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Post by alexandra on Dec 9, 2019 5:53:09 GMT
Huh. So the fear is of being abandoned for having a need? Like literally, fearing that the other person would say forget this, you're just too much? Not exclusively, but definitely a big AP fear-driver, yes. |
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Post by alexandra on Dec 9, 2019 5:57:42 GMT
@inmourning, often insecurely attached folks had to parent the parents. AP externally emotionally regulates -- so if I'm AP, I want to (and feel like I can handle) regulating my partner. And I assume other people are similar to me and that it's normal, and the other person should be overly mindful of my emotional state. This is often because of the inconsistent parenting dynamic. So, since everything is external, if the AP gets abandoned it's because they were "too much" and too needy for the other person to regulate. Making it their own fault. So, one fear of abandonment driver is my needs will be too much (since they were for someone during their childhood) so I should push them down or I'll be left.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 5:58:50 GMT
Huh. So the fear is of being abandoned for having a need? Like literally, fearing that the other person would say forget this, you're just too much? Not exclusively, but definitely a big AP fear-driver, yes. I can see that. There are so many ways avoidants meet their own needs (not dependent on another), and the ones they would have to gain cooperation for, they suppress it seems. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 6:04:21 GMT
@inmourning , often insecurely attached folks had to parent the parents. AP externally emotionally regulates -- so if I'm AP, I want to (and feel like I can handle) regulating my partner. And I assume other people are similar to me and that it's normal, and the other person should be overly mindful of my emotional state. This is often because of the inconsistent parenting dynamic. So, since everything is external, if the AP gets abandoned it's because they were "too much" and too needy for the other person to regulate. Making it their own fault. So, one fear of abandonment driver is my needs will be too much (since they were for someone during their childhood) so I should push them down or I'll be left. Oh ok, that makes a lot of sense. The self regulation of the avoidant isn't at play. I do think it's common for avoidants to think the world operates aligned with their view too. I know I've been totally blown away by the perspectives of anxious partners in the past- we were on such different pages but I didn't know that until things went horribly. I was constantly taken aback by how different our worlds were,, how differently we saw life and each other and ourselves. |
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Post by stayhappy on Dec 9, 2019 6:20:54 GMT
I never experienced this anxiety until I started dating my dismissive partner.
At the beginning: Fist, second and third time didn’t worry so much. Later: He hasn’t text me back in a long time again. Google: “Why would a guy seems interested and don’t text you back?” Google says:
1- he is not that into you. Me : He could just say that. I always say if I lost interest.
2- You slept with too soon and he doesn’t value your enough. Me: Maybe I did but I really wanted it. Who wants and insecure sexist guy anyway?
3- He is playing games. Me: Really? Why would him do that, he knows I’m interested. I don’t know how to pretend I’m not interested to get him to be interested. I’m like a puppy, I can’t hide my excitement! I’ll lose!
Me: I’ll text him and make things clear.
Me now: Sometimes it doesn’t bother me that much if he doesn’t text back me back. Sometimes I get anxious because I really wanted an answer. Sometimes I get avoidant than he get ”anxious”.
I hate feeling ignored!
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Post by stayhappy on Dec 9, 2019 11:23:04 GMT
My question now is:
You guys who don’t text back or take a long time to text back, what are your reasons?
That I remember, it have been just one time that I didn’t answer my partner as soon as I could. And the reason was that I was too upset at him to text him back. I didn’t want to write something angry just to regret it later.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 13:03:50 GMT
My question now is: You guys who don’t text back or take a long time to text back, what are your reasons? That I remember, it have been just one time that I didn’t answer my partner as soon as I could. And the reason was that I was too upset at him to text him back. I didn’t want to write something angry just to regret it later. I'm a responder also, like you. I generally have my phone for my job but also it is not high pressure, and I don't have a lot of stress after hours either. My avoidant partner and my avoidant best friend (female) do not respond to personal communications if they are at work and it's busy. Of course I don't expect either of them to, we are in the habit of "send a text, get a reply when it happens" around work hours, just to touch base and wish a good day). But generally, a dismissive won't prioritize (personal) communication if they are stressed or busy. They go to single track mind. That's factory wiring at work, most haven't had the upgrade. I should be writing my post as past tense, in reality, as K takes good care of me around this and also, I've grown trust. If he is unable to respond it's typically because something very pressured or stressful was happening, and he calls me instead as soon as he can because by then he wants to talk to me too. Have you talked with him openly about this? I've shared most of my guts with K over the time we have been together and run into the same problems- they don't go without improvement in understanding and cooperation. I would say if there hasn't been progress for you with this and you still feel ignored, it needs some direct attention. If it's distressing. |
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Post by tnr9 on Dec 9, 2019 13:14:40 GMT
@janedoe , when I dated an avoidant last spring, he was upfront before we even started in telling me that he's a terrible texter and even assumed I probably am good about it (he had no evidence either way yet -- I'm good if I answer right way, otherwise I forget, so I try to answer as soon as I see it). It was actually very, very helpful to hear this upfront, especially as I didn't know he was avoidant yet. Even if I'm secure, I still don't like it taking more than a day at most to respond to a question if it's not just chit chat. Or not hearing anything for more than a couple days. Personal preference. But him taking responsibility upfront just set my expectations properly so that I wasn't wondering or getting insecure about it. And while we were seeing each other, he always eventually answered in some capacity (usually within a day or two), so that felt secure enough to me for early dating with a self-proclaimed bad texter avoidant who knew my stance on texting. B told me he did like talking on the phone and he primarily would text. I actually have my journals from when I dated him....there were times when he would not text back for days and I literally thought he was ghosting me. I could not wrap my mind around how anyone could just be so very casual about things. I honestly felt 2 different feelings abut him...he felt like home...as in, he felt like he was the closest person to accepting me for who I was...yet, he did not feel like home...I worried about losing his interest all the time...that I was so...common...not worthy...that I had to do so much more in order to keep him interested in me. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 13:16:49 GMT
stayhappy I don't know if you have an insecure background, but I discuss mine openly in my relationship. I had to let K know it embarrasses me to admit, how much I need him. I feel an old sadness if I get triggered into feeling I am invisible, or that I don't matter. He feels sad about that and understands it, and also has things get in the way. My avoidance and emotional wounding is deep (so is his) so in order to make it this far we have had to really open up over time but it has probably been what some would say is excruciatingly slow. So the discussions leading to the improved circumstances between us have been vulnerable and in the spirit of "I have some pain here, I know you aren't trying to hurt me... can you help me with it ?" BUT that kind of talk came about after plenty of misunderstanding and reactions on both sides. So it wasn't good from the beginning it was conflict we discovered and resolved over time. Of course it took me a very long time to admit the vulnerability and trigger around it. Like you, I had also not experienced it prior to loving a (fellow) dismissive.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 13:18:39 GMT
@janedoe , when I dated an avoidant last spring, he was upfront before we even started in telling me that he's a terrible texter and even assumed I probably am good about it (he had no evidence either way yet -- I'm good if I answer right way, otherwise I forget, so I try to answer as soon as I see it). It was actually very, very helpful to hear this upfront, especially as I didn't know he was avoidant yet. Even if I'm secure, I still don't like it taking more than a day at most to respond to a question if it's not just chit chat. Or not hearing anything for more than a couple days. Personal preference. But him taking responsibility upfront just set my expectations properly so that I wasn't wondering or getting insecure about it. And while we were seeing each other, he always eventually answered in some capacity (usually within a day or two), so that felt secure enough to me for early dating with a self-proclaimed bad texter avoidant who knew my stance on texting. B told me he did like talking on the phone and he primarily would text. I actually have my journals from when I dated him....there were times when he would not text back for days and I literally thought he was ghosting me. I could not wrap my mind around how anyone could just be so very casual about things. I honestly felt 2 different feelings abut him...he felt like home...as in, he felt like he was the closest person to accepting me for who I was...yet, he did not feel like home...I worried about losing his interest all the time...that I was so...common...not worthy...that I had to do so much more in order to keep him interested in me. I'm sorry, this sounds painful. The way I see it, not responding to a bid for days is ghosting.  |
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Post by mrob on Dec 9, 2019 14:34:09 GMT
Huh. So the fear is of being abandoned for having a need? Like literally, fearing that the other person would say forget this, you're just too much? Not exclusively, but definitely a big AP fear-driver, yes. Yes. And I had absolutely no idea how much hard work I was until I got here. I'll share something about myself, internet forum and all.... I was very well known for my "Quirkyness" at school. People 6 years above and below me knew who I was. Second year of high school, there was a talent quest. I was asked by some girls to join in. I did, and, if you can imagine the set of a show that was known here as "Perfect Match". I was on the other side of the screen, ogre-ish. I had no idea. The second it happened, I knew I'd been had in the worst possible way and I was devastated, and I had to hide the lot to retain the little dignity I had left. I'd been copping it for years, but this just felt like the end. I was so incredibly desperate for affection, and totally unable to communicate, as well as having no clue about what connection entailed. I decided I would never give anybody that power again. The next person that came anywhere near me was my first wife, some years later. So, here we are, somebody still desperate for connection and affection, yet terrified to the core that I'll be made a fool out of and abandoned which ended up happening in that situation.So, yes, under all this veneer of easy goingness and jocularity has been this nightmare. If I actually tell somebody what I want, show them who I really am, they'll run. I said to Miss EU today that I needed a hug. She didn't make me feel like a fool. We arranged to get together on Wednesday. I've never said that before. There is progress. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 15:03:38 GMT
Not exclusively, but definitely a big AP fear-driver, yes. Yes. And I had absolutely no idea how much hard work I was until I got here. I'll share something about myself, internet forum and all.... I was very well known for my "Quirkyness" at school. People 6 years above and below me knew who I was. Second year of high school, there was a talent quest. I was asked by some girls to join in. I did, and, if you can imagine the set of a show that was known here as "Perfect Match". I was on the other side of the screen, ogre-ish. I had no idea. The second it happened, I knew I'd been had in the worst possible way and I was devastated, and I had to hide the lot to retain the little dignity I had left. I'd been copping it for years, but this just felt like the end. I was so incredibly desperate for affection, and totally unable to communicate, as well as having no clue about what connection entailed. I decided I would never give anybody that power again. The next person that came anywhere near me was my first wife, some years later. So, here we are, somebody still desperate for connection and affection, yet terrified to the core that I'll be made a fool out of and abandoned which ended up happening in that situation.So, yes, under all this veneer of easy goingness and jocularity has been this nightmare. If I actually tell somebody what I want, show them who I really am, they'll run. I said to Miss EU today that I needed a hug. She didn't make me feel like a fool. We arranged to get together on Wednesday. I've never said that before. There is progress. I got tears in my eyes for you, the set up and humiliation; the need for compassion and affection juxtaposed by that horrible pain. Yes, ask for hugs! Admitting to my man that I need him, and that his love heals me, has been so terribly difficult but also, the road home. I don't know what the future holds because I still think the fates have me slated to be alone, that's my deep wound. But for now I just go with what works best, as I am able. What works best is asking for love, and getting it. I do have safe people around me but haven't always. What a long road. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 9, 2019 15:07:42 GMT
Wow I'm really happy for you mrob. Its hard to take these steps. And it's not like we won't hurt again. But we are going the right direction. |
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Post by alexandra on Dec 9, 2019 19:03:44 GMT
Aw mrob. Kids can be so damn mean. I'm very sorry that happened to you. I had a slightly older popular female classmate randomly call me up to come join her on a double date or something like that. I definitely didn't go. I figured some sort of mean public humiliation would follow, and it was best left as just a prank call. I know others who have been treated the way you were in school, all guys on the aspergers spectrum. They were different and so their bids for connection weren't the same, and a lot of other kids bullied them as a result. |
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Post by stayhappy on Dec 9, 2019 20:08:05 GMT
My question now is: You guys who don’t text back or take a long time to text back, what are your reasons? That I remember, it have been just one time that I didn’t answer my partner as soon as I could. And the reason was that I was too upset at him to text him back. I didn’t want to write something angry just to regret it later. I'm a responder also, like you. I generally have my phone for my job but also it is not high pressure, and I don't have a lot of stress after hours either. My avoidant partner and my avoidant best friend (female) do not respond to personal communications if they are at work and it's busy. Of course I don't expect either of them to, we are in the habit of "send a text, get a reply when it happens" around work hours, just to touch base and wish a good day). But generally, a dismissive won't prioritize (personal) communication if they are stressed or busy. They go to single track mind. That's factory wiring at work, most haven't had the upgrade. I should be writing my post as past tense, in reality, as K takes good care of me around this and also, I've grown trust. If he is unable to respond it's typically because something very pressured or stressful was happening, and he calls me instead as soon as he can because by then he wants to talk to me too. Have you talked with him openly about this? I've shared most of my guts with K over the time we have been together and run into the same problems- they don't go without improvement in understanding and cooperation. I would say if there hasn't been progress for you with this and you still feel ignored, it needs some direct attention. If it's distressing. When I’m at work I just use my phone when I have a break or when it is very calm. So I don’t expect either that anyone would answer my texts if they are at work. It’s interesting this thing you say about DA’s won’t prioritize personal communication if they are stressed or busy with work because that is something I recognize in my partner. But it is not something I can’t relate to. I also have a stressful work and I’m pretty tired when I come home but I don’t bring my job to my house. It’s pretty easy for me to disconnect from my work problems. I still can talk about my work at my free time but it’s definitely not something that affects my peace of mind too much. Maybe he gets more productive at work by not prioritizing his free time while I’m much more productive if I take a break and actually worry about my job while I get paid to do so 😅. I consider myself pretty secure. Not like the perfect secure person as we can read at the litterateur, I’m certainly not that great 😅... I feel anxious, I feel avoidant... but it does not influence my life quality that much. I feel happy and satisfied with my life mostly of the time. My parents are two DA’s. I have write a thread about my childhood. Although they were pretty dismissive to each other they have been always supportive and warm with me and my siblings. I definitely have some insecure background but I haven’t experienced not feeling heard, loved and seen. Maybe I’m just spoiled and dating a DA make me feel those uncomfortable feelings more often than I ever feelt before in my other relationships. I have talked to him many times about that. It have been some progress. At the beginning he would feel trapped when I explained why it was important to me to get an answer. Now he finally believes that I don’t want to control him. He has learned that when I fight with him about “I hate feeling ignored” it is not me criticizing him, it’s me wanting to connect with him. Once he “ignored” me for so long and I didn’t chase. When he came back and explained himself: “I’m used that you don’t let me go. I wished I got in touch earlier, but it have gone so long time that I didn’t know what to say. I was hoping that you would get in touch because that’s what you always do but this time I knew if I didn’t start the conversation we wouldn’t see each other anymore and it’s not what I want because I really miss you.” I distance myself from him because I thought I was just bothering him but when he said those things I decided to believe him and I don’t really care or feel less value because I’m the one doing mostly of the communication work. He can’t promise he will always answer all of my texts. I can’t promise him I will always be comprehensive to him when he “ignores” me. I have learned how to deal with him ignoring me sometimes and he has learned how to deal with me being angry at him for ignoring me sometimes 😅. |
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