but I can imagine - like and addict - I will be yearning for his approval soon enough. Which seems totally ridiculous to me, but what can I say, I feel it... Well said....about making you become a crazy person. Or the shame that you feel for becoming this crazy person. No one can understand it unless you explain it for 3 hours to them...and even then they don't understand it. It does send you to crazy town, especially when you get the 'little rejections' flipped around on you and they make it Your Fault. Geez.... so glad to be away from it! I'm working on my self esteem and that I am a good person and deserve to be loved, and deserve to love someone. Looking back, that person "is not going to treat me like that any more." Get away from crazy town! |
|
